Read This Please

[flyhighordie]

its not just about pay guys what i am seeing is just as previously posted ALPA groups stabbing ALPA groups, that is the whole point, ALPA is a myth, its a place we pay dues to paper pushers, where paper pushers, people sending faxes make more money, have better work rules, can call out when their kid was crying all night with an ear infection, where we have to call it a sick day. when was the last time you needed the day off called crew scheduling and were able to be honest???? they can, we can't do anything but fly these machines and feed the monster till when??? i think about the commair guys, pilot error, at least that is what it seems like, but we don't know all the crap that pilled on those guys plate. what is up with these standup lines. i drink a pot of coffee to pull it through. why ???? on today's show this morning Matt Lauer's jaw dropped when he asked a guy about an airline schedule. he lost it when the guy told him 8 hrs flight 16 hour duty day. quote" you mean to tell me, a pilot will fly a plane coming in for landing on 16 hrs of duty?"" i hope from the bottom of my heart that people will think about what i wrote, some responded positively already, this can be done, ALPA will not be the answer. as i suggested we can start a site to promote unity and take it to the MAN. the 500 hour pilot will not be able to fill our jobs, an FO can't fly it by themselves. the comair thing will start a lot of talk, people don't know what we have to put up with. my brother's best friends are all journalists with tons of connections to NY times and such, they love to get a grip on something like this. IT CAN BE DONE, i have to believe it will, otherwise we will end up working 5 days on/ 2 days off, 14-16 hour duty days making peanuts. a panhandeler in NYC makes on averate of $30,000/yr its a fact. average colleger grad makes $31000/yr. most of us have degrees, tons of money of training and we let these monsters turn against each other. its not an overnight thing, i know, i am realistic, but a well crafted website to promote unity and collect good facts can get it rolling. i think about it all the time, what would happen if we all call out sick just for one day. no mail delivered, no people, no supplies nothing, it would be just like the web collapsing for one day. we are far more needed in society than we give ourselves credit for. think back when the ATC went on strike in the 80's. it sure got ronnie's attention. however we are not govt employees. you can't train a 777 captain in 2 months, hell i love the look on people's faces when they see a 22 yr old in the right seat and ask "are you old enough to fly this thing" spread the vibe we can do it. airline pilot national sick day. APNSD.com sounds good doesn't it???

 

[propilot1983]

Being a police officer used to be the same way...close knit group of men and women and would back any officer 100%. Now if an officer makes one bad decision, their brothers and sisters turn their backs. It's everywhere and I'm noticing the trend...what's changed? Our generation not having to deal with the hard knocks of life that our grandparents and parents had to deal with in the late 20's early 30's with the depression and how people had to stick together in order to survive? I don't know the answer. I know this is a different situation, but are kind of the same problem in two different industries. I support the idea though of getting things back to the way they used to be.

 

[jjlaw1]

I think the forst step is to realize it is us against them. Not pilot group against pilot group.

 

[flyhighordie]

JJLAW1 has it right its us against them.

Unions came about to prevent explotation of labor, ie women paid less wages, child labor etc. Unions are a term of the past, they don't do what they used to do. We need one union with ONE negotiator of contracts with ONE lawyer/accountant. its a lot simpler than we think. Equipment, seniority, avergage leg length, time away from base, etc all included in that formula for negotiations. and when those are not delivered we strike for all the pilots, National Sick Day for all of us, otherwise how do we expect to keep the guys from inking S@#t with no backup. heck like i said its not even a strike, i have a bank of about 150 hrs of sick time, don't most??

 

[~~~^~~~]

Flyhighordie:

You should set up a web site - similar to http://www.thepetitionsite.com where pilots could register their airline and their preference for representation. You could also do a little research and put up a page with information on how to decertify the current representatives and how to obtain representational status for an alternative union.

I am an ALPA supporter because I believe our best hope is to take ALPA back from the narrow interests that have hijacked our union. ALPA is the de facto national union - however - ALPA has made horrendous, intentional, mistakes which have harmed every pilot and every member in the United States.

I'm all for a grass roots movement to scare ALPA into being responsive to its members, or for getting rid of ALPA and forming a new union based on the principles ALPA used to stand for - for one - the elimination of alter ego competition through inclusive scope within the brand.

Good luck to you!

 

[~~~^~~~]

The across the board pay rates would never be allowed and neither would a national seniority list. The only way to save this business is to allow global companies to purchase the US airlines.

I like most of what you write, but we disagree on this. First, unions do have the right to establish a monopoly over labor - there are specific exemptions to the Sherman Anti Trust Act enabling unions to bargain collectively. Second, global money already owns US airlines. How much money do you think France, Italy, Germany, England, Canada and Brazil have out flying around on lease in the US? International Lease Finance, the World's largest aircraft owner may be the subsidiary of the American International Group, but did you know that AIG was founded as a Chinese Corporation and has a large part of its assets in Asia? Our Nation has thus far avoided foreign operational control of a US carrier - with good reason. For one, do you want to fly for Iran Air Express? Well, I don't think I want Iran Air, AfganaTran, or HezBlue operating over my house. And if we go to war, I hope Air France is willing to put its airplanes under US Service.

US Flag Carrier airlines have an important role in our economy, our security, and our sovereignty. I hope it stays that way.

The instability is an unfortunate part of a free and open market applying Adam Smith's invisible hand to the back sides of incompetent airline management. Some airlines are remarkably stable, Alaska, SouthWest, AirTran and dare I add to the list American, Continental and SkyWest. It can be done.

What we need is an effective national union and a way of getting all the Harvard consultants out of Delta, United and NorthWest.

 

[FlyingToIST]

The across the board pay rates would never be allowed and neither would a national seniority list. The only way to save this business is to allow global companies to purchase the US airlines.

This may sound like a good idea, but let's see what are the dangers of allowing this? What if, those companies said "we want to reduce the costs further and we want to have our pilots fly the planes".

I just got out of the software industry because IBMs, HPs, Accentures can bring their own people into the US and then complete the projects with those cheap bodies..

At least in aviation industry we don't have that.. yet...

 

[Flyingdutchman]

I say we ground our airplanes and strike on monday!!!

 

[jjlaw1]

I'm in.

 

[Flyingdutchman]

You get the ribs, Ill get us some beers! lets walk d*mn it!