Quit ALPA Now!

[CopilotDoug]

And not having ALPA will take care of the supposed problems that deregulation has caused?

Who said that?

 

[WayBack]

I don't understand why you have to make every post so personal with attacks on the poster rather than on their argument.

You need to learn what a personal attack is first of all, then you have to learn to pick and choose your battles.
We get it, you love ALPA. You see no flaws with them at all. But there is something wrong with you, seeing that you have to question/comment/attack or just quote everyone who doesn't see eye to eye with you about ALPA. It's as if you take the comments personally. There is a reason you feel the need to defend ALPA at all costs. Maybe because deep down inside you really know the flaws about the Association, but if you protect them on FI.com you make yourself feel better.
I think you need to talk to somebody about this. Being in denial can be unhealthy.

 

[CopilotDoug]

ALPA is powerless against bad management. This is the major misconception about ALPA. That ALPA could and should make all airlines the best and most profitable place to work at.

ALPA is responsible for these misconceptions. ALPA and Roger Cohen have alot in common: they thrive off the naievity of uneducated individuals

 

[WayBack]

ALPA is powerless against bad management.

Then what is the point of them? That's where they're needed the most, but even you admit, ALPA is powerless.

So why do you think ALPA is powerless with bad management, give me examples. Also give me your thoughts about ALPA with good management.

 

[Nevets]

Perhaps a more knowledgeable source could answer this. I figured Rez would know, but apparently he doesn't.

Do you know?

Who said that?

You said, "Deregulation has done its damage. In the mean time, ALPA pilots are stuck with Prater's empty pep talks." So I was just making the point that not having ALPA is not going to make deregulation go away.

You need to learn what a personal attack is first of all, then you have to learn to pick and choose your battles.
We get it, you love ALPA. You see no flaws with them at all. But there is something wrong with you, seeing that you have to question/comment/attack or just quote everyone who doesn't see eye to eye with you about ALPA. It's as if you take the comments personally. There is a reason you feel the need to defend ALPA at all costs. Maybe because deep down inside you really know the flaws about the Association, but if you protect them on FI.com you make yourself feel better.
I think you need to talk to somebody about this. Being in denial can be unhealthy.

Personal attacks or whatever else you want to call them. It doesn't matter to me what we call them but I just don't understand why you want to always make this personal. My points are not about me or what is wrong with me or my denial or that I take comments personally or the reason I feel the need to do anything or that it makes me feel better. Every other word you write is a personal attack or whatever you want to say it is.

ALPA is responsible for these misconceptions. ALPA and Roger Cohen have alot in common: they thrive off the naievity of uneducated individuals

I agree that ALPA is responsible for these misconceptions.

Then what is the point of them? That's where they're needed the most, but even you admit, ALPA is powerless.

So why do you think ALPA is powerless with bad management, give me examples. Also give me your thoughts about ALPA with good management.

The point is that ALPA cannot do the job of management. That is, run a successful business. If you have bad management that consistently makes bad decisions, as in JO, there is nothing ALPA can do about that. I was not talking about not being able to do anything about anything else.

 

[Tarzan]

Then what is the point of them? That's where they're needed the most, but even you admit, ALPA is powerless.

So why do you think ALPA is powerless with bad management, give me examples. Also give me your thoughts about ALPA with good management.

ALPA has limited power when it comes to negotiations with the company. The only way to force an issue is to strike and you have to have the blessing of the NMB to strike. Therefore, if the company and the union don't work together, you have a bunch of pissed of people that aren't helping the company achieve a profit to attract more investors. A good relationship gives us situations like Southwest. When the end goal is the same and both parties can look down the road, we both mutually benefit.

Having a union at that point is nice to enforce the current agreement and to provide legal back up against against a person in the company with a bone to pick, a bad report on a medical or a goof that lands you in hot water with the FAA.

You can bet your bottom dollar, CEO has a contract that is enforceable. Why shouldn't you? The side effect is that you get a very vocal minority that belief the company is there excursively for their benefit. The majority don't think in this mindset but the vocal dissidents that don't have a grasp on basic business give the rest a bad name. Rez is a great example. He means well but turns off lots of folks to the idea by coming out of left field with the Engel's philosophy.

 

[CopilotDoug]

Do you know?

I do now. It's appalling!

You said, "Deregulation has done its damage. In the mean time, ALPA pilots are stuck with Prater's empty pep talks." So I was just making the point that not having ALPA is not going to make deregulation go away.

And ALPA has been failing at changing it for the past 30 years. When is it time to try a new approach?

 

[WayBack]

Aw Crap! Thanks for bringing this gem from the dead! BRB, need to get some coffee and a shot of whiskey, so I can read through all this.

 

[Speedtape]

Then what is the point of them? That's where they're needed the most, but even you admit, ALPA is powerless.

If anyone has to explain the "point," you probably still wouldn't get it!
ALPA is not powerless, just not absolute in power--and what replacement institution would be? So if not ALPA, then what is your answer? No representation is not the answer--at least not anyone with a brain.

So why do you think ALPA is powerless with bad management, give me examples. Also give me your thoughts about ALPA with good management.

I can only speak from my experience:

Industry leading pay rates--protected by a CBA
Industry leading work rules--protected by a CBA
Cancellation pay--provided by a CBA
Min Day Guarantee--provided by a CBA
Grievance Process--provided by a CBA
Safer Work environment--provided by a CBA and years of Safety Advocacy
Job Protection--protected by a CBA
FAA Protection--protected by a CBA and "FREE" Legal if needed
Medical Protection--protected by a CBA and a "FREE" Aeromedical Group
Political Advocates for our Profession--Why? Because the Other Guys have them
A neat magazine--and sometimes informative
A Membership Card and Pin--I wear with pride
A Better Career Future than the alternative--Study the History--Many things you take for granted were achieved by the blood and sweat of others before you--Are you a taker?

Keep on Ranting--You don't have a clue. If you are not happy, pick another profession--We need relief, and you need a good dose of Reality!

 

[WayBack]

I
A neat magazine--and sometimes informative
A Membership Card and Pin--I wear with pride
A Better Career Future than the alternative--Study the History--Many things you take for granted were achieved by the blood and sweat of others before you--Are you a taker?

Keep on Ranting--You don't have a clue. If you are not happy, pick another profession--We need relief, and you need a good dose of Reality!

Please tell me you're kidding about these last items!?

I was unhappy and I picked a new job. I just moved across the train tracks to the 91/135 side. You should try it! Beats living in the Shanty Town of the 121 world. Man I love running water! I took a bath last night, oh no, not just a regular ole bath. But a BUBBLE BATH!!!! Smell so clean!