Question Regarding NJA sell-off trips

[gret]

Really? EVER? REALLY? Wow you are such a fool.

You have just shown that your blind hatred has blocked any logic you may have.

Now, if you want to put some money where your mouth is about NetJets ever hiring again, let me know. Gonna guess you don't have the balls.

Easy kemosabe...with everything that was written, this is what you picked up on?

I don't think I'm the Lone Ranger with this thought. If it happens...it happens...the odds are just very small at this juncture.

 

[CE750Driver]

Oh, I agree with you on the sell offs. Other charters picking up flights during a improbable strike, does not a scab make.

Yeah, the other part jumped out. We have more old guys than a retirement home. Hiring is inevitable within 5 years or so.

 

[be99fr8dog]

We have more old guys than a retirement home. Hiring is inevitable within 5 years or so.

We have fewer than 300 pilots over 60, less than 100 over 65. In the next 5 years I could see 150-200 guys leave, to get all 300 probably closer to 10 years.

These 300 pilots would cover our overstaffing, however recalls are probably 10+ unless this company comes up with a growth plan instead of a replacement plan.

 

[X-rated]

I would disagree with that. IF there were a strike, it would all be struck work in my book. .

So, when the passenger who can't ride on NJ is forced to buy a ticket on UA or AA, the pilots who fly him are scabs in your estimation? That's just silly.

How about an owner like NJAowner who owns shares at multiple companies. Suppose he calls up NJA and cant get a flight when he wants to go because of a strike. You are saying if he then calls FLEX where he owns a share, the Flex pilots would be considered scabs for flying one of their owners? It sounds like you think your company owns the customer which is ridiculous. It amazes me how so many union members know so little about such things. Glass had it exactly right.

 

[OPECJet]

So, when the passenger who can't ride on NJ is forced to buy a ticket on UA or AA, the pilots who fly him are scabs in your estimation? That's just silly.

How about an owner like NJAowner who owns shares at multiple companies. Suppose he calls up NJA and cant get a flight when he wants to go because of a strike. You are saying if he then calls FLEX where he owns a share, the Flex pilots would be considered scabs for flying one of their owners? It sounds like you think your company owns the customer which is ridiculous. It amazes me how so many union members know so little about such things. Glass had it exactly right.

Negative. If an owner is flying on his NJA account during an NJA strike, the crew operating the aircraft would be flying struck work in my opinion. If an owner has multiple accounts at different companies and uses his Flexjet / Shares/ Flops account, that flight would not be struck work as NJA is not receiving any revenue from the flight.

My opinion matters not however. We are not striking. We are not in Section Six negotiations, and there is no threat of a strike. Should that ever come to pass, NJASAP will define struck work for the particular case, just as every other striking pilot group has done.

 

[G4dude]

Really? EVER? REALLY? Wow you are such a fool.

You have just shown that your blind hatred has blocked any logic you may have.

Now, if you want to put some money where your mouth is about NetJets ever hiring again, let me know. Gonna guess you don't have the balls.

Just curious, who or what does gret hate?

 

[agrrlpilot]

The sell-offs eventually help us out because of the language in the contract. The pilots I have a problem with are the ones who scramble to pick up all the extended days they can find. There is no limiting language for that, as I understand, like the language for sell-offs. Those extended-day guys are the ones who don't help the cause.

 

[glasspilot]

Negative. If an owner is flying on his NJA account during an NJA strike, the crew operating the aircraft would be flying struck work in my opinion.

And that would be determined how?

If an owner has multiple accounts at different companies and uses his Flexjet / Shares/ Flops account, that flight would not be struck work as NJA is not receiving any revenue from the flight.

So the passengers wealth determines if the pilot is a scab? Those who can afford multiple cards get non-scab pilots?

 

[imacdog]

If that's how you want to view it then yes. In the event of a strike (of course all hypothetical etc as there is no chance of one right now), the flying that is charged against an owner's NJA account would be considered struck work. If an NJA owner/cardholder travels via means other than their NJA account, then that is not struck work (they are free to fly with whomever they wish).

 

[glasspilot]

So me and my buddy are owners at NetJets. My buddy is really rich and has shares at NetJets and also CitationAir. NetJets goes on strike and we both want to fly at the same time from PWK.

NetJets calls me a charter from Bobs BigWing Charter Co. Those pilots are scabs. My buddy calls CitationAir and they have to charter because for some reason they are REALLY busy now...go figure. Anyway, CitationAir is forced to charter and wouldn't you know, they use Bobs BigWing Charter Co. too.

So two NetJet owners get a ride from the same company yet one of them is struck work? The unfortunate "scab pilots" are scabs because Jannet in the home office happened to assign them to my flight instead of my buddies? Really? That's how it works?

How are those two guys supposed to know they are flying your struck work?

 

[say again]

Well said glasspilot!! Amazed at the ignorance on this board sometimes.

 

[ultrarunner]

At the end of the day, the union defines 'struck work'. But in the Frac environment, in this 'hypothetical exercise', there would be very little, to no consequences.

In the airline days, if you scabbed and flew work that was being struck, you found your name on the scab-list. This resulted, and to a lesser extent, still results in a 121 pilot's ability to JS.

The airline union's definition of struck work also prevented other airlines from adding flights to cover segments of the other airlines.

Very little to any of this would ever come into play in the event a strike would occur at the Frac level. Stuck work can be defined with such a broad brush.

If I get a call to take John Doe from A to B, and I choose to do that trip, I have absolutely NO obligation whatsoever to inquire about details beyond the requirements that our company has with respect to flying an "off-the-street-charter". None. Nor is there any expectation.

HNW individuals run very little risk in being stranded. Ask NJAOwner. He'll tell ya. He will dust off his share at another outfit, or have his assistant call one of his 'approved charter companies'. Done, he's in the air. And 'ain't loosing any sleep.

This is all an academic conversation anyway. Consolidation isn't done, right-sizing isn't done, furloughs are not done, and none of that has the first thing to do with a strike!

 

[imacdog]

Well said glasspilot!! Amazed at the ignorance on this board sometimes.

I'm not sure why you feel this is "ignorance". If a carrier's pilots are on strike, then passengers being flown around by that carrier (whether on the same airframe or through a contracted flight) are being flown on struck work.

 

[gret]

I'm not sure why you feel this is "ignorance". If a carrier's pilots are on strike, then passengers being flown around by that carrier (whether on the same airframe or through a contracted flight) are being flown on struck work.

I'm sick...this it outright garbage and wishful thinking on your part. Just who do you think is going to support you?

Just stop this nonsense...please?

 

[imacdog]

No wishful thinking, etc. There's no threat of a strike by any carrier now and I don't hold malice toward anyone. Just an emotionless academic discussion and while we may have to agree to disagree, I'm certainly not licking my chops hoping to label anyone a scab. This topic was discussed over and over back in 2005 as well (though there was certainly more emotion back then for obvious reasons).