Problem - JetBlue VS. AirTran

[Dr. B]

Man I envy you.

Kind of off subject (sorry), but does Airtran really require 500 of 121 PIC as posted on their website? Did you have that requirement met?

Also, says that internal referrals are heavily weighed. Don't know a single pilot at Airtran, many at others but not there. What is your take on that as wel.

Good Luck.

 

[Blue Dude]

Congrats Catfish...

You say that JetBlue gave you a conditional letter of employment.

Are they still hiring into the A320?

What aircraft did they say you would get?

If it is the EMB-190, then you might want to consider AirTran instead.

1. The 717 pays better than a JB EMB-190.
2. The upgrade time is about 2.5 years....shorter if you want to upgrade to the 737.
3. The 717 is a full size aircraft...the EMB is an RJ.
4. You stated your commute to ATL would be easier than JFK.
5. There is a good chance that MCO will become their next base.
6. There are no 5 year employment contracts to sign at AirTran.
7. AirTran pilots and F/A's are unionized.

I don't work for AirTran, so all of this info comes to me via friends who work there now. They may not be as flashy as JetBlue, but they are on solid financial footing. The choice is ultimately yours. Either carrier would be great. It's basically just a matter of what works best for you logistically and personally.

Just in the interest of factual accuracy, I'll respond to this one.

JetBlue won't be hiring into the 190 until at least this time next year. The plane hasn't been built yet.

1. Not necessarily true but very possible. The 190 scale hasn't been determined yet. It's academic at the moment anyway since all JetBlue pilots are A320 pilots until sometime next year.

2. Upgrade at JetBlue is less than 2 years. It will shrink further when the 190's start arriving.

3. Not going there again. The 717 and 190 are roughly the same size, etc. and I'm burned out on the "what is an RJ" debate.

4. Tossup. Either would involve a drive to MCO to catch a flight to the hub. Both airlines offer 7 or more flights a day to the hub. JB does have more jumpseats though...

5. Good chance MCO will be JB's next base too. With the training center opening there next year, it's a virtual certainty at some point.

6. You make it sound like you have to sign a five-yr training contract or you're locked into an exclusive service contract or something. Not true. It's five years because a contract has to have *some* duration, but you can leave anytime you like with no financial penalty. A few pilots have left and come back (at the bottom, of course, just like anywhere else).

7. Not necessarily a selling point for some people. In-house unions can be useful, but their presence or absense doesn't say much about actual quality of life. The QOL at JetBlue is very good. Since JB *isn't* unionized, that says something about how most pilots feel about their circumstances.

Hope this helps.

Congrats, Catfish. I don't think you can go wrong either way. Hope to see you on line!

 

[flx757]

I was unaware that they had a profit sharing program. Airtran doesn't, right? I thought the pay was better at AirTran after about the 7-8 year mark, but that may put JB ahead. Anyone?


Still thinkin'.......

JB doesn't have a "B" plan, and AirTran does (10.5% of gross income) , so that should compensate somewhat for AirTran not having a profit sharing plan. I hear that profit sharing is one of the things being tossed around for the next contract (the current one is ammendable next Apr), but what do you give up to get it?

You have to do what makes you happy today. While looking 5-10-15 years down the road is probably prudent, there is no way anyone can forecast the nature of this industry's future (or any company in it), and it is likely that neither of these companies will remotely resmeble what they are today in 15 years...so base your decision on what would make you happiest NOW.

 

[CatfishVT9]

Blue dude, Flx,

Thanks for the comments.

Dr. B,

Did you say something? I was staring at your avitar........

Oh yeah, internals recs. When I interviewed, there was no one without a rec letter. Don't give up though, you'd be surprised how you can find someone in you network of friends and family. I knew no one when I first started pursuing this a year and a half ago, but I kept asking friends and family if they knew anyone at AirTran. Eventually, I found a family friend who knew the CEO very well. I was stunned to find that out. If you keep looking, you'll eventually find a contact. And it doesn't have to be a pilot either.

Catfish

 

[IB6 UB9]

Been here for over a year now...should upgrade around Xmas. Also have 3 close friends at Big A. You can't really go wrong either way (my opinion of course) and who really knows anyway. One of these two airlines could be gone in 5 years! (I doubt it though...) Anyway, whichever one you choose don't do that hindsight thing, just have no regrets. I don't work at Airtran, I work at JB, so I have a one-sided view, but I can offer that this is not my first airline by far (meaning I have something to compare it to) and QOL is very good here. If you can't be happy here flying airplanes I suggest getting out of the industry! Good luck.

 

[jetblue320]

So here's the problem. I thought for sure my mind was made up. That's easy when there's only one firm offer. But, this morning I got a call from JetBlue with a conditional offer to start with them on 2 June!

Congrats Catfish. But I am curious, what's a "conditional" offer? Never heard of that.

I won't go into any long winded debate about the two companies because I am biased, of course. They both offer great futures (depending on who you ask). You also mentioned something about a B737 rating so you could go to SWA? Did I misread something?

C ya

 

[Pura Vida]

Blue Dude...

What I was referring to is that JB requires a pilot to sign a 5 year employment contract. At the end of that 5 years the company is free to terminate you without cause.

Is that not how it's written? I'm not saying that JB would do that, but from what I've been told, it is in there. Kind of makes you wonder what would happen to pilots who maybe wanted to explore union affiliation at some point or who maybe had a run in with management during that 5 year period.

By the way...does JB still have that 1000 PIC turbine requirement?

 

[XGmaninGA]

Catfish,

I have been at AT for three years and am on the verge of upgrade. I can only tell you that I have been happy here. You can have your choice of the new Ramp Vacuums...errr I mean the 737s, or the Electric Jet (717). As far as new bases, who knows? We will at some point get too big for current digs in ATL. But who knows where. When you see it on the ramp with a big "A" painted on it, you can believe it!

Good luck, whatever your choice. If you're in ATL, I'll be glad to buy you a frosty beverage to cool off the hot summer.

 

[On Your Six]

Both are great choices - it's a toss up... I suppose you could now look at the details - for example you could look at it in terms of aircraft comfort - I'd say the A320 has a more comfortable flight deck than the 737-700 on long haul flights. You could look at domicile - you are already doing that - QOL will always be important. Those are just a few of many factors. Both airlines will do extremely well and continue to expand.

If I had the choice, I would choose Jet Blue - but just barely.... Let us know which you choose and why - AND NEVER LOOK BACK!!!!!

P.S. The EMB-190 is, in fact, flying and has already completed a number of test flights in Brazil.

 

[CatfishVT9]

The "conditional" offer is because they haven't completed the background check. They said that if it came back clean, it's no longer conditional. If not, the offer is rescinded.

I must not have been clear on the 737 discussion. What I meant was that I would not choose that route in order to get a 737 type for SWA. I'm looking for a destination, so where I start, I plan to stay.