Preboarding Jumpseaters on SWA

[enigma]

That's what all airlines want and have dictated for years. Why is it pilots feel they have the right to ride for free? It's a privilege and in the fight for every single paying customer it's proper for free riding jumpseaters to get the worst seat, in the back, next to the toilet, getting on last, getting off last, checking your bag if you have to, staying out of the way of the FAs, be happy you have it, and say thank you to the captain when you leave.

Otherwise, pay for a ticket.

Pilots don't feel that they have the right to ride for free. Pilots KNOW, that as a part of negotiated agreements with management and between differing airlines union groups, they have jumpseat privileges. You're showing your lack of industry knowledge here my friend. I agree that the jumpseat isn't a guarantee, and I'll certainly agree that paying customers get dibs on the best seats, period. But you need to get off of your high horse and have a little empathy for the thousands of your fellow pilots who commute. BTW, most don't commute because of a desire to live out of base, most commute because they've been based in ten different places, with five different airlines, in the last eleven years. You were good enough to get on at SWA, congrats. Others were good enought to get hired by other first rate carriers but now find themselves "underemployed" and commuting to another new base, etc. Please don't assume that jumpseaters are just cheap freeloaders out to take advantage of your company.

regards,
engima

 

[Lear70]

I have been emailing the SWA Jumpseat coordinator about our current policy. He said OAL jumpseaters board last as in DEAD last after all passengers. I was shocked. Maybe we can get this changed. I would just wait and see what the ops agent does.

That's why I simply board the aircraft as soon as preboarding looks like it's trickling to an end. Whether the gate agent has told me to or not.

I've spent the last 7 years in command of a 121 aircraft and I really don't like last-minute jumpseaters who show up 5 minute before we're supposed to be closing the door. I'm busy, yet the FOM and FAR's require me to check your paperwork - the gate agent is, 9 times out of 10, NOT trained enough to recognize which licenses and medicals are bogus or not.

I introduce myself to the crew, stow my gear, then stay the heck out of the way on the jetbridge or, more often than not, chatting with the crew until most if not all the pax are on board and seated, then take my seat as the flight crew starts to get busy in the last couple minutes. Makes things MUCH easier.

DH2WN, you DO know that you come off as a real tool, don't you? Guess the Southwest interview process isn't as seamless as we thought. You must be SOME kind of pilot if you can tell someone who works for a DIFFERENT AIRLINE how to interpret THEIR manuals.

And yes, there are two airlines I can think of right off-hand who check your paperwork at the counter and DON'T EXPECT you to check in with the Captain. It's in their manuals that way for OFF-LINE jumpseaters.

You also ASSume that EVERY airline gives a thorough jumpseat briefing during indoc - all 3 of my 121 carriers I've worked for never said jack crap. We had to pull the military guys and people straight out of 135 or 91 work and teach them the ropes before they went out and pissed off some other airlines.

Don't tell the world how EVERYTHING is, the reality is you only truly know your small corner of it.

/rant

 

[SDF2BUF2MCO]

The silver lining of sitting in the back :

It makes it easier for the FA's to keep your coffee cup filled
Most of the FA's are socialable
If the plane isn't packed, most PAX gravitate to the front so you can have your peace and quiet and not feel squeezed

 

[skiandsurf]

I'm busy, yet the FOM and FAR's require me to check your paperwork - the gate agent is, 9 times out of 10, NOT trained enough to recognize which licenses and medicals are bogus or not.

And what kind of training do you have to recognize a bogus license? In all of my years, I dont recall any training on this.

 

[TR4A]

Do you commute?

No response.

I guess that means no and your new to the airline industry.

 

[DH2WN]

Pilots don't feel that they have the right to ride for free. Pilots KNOW, that as a part of negotiated agreements with management and between differing airlines union groups, they have jumpseat privileges. You're showing your lack of industry knowledge here my friend. I agree that the jumpseat isn't a guarantee, and I'll certainly agree that paying customers get dibs on the best seats, period. But you need to get off of your high horse and have a little empathy for the thousands of your fellow pilots who commute. BTW, most don't commute because of a desire to live out of base, most commute because they've been based in ten different places, with five different airlines, in the last eleven years. You were good enough to get on at SWA, congrats. Others were good enought to get hired by other first rate carriers but now find themselves "underemployed" and commuting to another new base, etc. Please don't assume that jumpseaters are just cheap freeloaders out to take advantage of your company.
regards,
engima

Your assumptions are wrong. It's a free ticket given by the generosity of the company who owns the aircraft. You don't deserve it by right of some higher authority.

Commuting or vacationing doesn't matter. Don't take the coveted seats and stay out of the way. Period.

 

[Lear70]

And what kind of training do you have to recognize a bogus license? In all of my years, I dont recall any training on this.

Thank you for making my point.

Gate agents aren't given ANY training on knowing the difference between the real thing, a fake, or just someone with a dispatcher's license or an AGI/IGI certificate - they all look the same unless you read them.

As a commercial pilot, you've obtained at least 2 or 3 of the things if not an even dozen and can recognize when some 135 newbie who really shouldn't be jumpseating is trying to hop around the system whereas a gate agent normally wouldn't. Yes, I've seen them try.

The Captain should ALWAYS be in direct control of the jumpseat. Having a gate agent tell you not to check in with the Captain is just plain wrong.

Your assumptions are wrong. It's a free ticket given by the generosity of the company who owns the aircraft. You don't deserve it by right of some higher authority.

Commuting or vacationing doesn't matter. Don't take the coveted seats and stay out of the way. Period.

You're avoiding the question of whether you commute or not.

You've also neglected to notice that many companies haven't given the jumpseat out of any "generosity", rather it's a NEGOTIATED BENEFIT that some pilot groups have in their contract because their company didn't WANT to give jumpseat agreements. In some cases, pilots have been known to give concessions in one area to guarantee jumpseat rights. Don't argue "company generosity"; your company may be the only one that really fits that mold to be completely truthful about it.

You've also carefully side-stepped the entire point you were arguing against earlier. As an off-line jumpseater who may or may not take Southwest on a regular basis, it's not fair to ASSume that everyone knows your policies and procedures.

They DO vary from airline to airline in case you haven't noticed.

The original point made a page or two back was that, if Southwest is going to have a policy for handling jumpseaters that's different than standard (especially when the seats are unassigned), then let them publish it in writing on the back of the jumpseat form and ask the jumpseater to read it. ASSuming we somehow automatically know the policy is assinine.

 

[SWA GUY]

I'll make this really simple:

Dear Jumpseater:

When you come to a WN jet and need a ride, please board the jet with the operations agent (read pre-board).

Don't sit in an emergency exit row. (Company policy)

Sit anywhere you want to. There is NO policy to sit towards the back of the jet. If there were a policy, it'd be in the book.

Please take us up on our open invitation for a free ride.

Please have a good time when you ride with us.

Please feel free to ask us to help you with any connection information, change the A/C temperature, refill your drink, get you more snacks, etc.

Please treat me the same way when I need a ride.

If you come across a Kernal that gives you a bad time about some rediculous BS, please report his/her ass to our jumpseat committee chairman.

Have a nice day!

 

[JP4user]

Dear Jumpseater:


Don't sit in an emergency exit row. (Company policy)

!

Why is this a policy? Just curious since it seems it would be better to have a qualified pilot or airline personnel in that row.

 

[skiandsurf]

Thank you for making my point.


As a commercial pilot, you've obtained at least 2 or 3 of the things if not an even dozen and can recognize when some 135 newbie who really shouldn't be jumpseating is trying to hop around the system whereas a gate agent normally wouldn't. Yes, I've seen them try.

I had a guy try to jumpseat that had a license that looked like a credit card. It was green and had two other guys pictures on it. I asked my FO if he had ever seen anything like this and he said "no". We showed him what a "real" license looked like.....just paper with no pictures. I was going to call the airport police, but the "jumpseater" left. Has anyone else ran into this guy with this "bogus" license.

 

[SWA GUY]

Why is this a policy? Just curious since it seems it would be better to have a qualified pilot or airline personnel in that row.

We had a lot of people that would preboard due to a "condition" that required them to do so, and they would go take the emergency exit row seats. Those seats have more legroom, so generally people would rather have those seats.

The non preboarding customers complained loudly enough so that management decided make this policy.

Incidentally, due to the liberal's lobbying efforts while writing ADA (American's with Disabilities Act) the gate agents/ops. agents cannot even ASK what the condition that requires them to preboard is. Yes, it's against the law to ask....ya gotta love them liberals. So much for your 1st Amendment rights.

 

[JP4user]

We had a lot of people that would preboard due to a "condition" that required them to do so, and they would go take the emergency exit row seats. Those seats have more legroom, so generally people would rather have those seats.

The non preboarding customers complained loudly enough so that management decided make this policy.

Incidentally, due to the liberal's lobbying efforts while writing ADA (American's with Disabilities Act) the gate agents/ops. agents cannot even ASK what the condition that requires them to preboard is. Yes, it's against the law to ask....ya gotta love them liberals. So much for your 1st Amendment rights.

It figures the slimy lawyers would be involved in some way shape or form. Thanks for the answer.

By the way, I had to reposition on you guys the other day (first time using or ever flown SWA). After some of the miserable experiences on Delta lately we are not booking on them any longer and using SWA and CAL exclusively.

 

[TR4A]

I had a guy try to jumpseat that had a license that looked like a credit card. It was green and had two other guys pictures on it. I asked my FO if he had ever seen anything like this and he said "no". We showed him what a "real" license looked like.....just paper with no pictures. I was going to call the airport police, but the "jumpseater" left. Has anyone else ran into this guy with this "bogus" license.

It wasn't one of the new licenses with a picture of Wilbur and Orville was it?

 

[blingair]

Thanks to all the Southwest Captains, First Officers, Flight Attendants and CSA's for the first class treatment I've received over the years. Everyone has bent over backwards for a perfect stranger looking for a ride to/from work. Always a class act and thanks again.

 

[jhill]

I was jumpseating the other day and was preboarded. After taking the exit row seat a/c right( lots of leg room), flight attendant told me I could not sit there since I preboarded. I acknowledged her and took another seat, no problem. Just curious though, I know the briefing card does reiterate what she said but that was the first time I was asked to move in 9 yrs of commuting. Is this just an isolated request or are they enforcing this rule? Seems they would like to have crewmembers in the emergency exit row. Any thoughts?

Only an a$$ like yourself would ask. Do what you are told when taking a free ride. Pre-boarding is a privilege we are glad to have. Shut-up and do what the fa's ask or don't ask to ride