Please help a fellow union brother not SCAB.

[Diesel]

I'd picket with you if I was in the area. Wish you all best of luck.

Thanks we need all the support we can get.

 

[realityman]

I disagree. The company has to negotiate with us, and the clock is running out for them.

This is where your inexperience with unions and how negotiations work really shows.

In a nutshell, you are wrong on this. Your continual reliance on this same belief over and over and over in spite of being told otherwise by people who do have the experience is either willful ignorance on your part or you're just an optimist to a fault.

They do not HAVE to negotiate with us. Look up "surface bargaining". Then look at the history of our management's "negotiations" with our own F/A's as well as our own group and maybe it'll become more clear for you.

They will only negotiate with us seriously when they have INCENTIVE to do so. And no, a negotiating committee sitting across the table with scowls on their faces, arms crossed, demands made, spittal flying, and "vigorously negotiating" as you keep suggesting, is not the incentive that will get anything done. Try asking any of the airline folks here who have been through this just how well "vigorously negotiating" (by the way, would you mind explaining to me exactly what that means to you and how our negotiators should carry that out? I honestly am not sure what that is.) without leverage from the membership works.

Do you WANT to strike? If not, there are ways to get what we want without striking, but it would require the participation of almost everyone. Agree or disagree, a HUGE turnout at the pickets is great leverage. Do the social media tweets your union asks you to. Fly the FAR's, CBA, AFM, FOM, AOM and other controlling documents to the letter. Trust me, following ALL the regs and policies exactly as you're supposed to does not work in the company's favor, and is perfectly legal. If everyone would do this, and I do mean EVERYONE, we would not need a strike AND this would be done quickly.

Instead what we actually get is a bunch of people pontificating about what is "right" and "wrong" in negotiations, how they'll only do things they agree with, or how they think simply paying dues will get it done, or how they "wish" it would go, or it really comes down to the negotiating committee, or how scabs help keep the company afloat during a strike (are you sh****ng me with that one?!). All very intellectual and philosophical. And all guaranteed to drag negotiations out for a very long time, and even work against a positive outcome for the union.

Stop over thinking it. Collectively we aren't the MENSA society. It's a union. If we are to be a SUCCESSFUL union then we need (figurative) baseball bats, not philosophy major textbooks. If you are ever brought in for discipline, do you want a union steward who acts buddy-buddy with the company and who wants meaningful dialogue to reach an amicable conclusion where you get your "fair" comeuppance, or do you want a pit bull with you who has only ONE goal in mind: to keep you out of the frying pan entirely and who will tell the company to go f*** themselves in no uncertain terms if necessary, and who will use every means at his disposal to protect you, even if it means things aren't "amicable" or "reasonable" between the union and company? How do you want your dues used? Why should it be any other way in negotiations?

 

[ghostrider64]

What you say has a lot of merit. I mainly wish unions could operate without intimidation of some of its members.

We could if you and your ilk would get in line immediately when the call to so is made, however your "procrastination/get er done" attitude delays the process for years. YOU are the reason this process will be PROLONGED. Not intimidation, just a simple fact that you don't seem to comprehend.

 

[Sky Captain]

What you say is reasonable. I just wish unions could do their thing without intimidating those members who disagree sometimes with the leadership.

I wish COMPANIES would do the same. Intimidations from management over maintenance issues, fatigue policy, etc. Now we hear FlexJet has FIRED 2 pilots for just try to organize a democratic vote by the pilots to see IF they want to join the a Teamsters or not. What is more intimidating than that?

 

[Flopgut]

I wish COMPANIES would do the same. Intimidations from management over maintenance issues, fatigue policy, etc. Now we hear FlexJet has FIRED 2 pilots for just try to organize a democratic vote by the pilots to see IF they want to join the a Teamsters or not. What is more intimidating than that?

This^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

G4dude: when the Union frustrates you, keep this in mind

 

[Crobar]

Great on you guys for trying to convert G4wanttobedude. I tried over and over to make my older brother understand Unions are for the working man... but he was enlisted in air force for 26 years made it up to E8 and he refuses to see that Unions are here to protect the worker. He blocks out everything.. all he sees is managements side.

Maybe he will understand when he scabs and is treated like trash, spit on for the rest of his life. I wish everyone knew who all the scabs were.. that needs to be known. I flew with a scab a few times.. without knowing he was an Eastern scab.. and IOE instructor.. what a POS.

 

[Flycatcher99]

On an completely unrelated-to-Netjets topic, I suspect that I'm not the only member of this board who finds it wildly hilarious that the irony of your comment about "decid[ing] that you'd rather quit" is somehow lost on you, PCL.

Another "mission accomplished"? :blush:

Bubba

I'll second this post.

 

[SharkRider]

We used to have a couple of scabs on our seniority list, one of which went to NJA just in time to get furloughed

 

[ghostrider64]

We used to have a couple of scabs on our seniority list, one of which went to NJA just in time to get furloughed

Sadly our union doesn't have a voice at the interview/hiring table.

 

[G4dude]

Sadly our union doesn't have a voice at the interview/hiring table.

God forbid. What a joke, having a union, which invested NOTHING in the company, having input regarding who gets hired.