Pinnacle pilots can't bid Saab Captain...

[Smarta$$]

ALPA could have enforced it's merger policy and rejected Bloch's decision as written. The decision violates several stipulations and would not stand up in court, if it does then ALPA has a "Failure to Represent" problem.

But ALPA's goals are:

1. Collect Dues (it is a business after all)
2. Try to keep peace between MECs so it can achieve #1

How do they reject a binding and final decision?

ALPA is a resource. They do not dictate much at all onto the autonomous pilot groups. If national would have dictated DOH onto the pinnacle pilots, they would have screamed bloody murder. They would have complained about the heavy hand of ALPA dictating onto them a policy.

Yet they complain now that it didn't go THEIR way, and that ALPA should have mandated a policy that would have been better for them.

Get real. Pilots don't want policies dictated onto them. Yet when THEIR OWN autonomous group dick$ something up royally, they complain that national didn't fix it for them.

This merger was doomed for pinnacle pilots the moment they forced this to go to binding arbitration by refusing to agree to a reasonable integration through mutual negotiations.

Pinnacle pilots dicked it up, and now bitch that ALPA didn't fix it for them. Yet these are the same guys that would complain if ALPA had forced an integration policy upon them.

Sad.

 

[jynxyjericho]

How do they reject a binding and final decision?

ALPA is a resource. They do not dictate much at all onto the autonomous pilot groups. If national would have dictated DOH onto the pinnacle pilots, they would have screamed bloody murder. They would have complained about the heavy hand of ALPA dictating onto them a policy.

Yet they complain now that it didn't go THEIR way, and that ALPA should have mandated a policy that would have been better for them.

Get real. Pilots don't want policies dictated onto them. Yet when THEIR OWN autonomous group dick$ something up royally, they complain that national didn't fix it for them.

This merger was doomed for pinnacle pilots the moment they forced this to go to binding arbitration by refusing to agree to a reasonable integration through mutual negotiations.

Pinnacle pilots dicked it up, and now bitch that ALPA didn't fix it for them. Yet these are the same guys that would complain if ALPA had forced an integration policy upon them.

Sad.

... Pretty much on point.

 

[bri5150]

And I think the MEM Pinnacle guys are talking with their votes considering there were more votes for the Mesaba reps in MEM than there are Mesaba pilots.

 

[higney85]

And I think the MEM Pinnacle guys are talking with their votes considering there were more votes for the Mesaba reps in MEM than there are Mesaba pilots.

Mesaba added the LGA base to their MEM council for the votes. Our MEM base is bigger than XJ's strictly MEM base. Good political move.

 

[bri5150]

Honestly, I am ready to move on. They are all Pinnacle reps now. Let's do this.

 

[higney85]

Honestly, I am ready to move on. They are all Pinnacle reps now. Let's do this.

I'm game. Let's first ask to get an LOA not requiring a secondary to every displacement. This is about to get ugly when the more senior bases close the saab operation.

 

[WMUSIGPI]

I'm game. Let's first ask to get an LOA not requiring a secondary to every displacement. This is about to get ugly when the more senior bases close the saab operation.

No thanks, I am sick of being at the bottom of the list with now 600 additional people able to keep me there... I'm ready to go back to a prop for a few months.

 

[higney85]

No thanks, I am sick of being at the bottom of the list with now 600 additional people able to keep me there... I'm ready to go back to a prop for a few months.

You won't even be able to get to a prop base before it's closed.

 

[DoinTime]

Mesaba added the LGA base to their MEM council for the votes. Our MEM base is bigger than XJ's strictly MEM base. Good political move.

Not really a good move at all. Had they left LGA with their DTW council, they Would have won DTW and its massive pilot population. Now, because the Mesaba MEC focused their efforts on MEM, they have succeeded in capturing a much smaller piece of the pie than what they could have had.

Not to mention the "new" MEM CA rep is vacating MEM on this recent award. Who is going to run next? The next election will be minus MEM/LGA SF34 pilots contributing to the vote.

 

[Flyer1015]

Yet when THEIR OWN autonomous group dick$ something up royally, they complain that national didn't fix it for them.

This merger was doomed for pinnacle pilots the moment they forced this to go to binding arbitration by refusing to agree to a reasonable integration through mutual negotiations.

Pinnacle pilots dicked it up,

Another thing I hate is you can never get the truth. You say this, and I don't doubt you. But if you ask the 9E committee, I'm sure you'll hear the complete opposite. In a situation like this, where's the truth? Where's the proof? Obviously, someone d*cked up. It'd be nice to know who was the behind it.

 

[Flyer1015]

Look at the most junior Mesaba pilot awarded a DTW-200 Captain position, initials KW a MEM Saab FO hired in May 2007?! Our guys just got downgraded from the -200 that were hired in March 2007. What a major ****-up!

 

[DoinTime]

This merger was doomed for pinnacle pilots the moment they forced this to go to binding arbitration by refusing to agree to a reasonable integration through mutual negotiations.

Are you suggesting that all three parties were capable of agreeing to a "reasonable" integration? Just what was reasonable?

The negotiation phase of the SLI was a joke and at least two of the three parties proved they had no intention of ever moving off their most desired outcomes. The process should have just gone straight to arbitration.

 

[DoinTime]

Look at the most junior Mesaba pilot awarded a DTW-200 Captain position, initials KW a MEM Saab FO hired in May 2007?! Our guys just got downgraded from the -200 that were hired in March 2007. What a major ****-up!

I'm guessing that the Saab FO was senior to the displaced 9E CA (hire dates and actual position held are irrelevant in the SLI in case you hadn't heard)?

 

[DoinTime]

Another thing I hate is you can never get the truth. You say this, and I don't doubt you. But if you ask the 9E committee, I'm sure you'll hear the complete opposite. In a situation like this, where's the truth? Where's the proof? Obviously, someone d*cked up. It'd be nice to know who was the behind it.

So you are saying that you give equal credibility to anonymous Internet message board posters as you do to official sources? Tell me you are joking?

Nobody dicked up, the process is engineered to make sure everyone feels like they got screwed. Judging from the sentiment from PCL and XJ pilots, the process worked as designed. Those who think someone screwed them over on purpose or through incompetence are only trying to place blame. The only blame lies with Trenary for putting us all on this path to start with.

 

[CptMurf]

Are you suggesting that all three parties were capable of agreeing to a "reasonable" integration? Just what was reasonable?

The negotiation phase of the SLI was a joke and at least two of the three parties proved they had no intention of ever moving off their most desired outcomes. The process should have just gone straight to arbitration.

I believe they could have come to a deal, and a better one than our current situation. It would have been a hard negotiation, no doubt. But, the end result most likely would have been a more fair method to individuals across the ISL, instead of groups of pilots on each premerger list having huge gains and losses to try to make it seem fair for the premerger group as a whole. The hard line negotiator stances don't bother me. The attitude of one negotiating committee to just force it to arbitration does. Total lack of responsibility to the pilots they represent. I've even heard that this committee proposed a cruise ship as a meeting place for ISL negotiations, now who are they looking out for with a proposal like that?