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Pinnacle PIC Time

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TinGoose1

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 10, 2005
Posts
160
I heard the other day that Pinnacle fo's are logging PIC time on some legs to meet upgrade requirements. Can anyone at Pinnacle that knows the truth please shed some light on the subject.

-TG
 
I heard that some metallic waterfowl are selling fake amway products out of their mom's garage. Can anyone at amway that knows the truth please shed some light on the subject.
 
Just the other day I was talking to Pinnacle crew on a turn and getting advice on what to do when I get my hours up. When the topic of upgrade times came up I heard something that shocked me. The FO was actually up for an upgrade, however he didnt have required PIC time (I beleive 250 hrs???) because he was part of that Gulfstream deal. He told me he was going to rent a 172 to get his PIC time to make captain. So no I doubt there is any truth to FO's logging PIC time on the job.
 
As an Airlinker...I can tell you this is false. Many Gulfstream guys are having problems upgrading because they never got 250 hrs PIC when at G/S. I think this whole issue came about after our insurance questioned our two accidents. Pinnacle wrote the FAA to get around the 250 pic requirement to upgrade guys with 2500-3000 in type, however, I had heard that they did not allow this (and I agree). I've been telling guys to just suck it up and go rent a 152 to get the pic time so they can upgrade before the music stops.
On their defense, I lot of these guys are really sharp...
 
Its true Bling...many guys had their paperwork in for upgrade, but the whole 250 pic issue came about and several guys are being passed up until they get it. I don't think they have an option but to just go get it.
 
MAke those people get rent an airplane to get their pic time. Then they can find out how the rest of us who dont have 50,000 dollars lying around did things.
 
I know at some airlines in the past they have typed pilots in the plane and then had them fly as FO. You can legally log PIC from the right seat. You have to be typed and "performing the duties of a PIC."

Weird but true. However at Pinnacle I don't think they are pre-typing anyone, so that would cause this not to work.
 
1000PIC said:
I've been telling guys to just suck it up and go rent a 152 to get the pic time so they can upgrade before the music stops.
Click to expand...

Funny (but very real world) thought...

It is very possible that they may not have the PIC insurance requirements to RENT a small single! (Saratoga, Bonanza, Mooney, etc...)

HA! What a great airline they have there in Memphis!

Let those guys be in charge of 52 other lives...@ 250 hrs pic. Am I the only one that thinks this sounds extremely scary?
 
Last edited:
jackbo said:
I know at some airlines in the past they have typed pilots in the plane and then had them fly as FO. You can legally log PIC from the right seat. You have to be typed and "performing the duties of a PIC."

Weird but true. However at Pinnacle I don't think they are pre-typing anyone, so that would cause this not to work.
Click to expand...

That's a little grey. What does it say in the GOM? Usually the PIC has to sign the paperwork / Logbook and if you are not, such as a typed FO, then you are not legally the PIC. But Whatever, who doesn't have a little BIC time?
 
Chicagopilot22 said:
MAke those people get rent an airplane to get their pic time. Then they can find out how the rest of us who dont have 50,000 dollars lying around did things.
Click to expand...

Thats what I'am talking about!!!
 
Spinn555 said:
Funny (but very real world) thought...

It is very possible that they may not have the PIC insurance requirements to RENT a small single! (Saratoga, Bonanza, Mooney, etc...)

HA! What a great airline they have there in Memphis!

Let those guys be in charge of 52 other lives...@ 250 hrs pic. Am I the only one that thinks this sounds extremely scary?
Click to expand...


Have you been to Pinnacle? Don't talk crap about flagship if you havent been here!!
 
Per the FAR's, (read the book if you don't believe me) for the ATP, 250 hours PIC, OR SIC performing the duites of PIC, (ie sole manipulator of the controls; flying every other leg), or any combination there of. This has also been backed up by several FSDO's.


Pinnacle is flat out wrong on their interpretation of the regs. How do you think the 250 hour COEX new hires back in the 90's, or the 250-300 hour United/Pan Am guys from way back upgraded? Not to mention all the Gulfstream people who stayed at Gulfstream and upgraded. If you guys think that ALL these people had the cash to go out and rent an airplane, you guys are dense.
 
When two pilots are typed in the aircraft the release must stipulate who the PIC will be. The person signing for the aircraft is the PIC......period.
 
blade230 said:
Pinnacle is flat out wrong on their interpretation of the regs.
Click to expand...
It's not Pinnacle that says that, it's our FSDO in Memphis. Mgmt is on the side of the Gulfstream guys, saying that they should not have to go out and get the 250 PIC...saying that all their CRJ time in the right seat is good enough, and should count as PIC when they were the sole manipultor. But the letter that came back from the FSDO said they want a firm 250 PIC, none of which can be from the right seat of a CRJ.

It's kind of a controversal subject at Pinnacle right now.
 
And the way it should be. Pinnacle shouldn't get a separate set of rules while the rest of us are being held to the fire. Fair is fair.
 
MVSW said:
Have you been to Pinnacle? Don't talk crap about flagship if you havent been here!!
Click to expand...

You are an idiot. You are one of the guys that make 9E look bad.

Too bad you cannot learn from example. Take a look at Rook.
 
In all seriousness, what are the mins to upgrade? Call me naive, but I find it hard to believe that a dude has to go rent a 152/172 to get his 250 hrs of PIC, and then he can be a captain at a 121 airline.


If true, what was that person flying before getting on at the airline?
 
It's called going straight from training to PFT and right seat in a 1900. All of it with bare minimum PIC experience. And the FAA should hold their ground on this issue. If 9E gets relief from this regulation by means of an exemption, it will do absolutely nothing to enhance safety.
 

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