Pinnacle, Mesaba, Colgan SLI

[Flyprdu]

I say again, we expect to be fairly integrated. I dont think that is unreasonable.

Don't worry, our group is small and won't change your number or % very much one way or the other.

What you fail to consider is that Mesaba's FOs have much less longevity than Pinnacle's as well. Your small footprint is not as small as you think.

And what's not fair about date of hire? Time served is the one thing we all have in common.

 

[bri5150]

I wouldn't count 2003 as a "long-term" lifer. We have lots of 7 year guys at Pinnacle. The big difference is the amount of 15+ year guys. That's where the big differences are. XJ has hundreds. 9E maybe has 50.*

Now, don't hold me to this. This is all from memory looking at the master lists 6 months ago.

Facts: Mesaba has 127 that were hired before '97. Hardly hundreds. Not only that, but 6 are going to Delta Jan 11th.

 

[Smarta$$]

I say again, we expect to be fairly integrated. I dont think that is unreasonable.

Don't worry, our group is small and won't change your number or % very much one way or the other.

Having a 2 year pilot from Colgan placed in front of a 3-4-5-6-7... year pilot at pinnacle or Mesaba in not "fair". If you were hired 2 years ago, you go behind someone hired 3 years ago. That is "fair".

 

[Yodafly]

And what's not fair about date of hire? Time served is the one thing we all have in common.

Ask that question to an America West Pilot


Simply put, Quality of life in the airlines is based on what % you bid. Changing that % for anyone by a large amount would unfairly hurt that person.

DOH should not be discounted but neither should relative %

 

[Yodafly]

Having a 2 year pilot from Colgan placed in front of a 3-4-5-6-7... year pilot at pinnacle or Mesaba in not "fair". If you were hired 2 years ago, you go behind someone hired 3 years ago. That is "fair".

I agree, a combined approach should address this

 

[avrorj-85]

One thing to remember is that if this thing goes to an airbitrator the pilots have to foot the lawyer and arbitrator bills. ALPA will not do so to remove themselves from any legal liability resulting from people hacked off about how things went. I wonder how big that bill will be...

 

[Flyprdu]

And what's not fair about date of hire? Time served is the one thing we all have in common.

Ask that question to an America West Pilot


Simply put, Quality of life in the airlines is based on what % you bid. Changing that % for anyone by a large amount would unfairly hurt that person.

DOH should not be discounted but neither should relative %

Ask a 17 year FO Eastie what he thinks of relative seniority.

 

[Yodafly]

True Dat

 

[e=mc2]

Colgan should get what they have coming. Snap Snap staple to the bottom. Maybe then you can learn @$%!&@&*(*&$()$)($*_)*#)(&%%&^^@

 

[Yodafly]

I see you are as bored as I am

 

[Flyer1015]

You forget PDT/ALG a few years ago, and I think more recently, CHQ & Shuttle America.

No sheet Shirlock, I'm not talking about simple 2-airline mergers! Arbitrator Bloch just did the recent Delta and Northwest SLI. There are plenty of examples of just 2-airline mergers. Those are far easier than taking 3 (or more airlines) and merging them into one list. Arbitrator Bloch will have very few examples, Eagle being one of them.

 

[Flyer1015]

DOH will not be accepted at Colgan or Pinnacle. Mesaba won't like straight relative. Its going to have to be some sort of combo. How DOH is weighted toward Relative is the big question.

LOL! I love how people can speak like they can think what the arbitrator will rule or that they can somehow rule a binding arbitration decision. Face it, DOH *can* happen and if it's decided in binding arbitration, you will live with it.

I say again, we expect to be fairly integrated. I dont think that is unreasonable.

I don't think Colgan deserves anything but DOH. Your carrier, of all 3, has the fastest movement, and there are no 'by choice' FOs of 3-4+ years. Mesaba and Pinnacle are filled with those. On the CA side, Colgan is super junior because of fast movement, while Mesaba and Pinnacle are not (at least, not anymore).

But who am I to say? I highly, highly doubt the 3 pilot groups will agree on a method with 100% mutual agreement. This will go to the arbitrator, and a binding arbitration decision will be made.

 

[Flyer1015]

My bet is on an arbitrator. If I show up junior to a guy with half my longevity things will get ugly.

And very much a possibility if relative integration is decided. A 2 year Colgan FO will have 'relative seniority' to you as a 4 or 4.5 year FO at Pinnacle. And in fact, he may even end up being more senior than you. I honestly can't see any "split"... like a partial DOH and a partial relative integration. And people need to stop comaring us to US Air/Am West. Entirely different situation there altogether. We are regionals, and as much as I hate to say it, we are very similar (as opposed to Am West/US Air). If I was a bettin man in Vegas, my guess of an arbitrated decision would be DOH.

 

[WMUSIGPI]

What you fail to consider is that Mesaba's FOs have much less longevity than Pinnacle's as well. Your small footprint is not as small as you think.

And what's not fair about date of hire? Time served is the one thing we all have in common.

Not really, and you are forgetting that thanks to the end of the old NWA Saab flying the DOH for captains here is quickly heading north of the pre bankruptcy days of 2005.

 

[xjhawk]

Having a 2 year pilot from Colgan placed in front of a 3-4-5-6-7... year pilot at pinnacle or Mesaba in not "fair". If you were hired 2 years ago, you go behind someone hired 3 years ago. That is "fair".

I should think that with how Colgan has gotten so many improvements with this contract that they should not be looking to have a 1 year guy bump a 7 year guy at 9E or XJ. I mean come on, lets be real. When I look at this TA and I see my healtcare only getting a little better, vacation getting a little better, and ready reserve rules being thrown out the window I should think maybe xj should get something on SLI. I am just saying........ You (colgan) get great new work rules, huge pay raises and now you want my seniority? We all know DOH is not likely to happen as is straight relative is not fair either. Some mix of all will most likely prevail. But that is not for us to decide, that is for our 9 negotiators to agree upon. I do not envy their next few months. in the end we might all think we got screwed and that is how the arbitraitor might rule is "fair". Oh and to you colgan guys and gals, I should think that your most senior people have nothing to worry about, none but a couple of our top 200 live out east and want to go to the Q400. who knows, maybe some fences is not a bad idea to protect some of your current positions and bidding seniority and CA slots. in the end it is not us, but our designated guys who will figure this all out. cross your fingers

 

[CoATP]

How about DOH 9L and XJ then with that list relative to 9E?

 

[Ridgeback]

Fence the top paying positions at XJ & 9E (900's), that takes of the top guys at each company...then who cares

 

[Flyprdu]

Fence the top paying positions at XJ & 9E (900's), that takes of the top guys at each company...then who cares

I hope you're joking. If not, you're a d*uchebag.

 

[Smarta$$]

How about DOH 9L and XJ then with that list relative to 9E?

How about DOH.

 

[prtyprtyprncss]

We'll know when we know...until then, this is all a game of "pin the pen*s on the guy that desperately needs it"...but I'm guessing DOH...