Pinnacle Files for Bankruptcy

[8sugarsugar]

Buy what? you don't own anything, it's all leased or owned by DL.

Hopefully this will be another warning to those companies that play "fast and loose" with the bidding of contracts with hopes of sweeter things to come.

Seriously, I don't understand, can someone explain this to me...Okay, Pinnacle doesn't own the planes, doesn't buy fuel, doesn't sell tickets, etc etc....So how can a company go bankrupt that has a fixed cost and a fixed revenue source?????

Are they not just a certificate that has a building and a workforce?

 

[Inconceivable]

Short answer: shenanigans.

Delta agreed to pay training costs related to the acquisition of Mesaba. Delta then reneged.

The beginning, end, and middle of the crisis at hand has been orchestrated by Delta. Just as NWA did with Mesaba, parts of the operation were more profitable than others but the entire corporation was net profitable. The crisis only emerged when Delta stopped paying their bills.

This entire process is a fraud being perpetrated on the bankruptcy court where bankruptcy is caused by the same party that becomes the DIP by applying minimal liquidity and recapitalizing existing unsecured debt. This same party is the sole beneficiary of renegotiated agreements as the only client of the new Pinnacle.

What you are seeing is a wealth transfer: from the shareholders and employees of Pinnacle to the shareholders of Delta. Or legalized theft, you choose.

 

[Flyer1015]

Why should Delta have to pay for Colgan's US Air side of the operation? There's a reason they reneged.

 

[Inconceivable]

Why should Delta have to pay for Colgan's US Air side of the operation? There's a reason they reneged.

Because that's what they agreed to. Are you really going to tell me that the executives at DAL "forgot" to do their due diligence? LOL

 

[Flyer1015]

Because that's what they agreed to. Are you really going to tell me that the executives at DAL "forgot" to do their due diligence? LOL

NO. Delta NEVER agreed to pay Pinnacle to retrain Colgan guys. Remember, Pinnacle *chose* to voluntarily close up the BOS Saab base and retrain them elsewhere to improve our staffing situation. Delta had no part in that, nor should they have to pay for the US Air side of things. Delta's only agreement was to pay for retraining associated with the MESABA DISPLACEMENTS coming off the Delta Saabs being parked! They will not, and should not, give one dime of their money to help retrain any Colgan pilots. Delta is not going to help subsidize a Colgan pilot's movement to make some more money.

 

[suupah]

NO. Delta NEVER agreed to pay Pinnacle to retrain Colgan guys. Remember, Pinnacle *chose* to voluntarily close up the BOS Saab base and retrain them elsewhere to improve our staffing situation. Delta had no part in that, nor should they have to pay for the US Air side of things. Delta's only agreement was to pay for retraining associated with the MESABA DISPLACEMENTS coming off the Delta Saabs being parked! They will not, and should not, give one dime of their money to help retrain any Colgan pilots. Delta is not going to help subsidize a Colgan pilot's movement to make some more money.

So did they pay for any of the mesaba displacements?

 

[mesaba13]

At the time Delta sold they airline they didn't know there would be a single seniority list?

 

[Flyer1015]

At the time Delta sold they airline they didn't know there would be a single seniority list?

No. And why would they? Compass was sold at the same time and they still have separate lists. The one-list thing was all 100% union led in order to prevent whipsaw. Ironically, this one list will actually destroy what little unity the pilot groups had. In fact, the entire process has destroyed unity rather than create it. All 3 unions tore each other apart in SLI negotiations and then there was the appealing of the DOH issue at Pinnacle. After all that BS, there was a distinct "us versus them" attitude that prevailed in the pilot groups, and the 9E union tried to do what it could to try and become the surviving union. They failed. Now, with the upcoming fleet parking, all 3 pilot groups will want what's best for their own interests.

Also, the 9E union agreeing to merge their list with another carrier that was shrinking was a stupid move. The 9E pilots took the brunt force of the Mesaba Saab cuts, as the Mesaba pilots made their way into the Pinnacle left and right seats. "They brought the contract" and "everyone is brining something to this merger!" were said and used over and over again. Well, the contract is about to be tossed in bankruptcy and Colgan's Queen Q fleet (and the Saabs) are gonna be parked. With one list, Pinnacle will yet again take a huge blow for the entire loss of the colgan operation. The lists should never have been combined. If they had never been combined, Mesaba would have furloughed and downgraded their pilots as a result of the Saabs being parked. Pinnacle and Colgan unaffected. Next, with the news of the BK and Colgan disappearing, the entire Colgan pilot group would have been furloughed once the airline stopped operating. Pinnacle pilots unaffected. The ONLY thing that would have affected the 9E pilots if they had their own list would have been the loss of 16 CRJ-900s. That loss would have hurt 9E pilots, but at least it would have been everyone on the 9E list. Instead, you got the union fighting each other and shoving the one-list idea down everyone's throats despite objections. The 9E union should have (for that time being) not agreed to merging one seniority list when it was a known fact that 30+ aircraft were being parked at one other airline. Pinnacle's old management deserves blame for where Pinnacle is today, but the plight of 9E-only pilots falls squarely on the 9E union for making horrible decisions that have gotten to where 9E is today.

 

[bri5150]

So you think that Pinnacle holdings should have ran 3 completely seperate companies? What would have happened if Mesaba would have gotten those 700's that went to GoJets? There would have been no backlash from the Pinnacle pilots about why Mesaba got those? Remember, no hind sight allowed. There is no way to know what was about to happen to Colgan. I am sure the quote would have been "they got those 700's on our profits!!"

 

[FOrever85]

No. And why would they? Compass was sold at the same time and they still have separate lists. The one-list thing was all 100% union led in order to prevent whipsaw. Ironically, this one list will actually destroy what little unity the pilot groups had. In fact, the entire process has destroyed unity rather than create it. All 3 unions tore each other apart in SLI negotiations and then there was the appealing of the DOH issue at Pinnacle. After all that BS, there was a distinct "us versus them" attitude that prevailed in the pilot groups, and the 9E union tried to do what it could to try and become the surviving union. They failed. Now, with the upcoming fleet parking, all 3 pilot groups will want what's best for their own interests.

Also, the 9E union agreeing to merge their list with another carrier that was shrinking was a stupid move. The 9E pilots took the brunt force of the Mesaba Saab cuts, as the Mesaba pilots made their way into the Pinnacle left and right seats. "They brought the contract" and "everyone is brining something to this merger!" were said and used over and over again. Well, the contract is about to be tossed in bankruptcy and Colgan's Queen Q fleet (and the Saabs) are gonna be parked. With one list, Pinnacle will yet again take a huge blow for the entire loss of the colgan operation. The lists should never have been combined. If they had never been combined, Mesaba would have furloughed and downgraded their pilots as a result of the Saabs being parked. Pinnacle and Colgan unaffected. Next, with the news of the BK and Colgan disappearing, the entire Colgan pilot group would have been furloughed once the airline stopped operating. Pinnacle pilots unaffected. The ONLY thing that would have affected the 9E pilots if they had their own list would have been the loss of 16 CRJ-900s. That loss would have hurt 9E pilots, but at least it would have been everyone on the 9E list. Instead, you got the union fighting each other and shoving the one-list idea down everyone's throats despite objections. The 9E union should have (for that time being) not agreed to merging one seniority list when it was a known fact that 30+ aircraft were being parked at one other airline. Pinnacle's old management deserves blame for where Pinnacle is today, but the plight of 9E-only pilots falls squarely on the 9E union for making horrible decisions that have gotten to where 9E is today.

Hey general lee jr., Why are you still complaining about this? You don't even work here anymore.

We are and always will be NWA's/Delta's bit%^.
Inconceivable has it spot on. This whole thing doesn't have anything to do with Delta retraining Colgan pilots, separate seniority lists, or any of the other crap your talking about. Delta obviously doesn't care about giving money to regionals that fly for competing carriers, except for us for some reason.

Oh wait, I remember now. It's because Delta makes a sh*t load of money off of doing this to us. They make an already cheap product cheaper. They can slash aircraft, building, and vendor leases, and undo labor contracts. They get cheaper contracted regional flying, that they control, and make money doing it!

Someone quick, what is 12.5% interest on $74,285,000.

Not only that, but Delta also gets paid penalties for 9E parking 900's and they can park 200's.(Personally I don't think they will yet)
All of this comes right from the court filing.

It is a rinse and repeat of the last bankruptcy on a much larger scale.
In the end, we will once again be a wholly controlled regional of Delta. Like usual, Delta already has something planned for us.

I'm not even going to waste my time pointing out all the other things you have got wrong in this thread. If you want, keep pretending that 9E's union doing something else would have changed things. News flash; It wouldn't have. If anything you should be happy, this was obviously the kick in the head you needed to get out.

The last thing this pilot group needs right now is some whiny, know it all trying to re-divide the pilot group. The ones that work here are bad enough, we really don't need one that doesn't even work here!

Congrats, now move on, and don't look back.