Pilots making the NJA/NJI move!

[flyjetspeed]

OK been kind of bored today and decided to read the TA/CBA and NJA/NJI Letter of Agreement.

First some facts

All NJA pilots contemplating a move to the GIV/GV must have a minimum of 2 years with the company.

The minimum salary without O/T or any other compensation for NJA F/O’s with 2 years is

$42,998 on 7/7 or $51,030 on Reserve for Class 1,2 and 3 Aircraft (Everything up to the F2000EX)

$53,820 on 7/7 or $63,875 on Reserve for Class 4 Aircraft (Both GIV and GV)
NJI currently has no other schedule than 7/7


Sooo…. An F/O gets a $10,822 raise for the same schedule or only $2,790 if he/she was on reserve.

No pilot would bid F/O if he/she could bid Captain on ANYTHING as the minimum Captains pay after 2 years is $71,250 or a $17,430 pay CUT.

Additionally all NJA pilots migrating to NJI are SEAT LOCKED for 3 years.

Based on the above I predict very few 2 year NJA pilots making the move IF ANY!

Why lock yourself in for 3 years when you would probably be able to hold Captain by then?

In the event not enough pilots with 2 years seniority bid the, every other, F/O seats at NJI then a new hire can bid that seat. BUT

All new hire NJA pilots have to meet the HIRING criteria of 5000 hours AND provide their OWN Type Rating at their own expense.

All in all not such a good deal for the F/O slots.

Captains bidding the 1 of 3 seats get a better deal. $129,169 sliding to $167,138 at 10 years. (currently more than most Captains are getting at NJI)

Lastly all NJA and NJI pilots are now on a “Virtual Seniority List at NJI for all purposes for which seniority is used at NJI.” This could be construed to be the same as it always has at NJI. Seniority for the purpose of upgrade in the GIV is by date of hire IN THE GULFSTREAM regardless of previous NJA, EJM, and etc. time in service. Same for Upgrade to Captain in the GV. If it goes this way we will have the highest paid F/O’s in the world for 4-6 years.

I post this in the spirit of lively debate and as food for thought. For those of you considering the move to NJI I know I will welcome you and treat you as the professional you are as will 98.962% of my fellow GIV/GV pilots. (there are always a few who don’t get it in every group) Congratulations on the TA/CBA and to all of us I wish a Happy and prosperous 2006

 

[Grizz]

Lastly all NJA and NJI pilots are now on a “Virtual Seniority List at NJI for all purposes for which seniority is used at NJI.” This could be construed to be the same as it always has at NJI. Seniority for the purpose of upgrade in the GIV is by date of hire IN THE GULFSTREAM regardless of previous NJA, EJM, and etc. time in service. Same for Upgrade to Captain in the GV. If it goes this way we will have the highest paid F/O’s in the world for 4-6 years.

I'll start with this part of your post. Your "could be construed" is incorrect. Since IBT1108 has a say in the virtual seniority list, I can guarantee you it won't go down that way.

 

[flyjetspeed]

I'll start with this part of your post. Your "could be construed" is incorrect. Since IBT1108 has a say in the virtual seniority list, I can guarantee you it won't go down that way.

How does IBT 1108 have a say on a list kept at NJI? I can assure you the management team in Okatie will want it the way I described. Honestly, I think this is headed for arbitration and given the language in the LOA regarding NJI training requirements and work rules I don't see a clear win for either side. At least the pay for all NJA pilots making the move appears unambiguous. Thank you for responding Grizz. Your views are always appreciated by most here and I share the sentiment.

 

[gunfyter]

There will be quite a number of bids to G-IV FO. some FOs on the property for 5 yrs or so who are retired Airline or military and do not want to go from the Falcon or X to the 400XP or Ultra.

 

[Heavy Set]

Plus, getting that GIV/GV type rating would be quite valuable. I'm sure you could earn a pretty penny on the side with the GIV/V rating...

 

[Grizz]

How does IBT 1108 have a say on a list kept at NJI? I can assure you the management team in Okatie will want it the way I described. Honestly, I think this is headed for arbitration and given the language in the LOA regarding NJI training requirements and work rules I don't see a clear win for either side. At least the pay for all NJA pilots making the move appears unambiguous. Thank you for responding Grizz. Your views are always appreciated by most here and I share the sentiment.

Since the virtual seniority list is delineated in the agreement between NetJets and IBT1108, it is covered under the dispute resolution portion of that agreement. I understand what the managers at Oakatie want, all I was saying is that I'm doubtful that they're going to get it 100% their way.

 

[bizjet737]

All new hire NJA pilots have to meet the HIRING criteria of 5000 hours AND provide their OWN Type Rating at their own expense.

not sure where you read a new-hire will have to buy a type rating...
it says you'll get hired by nja with an nja seniority number, but you won't get an NJA type rating (400xp, 800xp, 2000, etc). you will get the g type.

 

[flyjetspeed]

not sure where you read a new-hire will have to buy a type rating...
it says you'll get hired by nja with an nja seniority number, but you won't get an NJA type rating (400xp, 800xp, 2000, etc). you will get the g type.

Page 221 of the CBA says the company will not provide the type. Are you saying this allows company paid types for the G's? I guess there is a distinction needed for defining what is meant by NJA type rating? Again this is headed for a lengthy arbitration.

 

[GVFlyer]

Plus, getting that GIV/GV type rating would be quite valuable. I'm sure you could earn a pretty penny on the side with the GIV/V rating...

Presently $1500.00 a day for an experienced GV/G550 Captain...

 

[flyjetspeed]

Since the virtual seniority list is delineated in the agreement between NetJets and IBT1108, it is covered under the dispute resolution portion of that agreement. I understand what the managers at Oakatie want, all I was saying is that I'm doubtful that they're going to get it 100% their way.

Nor will the 1108 get it all their way. My guess is a compromise will ensue and both sides will not be completely satisfied with the outcome after a protracted negotiation and arbitration. Just a guess here but I see a 2 year minimum IOE period for incoming GIV Captain seats for NJA folks after this is settled just my .02.