Pilot shortage solved

[WSurf]

Who does this actually benefit? Maybe someone in there mid 20's that still lives with mommy and daddy and has always dreamed to fly for Delta. Other then that Endeavor with it's crappy pay isn't going to attract more then that when people could go to other Regionals and make way more money and still get a mainline job.
You want better pilots to come to your regional? Then it's simple..... Raise the pay. Working at Endeavor for crappy pay 8-10 years to hopefully land a job at Delta won't be the answer to their pilot shortage.

 

[crashtest]

SO YOUR TELLING ME THERE'S A CHANCE! Yee Haw kids, let's load up the van. Daddy is gonna buy him a RJ type. I'm going to discard my Delta app on file for years, and I'm fast tracking it baby..........

 

[redflyer65]

Who does this actually benefit? Maybe someone in there mid 20's that still lives with mommy and daddy and has always dreamed to fly for Delta. Other then that Endeavor with it's crappy pay isn't going to attract more then that when people could go to other Regionals and make way more money and still get a mainline job.
You want better pilots to come to your regional? Then it's simple..... Raise the pay. Working at Endeavor for crappy pay 8-10 years to hopefully land a job at Delta won't be the answer to their pilot shortage.

I couldn't imagine people being delusional enough to be an FO that long, for so little pay with the possibility of a Delta job at the end.

It's clear that both Delta and Endeavor together are trying a new model. Crap pay for the length of your regional time. Soon they will try and change that into a full ab initio training setup similar to Gulfstream. I'm not sure they will have the time to make it work.

Hopefully the marketplace will show them it's more about pay and work rules instead of a promise 10 years from now. I see them struggling to fill classes and doing either one of two things.....raising pay or closing the doors.

 

[goahead]

I couldn't imagine people being delusional enough to be an FO that long, for so little pay with the possibility of a Delta job at the end.

It's clear that both Delta and Endeavor together are trying a new model. Crap pay for the length of your regional time. Soon they will try and change that into a full ab initio training setup similar to Gulfstream. I'm not sure they will have the time to make it work.

Hopefully the marketplace will show them it's more about pay and work rules instead of a promise 10 years from now. I see them struggling to fill classes and doing either one of two things.....raising pay or closing the doors.

I agree Red

 

[Crash Pad]

You guys have been making too much money for too long. Great Lakes has paid pilots next to nothing for years with the promise of a quick upgrade and a shot at a good job.

Lets take our current flight instructor. He has 100K in loans for college and licenses. He has been making 20 bucks an hour teaching Chinese pilots with questionable English and a PHD in astro physics. Due to age 65 he has been doing this for five years with little hiring anywhere.

Finally the "pilot shortage" has arrived and everyone is starting to hire. Our hero knows nothing about the airlines other than he would rather work in an air conditioned jet than a turbulent, hot, 172 with a guy who doesn't speak English. He does his due diligence and looks at the Endeavor and say ExpressJet pay scale

Express Jet FO: 23, 36, 39 Captain:57, 60, 64
Endeavor FO: 25, 33, 35 Captain: 59, 61, 63

Does he look past 3 years. No, we are optimists and think we will be long gone before the 4 year mark. So looking at those pay scales our hero sees little difference between any of the regionals except one offers me a class at Delta. It is easy to tell yourself that upgrade will come down now that hiring has started again.

You don't have to be delusional to take the job. You just have to be desperate. Big loans and no military pension make your average instructor pretty desperate, and they can't pay back those loans on 35K a year what they really need is a 150K. Means to an end.

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

Ok,

I don't own this program nor do I think its perfect but there is a definite thought process by the Bossman at Mother D.

Anybody on any seniority list today WILL get an interview by a major airline within the next 3 years. That's just pure numbers based on growth and retirements. The ones who won't either didn't fill out an app or is a convicted murderer....(joke....throttle back). Delta knows that anybody in theleft seat wil go to the first airline that calls and has no allegiance to the carrier.

They go out and tag newcomers and make them brand dependent and then guarantee a pipeline of cheap F/Os to keep the regional flying.

Why should Delta offer this to the current pilots because, as we see, they are already grinded to the bone by all the poor treatment they have received so far by the big airline. Not saying its right, but that is the clean slate they are looking for.


Fire away....because you gotta take it out on somebody.

 

[wms]

Delta is going to see this will fall short of providing enough staffing. The new hires will see that they can be somewhere a lot sooner, just like the pilots that are coming through colleges with deals with majors and regionals(this is just the next generation of that).

What this may do is eventually lead to a truly unified seniority list with exceptions for poor performance. I'd say this is just one step in a progressive change in the way the majors staff their airplanes.

 

[redflyer65]

Everyone on a seniority list now could be at Delta in three years? They still need PIC time Bill. If they started today, and had a three year upgrade at Endeavor (which is running more than 7yrs right now), it would still take over a year to get the 1000 PIC. That equals 4 years if everything went perfectly. And in the real world numbers RIGHT NOW, it more like 8.5 years. That's along time to wait for a number.

I'm not trying to bash Delta at all. Just the situation. Send Endeavor thru bankruptcy to crush the rates back down, then offer a 'new' carrot. How about Endeavor pay a better payrate? The problem will become really evident when DL hires too many Endeavor CAs and they won't be able to backfill the FOs. Kind of happening now. That's why they rolled out this new plan. I don't see it working.

For any guy looking to get hired at a regional, it's still going to be about two things (like it's always been)...

1. Quick upgrade.
2. Better pay/work rules.

in that order.

 

[Crash Pad]

It's not that long to wait for a number. I'm almost to 5 years on SWA version of this program.

 

[sniper]

http://news.delta.com/Endeavor_to_Delta

It would seem to me that you can scrap your Delta app. I'm guessing that Delta hires both military and civilian pilots. If the civilian pilots come from Endeavor can we then assume they won't come from the "stack"?

Slick move by Delta. It keeps Endeavor stacked with pilots despite the contract. Keeps the Delta RJs flying despite the low wages and lack of pilots. Your move United and American.

thats a great move ... ual and amr should follow . a known quality is a known quality ... kudos to the mec that approve that