Pilot Shortage and The Right Stuff

[FLYLOW22]

Gotta do what you gotta do!

I can't blame anyone for pursuing their dreams!

Get some.

 

[gunfyter]

Gotta do what you gotta do!

I can't blame anyone for pursuing their dreams!

Get some.

The more the merrier....

 

[-FlyAuburn-]

Its more than just “Big Airplane” syndrome. More to do with “Big Career Aspirations” syndrome.

Or at least more than bottom feeding off the NJ seniority list. Indefinitely.

What you said.

 

[imacdog]

Big Airplane Syndrome are the suckers that went to SkyBus. What we have now is people who see better opportunity.

 

[osy007]

I was browsing through APC's legacy section and they are showing an average retirement rate of 300 pilots/year for each airline. Times that by 6 or so which could include the cargos and things should start opening up soon for everyone. I'm guestimating around 1500 to 2000 pilots retiring every year until 2030.

 

[nordo_2]

Big Airplane Syndrome are the suckers that went to SkyBus. What we have now is people who see better opportunity.

The “Suckers that went to SkyBus”. What about the suckers that left for JetBlue just before the 05 contract was signed. Now they’re all captains living in or near base. I’ll bet they don’t taxi past the FBO wishing they were still sitting in that lounge chair. Is that “Big Airplane Syndrome” gone bad?

Either way, the suckers as you put it, probably weren’t too happy with the thought of “coffee, papers, ice”; and/or shoving bags up the rear of airplanes in freezing rain, for the rest of their lives.

The SkyBus folks went for it. They took a risk. And I’m sure they didn’t curl up and die. They probably picked themselves up, and moved on to something else. Being content with NJ is not everyone’s lot in life. Taking a risk for your overall happiness is always worthwhile. NJ is a very good job. Just not a great career for some.

 

[pilotyip]

The SkyBus folks went for it. They took a risk. And I’m sure they didn’t curl up and die. They probably picked themselves up, and moved on to something else. Being content with NJ is not everyone’s lot in life. Taking a risk for your overall happiness is always worthwhile. NJ is a very good job. Just not a great career for some.

I reported aboard CVAN-65 USS Enterprise in 1975. At that time civilian flying jobs a scarce. I meet this guy who is getting out, going to work for company doing overnight mail, paid $400/mo for a F/O's job, he had to use his GI bill for training in the right seat of the DA-20. I thought the company must have had a gov't contract with a name like Federal Express. He stayed at FedEx, ran across him at a CO's conference in the late 80's he was like a double-digit seniority number. All the preparation in the world does not guarantee you are making the right choices. Shows you just never know about that job.

 

[nordo_2]

I reported aboard CVAN-65 USS Enterprise in 1975. At that time civilian flying jobs a scarce. I meet this guy who is getting out, going to work for company doing overnight mail, paid $400/mo for a F/O's job, he had to use his GI bill for training in the right seat of the DA-20. I thought the company must have had a gov't contract with a name like Federal Express. He stayed at FedEx, ran across him at a CO's conference in the late 80's he was like a double-digit seniority number. All the preparation in the world does not guarantee you are making the right choices. Shows you just never know about that job.

That’s a good story yip. You never know. Singling out a few who fail in an attempt to better themselves, is ridiculous. What’s the worse that can happen? A company folds? So what. If someone leaves a company, they probably weren’t happy with the overall circumstances of their employment. The SkyBus example says more about NJ, than the decision making process of those pilots.

And in your example, the “X” factor is always in play.

 

[imacdog]

The “Suckers that went to SkyBus”. What about the suckers that left for JetBlue just before the 05 contract was signed. Now they’re all captains living in or near base. I’ll bet they don’t taxi past the FBO wishing they were still sitting in that lounge chair. Is that “Big Airplane Syndrome” gone bad?

Either way, the suckers as you put it, probably weren’t too happy with the thought of “coffee, papers, ice”; and/or shoving bags up the rear of airplanes in freezing rain, for the rest of their lives.

The SkyBus folks went for it. They took a risk. And I’m sure they didn’t curl up and die. They probably picked themselves up, and moved on to something else. Being content with NJ is not everyone’s lot in life. Taking a risk for your overall happiness is always worthwhile. NJ is a very good job. Just not a great career for some.

I'm all for bettering one's life, but pretty much every sane person could see the writing on the wall at that airline before it even started operations.

 

[cldsfr79]

I reported aboard CVAN-65 USS Enterprise in 1975. At that time civilian flying jobs a scarce. I meet this guy who is getting out, going to work for company doing overnight mail, paid $400/mo for a F/O's job, he had to use his GI bill for training in the right seat of the DA-20. I thought the company must have had a gov't contract with a name like Federal Express. He stayed at FedEx, ran across him at a CO's conference in the late 80's he was like a double-digit seniority number. All the preparation in the world does not guarantee you are making the right choices. Shows you just never know about that job.

Yip, for once I really enjoyed this post. I like to read success stories, or at the very least, gambling that paid off. It is a crap shoot where ever guys go. The most stable place we all clamor to get on can go bust (Pan-Am, TWA, Eastern, Braniff, American?, NetJets?) and the least expected places, the ones you only apply to last, go big (Southwest, FedEx, UPS). I just wish my crystal ball was working right.
____
In regards to guys bashing SkyBus: They took a risk. I don't think it was "big airplane syndrome". I think guys rushed over there because they could have been on the ground floor of something big. Skybus, if managed right, if they actually put it in a "destination city"-not Columbus, and if fuel prices at the time weren't $150 a barrel, I think they could have made it. They could have grown rapidly like Ryan Air in Europe, and young guys could have been set. Looking back on history, who really wanted to go to a crappy Intra Texas airline when you could get on with Braniff Airlines or some other legacy carrier years ago.
______
And the pilot shortage. "The right stuff".
Yeah this could be a problem. In the mid to late 90s through about 00-01'ish, a certain fractional opened up the flood gate and allowed anyone who had a pilot certificate and believed to know how to fly a plane to get a job. And then you got the guys who were hired prior to the mid 90s when a certain fractional was tiny, you had to pay for your job, and the wages were horrific. Not sure why they stayed while the majors and nationals grew in the mid to late 90s???? Yeah, they hired some great guys, but the tide brought in a lot of undesirables. Some guys have basic flight skill issues and some have poor work ethic. It can be scary when you open the flood gates. Every airline has a percentage of undesirables, usually <5%, I would guess it would be closer to 20% at a certain fractional....and for some reason the percentage is all at the top of the seniority list??

 

[nordo_2]

Yip, for once I really enjoyed this post. I like to read success stories, or at the very least, gambling that paid off. It is a crap shoot where ever guys go. The most stable place we all clamor to get on can go bust (Pan-Am, TWA, Eastern, Braniff, American?, NetJets?) and the least expected places, the ones you only apply to last, go big (Southwest, FedEx, UPS). I just wish my crystal ball was working right.
____
In regards to guys bashing SkyBus: They took a risk. I don't think it was "big airplane syndrome". I think guys rushed over there because they could have been on the ground floor of something big. Skybus, if managed right, if they actually put it in a "destination city"-not Columbus, and if fuel prices at the time weren't $150 a barrel, I think they could have made it. They could have grown rapidly like Ryan Air in Europe, and young guys could have been set. Looking back on history, who really wanted to go to a crappy Intra Texas airline when you could get on with Braniff Airlines or some other legacy carrier years ago.
______
And the pilot shortage. "The right stuff".
Yeah this could be a problem. In the mid to late 90s through about 00-01'ish, a certain fractional opened up the flood gate and allowed anyone who had a pilot certificate and believed to know how to fly a plane to get a job. And then you got the guys who were hired prior to the mid 90s when a certain fractional was tiny, you had to pay for your job, and the wages were horrific. Not sure why they stayed while the majors and nationals grew in the mid to late 90s???? Yeah, they hired some great guys, but the tide brought in a lot of undesirables. Some guys have basic flight skill issues and some have poor work ethic. It can be scary when you open the flood gates. Every airline has a percentage of undesirables, usually <5%, I would guess it would be closer to 20% at a certain fractional....and for some reason the percentage is all at the top of the seniority list??

A few at NJ like to blow of pilots that might want to switch, or go back to the airlines, as “Big Airplane Syndrome”. Don’t understand why. Inferring some sort of myopic or flawed decision process.