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Piedmont to close all Florida bases.

dirkdigler

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I've just heard that Piedmont Airlines is being forced out of Florida flying all together. As a result,tThey will be closing TPA and JAX bases. There will be over 170 crewmembers plus a whole bunch of ground workers who will be displaced. Guess who is going to take advantage of this situation. You guessed it. MESA, as always.
 

JTrain

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Does anybody have access to the press release regarding Piedmont pulling out of Florida/Mesa being the replacement.

Also, which division of Mesa will be filling in? Air Midwest - which does some intra-FL flying, or CRJs/ERJs.

It is really quite a shame what is happening to the PDTers. I have a friend in JAX with PDT and he tells me that a lot of senior PDT ppl have hung out in FL bases just because of various quality of life issues down there, now unfortunately they'll have to leave or commute.

JTrain
 

B1900DFO

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There is no public press release as of yet. The news was distributed through a letter from pdt's president to the crewmembers. He states that Florida's market is too volatile and Mesa with their "low" cost structure is happy to take over. Apparently making 24k in the right seat at Pdt is not cost competitive for the company. Those whores at Mesa are eventually going to ruin this job for EVERYBODY!

Now that US airways is code sharing with Ual I would be worried if I was a UAL express pilot right now making more than 17k a year. I'm sure Ornstein already has his eyes on your flying. Who can compete with welfare wages or 8 days off a month? It's disgusting.
 

JTrain

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I hear ya. At ACA, on 2nd year RJ FO pay I can make a decent living. Not breaking the bank, UAL-style, but a decent life.

I understand Mesa's pilot contract is due this fall. Let us hope that they can raise the bar.

JT
 

h25b

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I've got several good friends at PDT, and believe me when I say I agree that you guys are gett'n screwed. But, the guys flying at Mesa aren't the ones you should be blaming. Calling them whores isn't quite the answer. There are only two classifications of pilots out there. SL*TS and the whores you refer to. The whores get paid to fly and the sluts don't. It's as simple as that. If your gettin a paycheck, your a whore. Period. I've yet to meet a pilot who thinks he or she is getting paid what they're worth.

The industry's in the toilet now, lets all try to stick together. Everybody's just trying to make a living. Mesa's pilots just go fly where they're told and hope their paychecks come on time. If you want some sort of control over the routes you fly, rent an airplane...
 

Beantown

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PDT pilots need to stop crying. Your company just "TOOK" all of few remaining routes that CCAir had. A move that will most likely force CCAir to cease operations. You guys always play "victim" but lose no sleep when your MGMT puts 400 people on the street. You always put down the Mesa pilots, looks to me that you just jumped onto the same boat. Sad! -Bean
 

Beantown

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1900fo wrote, "I'm sure Ornstein already has his eyes on your flying. Who can compete with welfare wages or 8 days off a month? It's disgusting.
---------------------------------------------------

1900, Who do you work for? What is your pay? -Bean
 

Beantown

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1900fo wrote, " The airline I work for despises Mesa guys because they are helping to shut us down despite being considerably worse on operational performance. Just my .02."
-----------------------------------------

Again, who is US? You are not at a WO. The only airline that I can think of that flys 1900's in the U system is Colgan. I have seen the pay rates at Colgen and they are worse then Mesa's. If not Colgen who? How is Mesa trying to take your flying? -Bean
 

dondk

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Time out.. Being former Mesa going to PDT I FELT the "love" from the PDT guys. Basically I stopped saying I was former Mesa because the temperature got real chilly real fast. There has been bad blood between the two for many years. I have heard stories on both sides to the reason for the bad blood and this is surely not going to help.

From PDT's point though.. It will take (2) 1900's to make the load a DHC-8 can carry and some of those FL route's I thought had -300's.

It will be interesting if Mesa's going to put jet's into a already saturated market. Does'nt Comair and Eagle already have a decent FL presence and I hear CHQ is bringing more into the pot?

A while back Mesa was cutting FL flying as it had lower load factors (everyone preferred the DHC to the 1900).
Don't pick on Mesa pilots, they have no choice who they fly for or where they fly, they want a paycheck just like everyone else does. They are in contract negioations, and maybe they will get what they are due, whatever it is though.. It will be more than they get now, so that "cost" factor maybe rising more than JO may like...
 

PDTGIMP

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Dude,

PDT guys don't whine, first off. In fact CCAir guys are the best example of a strong pilot group standing up to Mesa MGT. They took it from Mesa, stood strong, went down but had the pride of knowing they didn't give one red cent to Jonnie o.

We haven't reached an agreement with management-and since we refuse to work for the corn feed MESA works for-we'll hit the street. Yeah, I'm looking to leave and I'm not gonna whine and say "poor me" 'cause I know how this industry works. If I have to get out of aviation 'cause nobody hires me, well then that's life.

But, it is true we blame Mesa for most of our downfall, in fact in the most recent "Airline Pilot Careers" magazine "Ask the Counselor" section it states: "(At) The US Airways wholly owned sub. growth as been strained and uneven....independent carriers, such as Mesa Airlines, have absorbed much of the growth in US Airways regional network." I bring this up because I did my research before entering the regional market. I looked at Mesa five years ago, saw the low pay, horrible TDY/stand-up overnights, million plus bases, bleak financials and overall poor benifits package. If you went to MESA you knew how bad it was before you got there and therefore should see how much better everyone else has/had it and try to bring your contract up to par-strike if you have too!

We don't own routes, we just sat back and watched everyone else grow and upgrade up from the Dash thinking things would get better for us with the merger, well we all know what happened there.

Anyway, we except our fate-but don't expect us to be all happy go lucky and wave like a retard when a MESA RJ passes us in JAX. Some 150 pilots are having their families, lives, etc displaced 'cause it's cheapier to TDY y'all down there.

It's a crazy industry, I respect all pilots, including MESA, but anyone at MESA Air Group should take our "bashing" as tough love, by understanding the effect your contract had on ALG, PDT and CCAir and fight to make all our lives better.

Peace out
 

Beavis

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Great post, and well said my friend!
 

chperplt

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Again, who is US? You are not at a WO. The only airline that I can think of that flys 1900's in the U system is Colgan. I have seen the pay rates at Colgen and they are worse then Mesa's. If not Colgen who? How is Mesa trying to take your flying? -Bean

Hey Beantown

If I'm not mistaken, CC Air, Air Midwest, and Colgan fly the 1900 for US Air...
 

KingAirer

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CCAir doesnt have B1900s. I think its just Air Midwest and Colgan now.
 

LR25

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So if Mesa paid what PDT pays, would this be happening?

There might be a downsize which was already happening in JAX and TPA.

Simple fact is, If people would not work for food to fly for cut throat operations this would not be happening.

I dont make diddly in the grand scheme of things working for PDT as it is, compare my wage to a mainline bag thrower. How much cheaper does it have to be, the WO's are not the problem.

No ethics, pure and simple.

I dont want to bash Mesa, people do what they have to do, we all (regional) pilots work our a$$es off everyday, together.

Good luck fellow PDT's, the writing is on the wall.
 

dondk

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My .02

A different perspective...

At my company we "sold out" to get jets on the property, Mesa did the same years ago, and I do believe a WO has now also. While management at Mesa is a different story the real problem are us the pilots.

It is not so much as working for just food or working for a cutthroat operation as it is our own ego's. We all want to fly the BEST equipment, make the most money, have the best schedules, and have a great contract. Not one regional has the whole deal, (well maybe Air Wisc is close) and if one did EVERYONE would want to be there!

If you look at those "all jet" carriers, they by far have had the most growth, which in most cases have yielded to the ego's of the pilots.

Let's be real here... If you had a carrier who offered the same pay for a 1900, dash or a erj, do you thnk everyone would pick the 1900? Heck, the line for the ERJ would be 3-4 times the line for either of the other 2 aircraft, but the pay would be the same! Why is that? It is the pilots, not the company, we can be our own worst enemies!

JO got the people to do what HE wants by offering opportunity. Most of those guys who signed on to the contract that allows him to be a cutthroat are long gone. They got that PIC jet time and bolted. Upgrades at one time were down to 14 months to a jet, when at PDT they still were 2 1/2 years or more and other carriers who had jets were much more than Mesa's upgrade time. Many guys went to Mesa for opportunity which in our industry equates to a better senority number which equates to better opportunities at our carrier of choice. That dude who did the Mesa thing and is now at Jet Blue by shaving off a year or more is not regretting his decision.

It is a cycle that the airlines breed and our ego's encourage.
 

Ty Webb

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Don't know the rest of the particulars, but saving $7./hr on the FO pay isn't the difference between making it profitable or not . . . . there are definitely deeper issues than that in play.
 

LR25

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Ty is 100% correct.

My poverty earnings at PDT, which by the way is alot better than the 1900 Mesa pilot, has no bearing on the economic situation with the "Florida flying", I dont hear anyone saying anything or even posing the question of WHY PDT has't to be shutdown in the south.

Lets see, we have the oldest Dash's in the fleet operating just Florida, the airplanes have been paid off for years.

Operating costs, give me a break.

Load factors, I say again, give me a break.

And it sure aint my salary that is pushing US over the edge.

Whats the bottom line, Mainline trying to sqeeze blood from a brick.

We can go on and on about this subject, I'm done with it. Im counting the days that I am done at the regionals as well, bring on the box flying!

Good luck everybody, we all need it in this trying times.
 

stall025

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Posted on Fri, Aug. 09, 2002

CCAir loses 6 routes to Piedmont
TED REED
Staff Writer

US Airways, in a move to strengthen its commuter operations, said
Thursday it will give subsidiary Piedmont Airlines more routes to
Charlotte.

In November, Piedmont will take over six routes operated by Charlotte-
based CCAir -- a transfer that CCAir President Carter Leake
conceded "tightens the screws" on his struggling airline.

Eventually, Piedmont is expected to take over more Charlotte routes
from other carriers, as US Airways increases the number of small,
regional jets that it operates. Under a contract approved Thursday by
its pilots, US Airways will be able to fly 465 small jets, up from
70. Several small carriers, operating collectively as US Airways
Express, fly about 200 of US Airways' 500 daily Charlotte departures.

Salisbury, Md.-based Piedmont employs 2,400 people, operating a
sprawling system between Maine and Florida. As it moves into
Charlotte, Piedmont will pull out of Florida, giving its routes to
Phoenix-based Mesa Air Group, which owns CCAir.

"The time has come for us to concentrate on more hub flying to
support US Airways with connecting passengers through Charlotte,"
said Piedmont President John Leonard, in a letter to employees.

Leonard said Piedmont has done poorly in Florida -- the market is
dominated by low-fare, leisure flying -- and that its assets "will be
more profitably employed" in Charlotte.

The change indicates that US Airways is shoring up its regional
operation, said David Field, Americas editor for Airline Business
magazine. "It shows that (president) David Siegel will focus on the
regional jets and the feeder airlines," Field said.

He added that Mesa can increase its Florida routes and might make
money where higher-cost Piedmont couldn't.

The switch is a blow to CCAir, which is locked in a battle with the
Air Line Pilots Association. In April, CCAir pilots approved a new
contract, endorsed by ALPA, which allows them to fly small jets. But
national ALPA leaders have since refused to sign the contract, saying
it contains too many concessions.

The future of CCAir, which only flies turboprop planes, now depends
on the outcome of a suit filed against ALPA by CCAir pilots, said
Leake. "If the federal court does not force ALPA to sign a contract
supported by 72 percent of our pilots, we will not be in the running
for new regional jet flying, and we will cease operations
 

stb

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Florida Flying??....

Who did those routes before PDT, Mesa, CCAir etc. flew them?
CLT-GNV,TLH and the MIA to TPA,GNV,TLH,MCO,JAX,DAB,RSW,SRQ,PNS,MLB

A hint: It was called the Florida Shuttle flown with BAE-146's.
back in the early 90's.

The true blood bath will be when U merges the WO lists for MidAtlantic.
 
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