Part 91 Checklists

volunteer

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I am in the process of re-writing our checklist. I could not find anything in the CFR's that specifies any requirements for checklists in the Part 91 world. Does anyone know of any specifics that are required to be included on checklists and/or the CFR where I can find them? Thanks!
 

Stifler's Mom

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volunteer said:
Part 91 Checklists

That's an oxymoron isn't it? ;) Or atleast it seemed that way when doing BFRs with some recreational pilots.
 
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Lead Sled

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volunteer said:
I am in the process of re-writing our checklist. I could not find anything in the CFR's that specifies any requirements for checklists in the Part 91 world. Does anyone know of any specifics that are required to be included on checklists and/or the CFR where I can find them? Thanks!
Part 91 checklists do not have to be approved like 135 and 121 checklists. Just make sure they at least cover everything in the AFM and you'll be good to go.
 

User546

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When I create checklists for new airplanes I'm flying/instructing in I always start out with going thru the POH and including every item listed in it's appropriate place. From there then I add what else needs to be added, and re-order them in a more efficient manner.

No regs saying how you should or shouldn't do them.
 

KeroseneSnorter

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volunteer said:
I am in the process of re-writing our checklist. I could not find anything in the CFR's that specifies any requirements for checklists in the Part 91 world. Does anyone know of any specifics that are required to be included on checklists and/or the CFR where I can find them? Thanks!

No regs. I would make sure all items on the factory checklist are included. More of a CYA move in case something happens(Lawyers love folks who try to be original...makes it easy for them to win!! :) ). Add anything else that may be company specific but keep all the original items.

Once you get rid of all the extra stuff in a factory list that does not pertain to your airplane, and remove the expanded "how to" lines, the factory list can normally be broken down to one page front and back for the normals. I always kept the factory QRH's though (emerg action).
 

mattpilot

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I don't believe there is a reg specifying you need a checklist, but i do know that DPE's are required to test the applicant on the proper use of checklists.

So......


As for a proper checklist - its always as the AFM/POH specifies and then additional items you feel like checking.
 

KigAir

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Why not use a ready made checklist? They only cost a few bucks and are very comprehensive.
 

midlifeflyer

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KigAir said:
Why not use a ready made checklist? They only cost a few bucks and are very comprehensive.
Personal or organizational checklists usually account for local perferred operating procedures or known problem areas that are not necessarily covered by some general checklist writer.
 

pilotyip

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When you build a checklist, make it a check list not a to do list. I have seen C-172 checklists longer than our DC-9 checklist. Such things as VSI - checked, HSI Checked, ADI - Checked, Airspeed indicator checked, etc. as opposed to Flt Insts - 230 degrees, Checked
 

minitour

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pilotyip said:
When you build a checklist, make it a check list not a to do list.

Can I get an "AMEN!". Nothing scares me more while instructing than a student, head down, doing a "before landing checklist" on short final.

I feel so bad for instructors that flew with me before I realized it was called a "check list" not "see and do list".

Regarding your own checklists. No regs, so...whatever you like really. Just cover the AFM/POH. And make your own...I like that idea better than a "ready made" checklist. While there's a company out there that makes super checklists, I still wish my student had made his own. Get's you in the POH and learning about the plane before you get into it.

JMHO

-mini
 

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Thanks for the info. The manufacturer's checklist is extremely long and painful. I am trying to clean it up and make it more user friendly. I wanted to make sure that there wasn't a CFR out there that I didn't see that would get me in a sling. We definitely do a "flow" concept similar to airlines and back ourselves up with the checklists. We are particularly trying to get rid of the "how to" lines mentioned by KeroseneSnorter.
 

Mercury

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Recently re-did the LR60 checklist for our company, Mostly used the Flight Safety provided checklist and customized a few areas to meet our SOPs. The "how-to" items definatley have to go. Most expanded prodecures are related to the first flight checks and hopefully were comitted to memory during initial training. Besdies you always have a copy of them in the AFM if a question should arise. OK, starting to ramble so, Our new checklist fits on a standard 8.5 x 11 piece of card stock(, front and back, big type for those with bi-focals, j/k!!. Talked to the local FSDO about the approval process and was politely told that they really dont have time for that stuff because of low staffing. Just my 2 cents. Hope it Hepls
 

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SimuFlite's checklist is straight out of the AFM, so I didn't get any help there.
 

midlifeflyer

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minitour said:
Can I get an "AMEN!". Nothing scares me more while instructing than a student, head down, doing a "before landing checklist" on short final.
:D I do a bit of a song and dance with my students at the beginning explaining the three ways checklists are used ("see and do", "do and check" and "brief and do") and that while they will tend to start out with "see and do" for many tasks, as they gain experience, many of these will become one of the other two.

But, I explain, there are checklists that are "brief and do" even from the very beginning. You don't get on the runway, put the throttle full forward, start rolling along and =then= look down to see when you rotate.
 

minitour

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midlifeflyer said:
:D ...put the throttle full forward...

haha...funny this should come up...I've got a few students that neglect this part of the checklist. My favorite line has become, "Are we going to use full power or do you want to use all 8,000' today?". :rolleyes:

-mini
 

mattpilot

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minitour said:
haha...funny this should come up...I've got a few students that neglect this part of the checklist. My favorite line has become, "Are we going to use full power or do you want to use all 8,000' today?". :rolleyes:

-mini

You could respond by telling them that you are only planning on using 77% power.

If they are confused you should tell them to study the POH more :)
 

minitour

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Haha I'll keep that one on the tip of my tongue...

maybe they just don't wanna overtorque the mighty 172's super-powerful O-320...:confused:

-mini
 

100LL... Again!

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The problem with most GA checklists is that they are more of a "How to fly the 172 for Dummies" than they are a true checklist.

One of our instructors once made a light twin checklist longer than flighsafety's King Air checklist. It was unbearable.

Checklists need to contain items that will kill you or damage the aircraft, and anything else that improves operational efficiency, without cluttering the above two items.

If you put too many items on a checklist, people will tend to miss the important ones or get halfway done, drop the gear and forget to finish the rest.

Sometimes the culprit is a nerdy CFI who is in LOVE with the idea of airline-style operations and makes a monster checklist that ends up generating .4 of taxi time minimum.

NEVER put airmanship items on a checklist. For example: Brakes - apply.
or: When landing is assured - power to idle.

If you need a checklists to tell you that, you don't need a checklist, you need dual.
 

mattpilot

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100LL... Again! said:
Sometimes the culprit is a nerdy CFI who is in LOVE with the idea of airline-style operations and makes a monster checklist that ends up generating .4 of taxi time minimum.


HA! Reminds me of my first flight in a multi (duchess). We got .5(!) runup time just because the freakin checklist was so long. What added to the problem was that it was dark and the checklist was very cluttered. Also, the instructor was very adamant that every single equipment on board should be thouroughly checked (its a duchess, half the equipment DOESN'T work :)) I guess i don't have to point out that i didn't return for a second flight.
 
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