Park the guppys enter Trans State Holdings

[Volasl]

TOKYO (Dow Jones)--Mitsubishi Aircraft Corp. said Friday that it had secured a second customer for its planned regional jet, with an order for up to 100 aircraft from U.S.-based Trans States Holdings.
The memorandum of understanding with Trans States follows a series of design changes that includes a new 100-seat version of the MRJ, with first deliveries to launch customer All Nippon Airways Inc. (9202.TO) expected in early 2014.
Mitsubishi Aircraft, a 64%-held subsidiary of Mitsubishi Heavy Industries Ltd. (7011.TO), is attempting to break the near-duopoly in the regional jet market held by Brazil???s Embraer and Bombardier Inc. of Canada, but faces rival new offerings from state-backed manufacturers in Russia and China.
While the U.S. remains the world???s largest market for regional jets, the sector has been hit hard by the financial plight of major network airlines, which contract most of the aircraft from third-party franchise operators. Dozens of jets have been parked in the desert as falling traffic and high fuel prices made them uneconomic even as major airlines pushed through tougher contracts with their regional partners.
Missouri-based Trans States operates flights on behalf of the United Airlines unit of UAL Corp. (UAUA) and US Airways Inc. (LCC).
The MOU includes 50 firm orders and 50 options.
The company operates two subsidiaries, Trans States Airlines and GoJet Airlines, and Mitsubishi said it is looking at all three versions of the MRJ, which range from 78 to 100 seats.
All Nippon has 15 firm orders and 10 options for the aircraft.
Mitsubishi Aircraft announced major design changes to the MRJ last month, delaying its planned first flight by six months until the second quarter of 2012.
-By Hiroyuki Kachi, Dow Jones Newswires; 813-6895-7562; [email protected]
(Doug Cameron contributed to this article)

 

[andyd]

If scope relief is given up by ual or lcc pilots for 100 seats they might was well shut the place down and liquidate now instead of drawing out the pain. Imagine how much healthier the rest of the industry would be with that much capacity taken out of the system.

 

[General Lee]

If scope relief is given up by ual or lcc pilots for 100 seats they might was well shut the place down and liquidate now instead of drawing out the pain. Imagine how much healthier the rest of the industry would be with that much capacity taken out of the system.

After all of the layoffs there, 75% of the remaining pilots are 58 or over, and they are all looking for a pay raise! They don't care anymore.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[jetflier]

After all of the layoffs there, 75% of the remaining pilots are 58 or over, and they are all looking for a pay raise! They don't care anymore.


Bye Bye--General Lee

General,
DAL contract 2012 will be asking for SCOPE above 76 seats. You being a "wide body F/O", would you be willing to cave in on SCOPE and allow 76-100 seat RJ at DAL? (inquiring minds want to know)...

 

[atpcliff]

Hi!

I'm sure he would love to have RJs at DAL. It is much better than having Mesa flying them in DAL colors! I would LOVE to fly an RJ for DAL!

cliff
NBO

 

[General Lee]

General,
DAL contract 2012 will be asking for SCOPE above 76 seats. You being a "wide body F/O", would you be willing to cave in on SCOPE and allow 76-100 seat RJ at DAL? (inquiring minds want to know)...

NO WAY. My new saying: "Relief for Scope? HELL NOPE."

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[outtahere]

Is that what you said the last time you voted for scope relief?

 

[ASADFW7]

NO WAY. My new saying: "Relief for Scope? HELL NOPE."

Bye Bye--General Lee

Maybe too little too late.

 

[andyd]

Hi!

I'm sure he would love to have RJs at DAL. It is much better than having Mesa flying them in DAL colors! I would LOVE to fly an RJ for DAL!

cliff
NBO

Correct Cliff, we would welcome RJ's 76-100 seats at mainline...flown by mainline DAL pilots for mainline wages and nothing less. The days of buying scope relief for 777 rate increases is O. V. E. R....OVER. Without exception every DAL pilot I have had this conversation with feels this way...including 76ER captains who realistically could hold the 777 the last 5 or so years before retiring. The other HUGE realization from the top down is that scope also can and will impact the widebodies. Anyone who doubts this take one look at the current mess with UAL/Air Lingus, et al.

I could care less if they give me a C2K wages + inflation and cola.....if I am scoped out of a job the wage does NOT matter.

Rant over, I need a drink but can't on my meds....this sucks....

 

[dugan jones]

Rant over, I need a drink but can't on my meds....this sucks....

no worries, alcohol will just make your meds more effective!

 

[andyd]

yeah but i want to go back to work so i have to do what the doc says until they cut everything out!

 

[General Lee]

Is that what you said the last time you voted for scope relief?

You mean when the BK judge was in the backround. Yeah, I bet you told your divorce judge that your wife couldn't get your house. How did that work out? I bet the divorce judge told you to stuff it. Same effect in BK. And the thing is, you KNOW IT. These days, thanks to refinancing, we have plenty of cash and we are doing things with it (like tempting AA with offers for parts of JAL). Our next contract should have lots of improvements. Bank on it!


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

Maybe too little too late.

Not really. 50 seaters are getting parked, and scope these days also means code sharing with other legacies or even INTL airlines. It is very important overall, and I think we are all very motivated. As I just stated in the previous post, a BK judge helped with the last vote, and I really don't see that happening again. I've got my 10 fingers, 10 toes, and 3 legs crossed!

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[curtaindriver]

I think this is about replacement of RAH....contract with UAL ends in 2014. The ability to get larger aircraft is secondary conditioned on UAL relaxing scope.....which I can't imagine happening.

CD

 

[eaglesview]

After all of the layoffs there, 75% of the remaining pilots are 58 or over, and they are all looking for a pay raise! They don't care anymore.


Bye Bye--General Lee

Thats not even close to accurate.

 

[General Lee]

Thats not even close to accurate.

Sorry, 85%. United is now full of old people. The junior pilots have 12 years with the company, and they are at the bottom. The guys at CAL are salivating.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[pipejockey]

Correct Cliff, we would welcome RJ's 76-100 seats at mainline...flown by mainline DAL pilots for mainline wages and nothing less. The days of buying scope relief for 777 rate increases is O. V. E. R....OVER. Without exception every DAL pilot I have had this conversation with feels this way...including 76ER captains who realistically could hold the 777 the last 5 or so years before retiring. The other HUGE realization from the top down is that scope also can and will impact the widebodies. Anyone who doubts this take one look at the current mess with UAL/Air Lingus, et al.

I could care less if they give me a C2K wages + inflation and cola.....if I am scoped out of a job the wage does NOT matter.

Rant over, I need a drink but can't on my meds....this sucks....

I don't believe for one minute that the person who wrote the above posting is a pilot. The only pilots I have known since 2002 are the biggest bunch of sellouts and sissies who don't stand up for a damn thing!!! The only attitude I hear from them is that a lousy job with 50% pay cuts is better than no job! Well I disagree, because there are some things worth standing up for, and all we need is greater than 50% of the pilot workforces around the country to stand firm with the above quote, and we may bring this job back to where it should be!

But management will hold just a big enough carrot in front of just enough pilots to get them to fold like origami, and voila... unlimited 70-90-100 seaters at the puss filled regionals! And the sad thing is that it wouldn't take anything even close to C2K wages to make it happen. Sad but true! C2K wages plus 2.5% inflation from 2001 would put 777 CA's at 400 grand and FO's over 200 grand. And no pilot group would turn that down. You all will sellout the future of the profession for your own personal greed.

 

[crj567]

Sorry, 85%. United is now full of old people. The junior pilots have 12 years with the company, and they are at the bottom. The guys at CAL are salivating.

Bye Bye--General Lee

Gen-

Zed called, and said he was "salivating" at the notion that you will soon don your "gimp suit" again and show up at his doorstep in LBB bearing candy and flowers.

-You are one sick pup!

 

[Scope out RJ's]

Gen-

Zed called, and said he was "salivating" at the notion that you will soon don your "gimp suit" again and show up at his doorstep in LBB bearing candy and flowers.

-You are one sick pup!

crj:
1985 called. They want their joke back.
You are one big ****************************** bag!

 

[motch]

Fake announcement people~

 

[SLUF4]

http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20091002-703309.html

not fake

 

[AA717driver]

The problem we're going to fight at AA is the pay rate for USAir E-jets is about $30/hr. too low. We'll shoot for the JB rates.

But when you have RAH/Mesa/TSA flying those same airplanes for over $40/hour less than JB AND on an 18 year scale, it's a tough fight.

IMO, this WILL be the fight in the coming years. I'm reasonably confident that AA pilots will not cave and give the 70+ seaters to Eagle or Connection. (Or any more 70 seaters, either.)

BTW: Eagle has been so busy trying to GET the 70 seaters, they forgot to check their rearview mirror and now have RAH doing flying at ORD. They let the camel's nose under the tent in STL. Let that be a lesson to ALL of us.

TC

 

[andyd]

I don't believe for one minute that the person who wrote the above posting is a pilot. The only pilots I have known since 2002 are the biggest bunch of sellouts and sissies who don't stand up for a damn thing!!! The only attitude I hear from them is that a lousy job with 50% pay cuts is better than no job! Well I disagree, because there are some things worth standing up for, and all we need is greater than 50% of the pilot workforces around the country to stand firm with the above quote, and we may bring this job back to where it should be!

But management will hold just a big enough carrot in front of just enough pilots to get them to fold like origami, and voila... unlimited 70-90-100 seaters at the puss filled regionals! And the sad thing is that it wouldn't take anything even close to C2K wages to make it happen. Sad but true! C2K wages plus 2.5% inflation from 2001 would put 777 CA's at 400 grand and FO's over 200 grand. And no pilot group would turn that down. You all will sellout the future of the profession for your own personal greed.

Initially I took offense at your response, but then I took some time (as I currently have a lot of time on my hands) and went back and read all of your previous posts. I am very sorry for you and what you have been through as it has turned you into a very bitter, vindictive and unhappy person with nothing but negative things to say about any topic/thread. Perhaps if you are so burnt out, down trodden and hate this career field so much....you should look elsewhere for a career outside of aviation. Your limited views and personal experiences have skewed your opinions so much to the negative that you lump ALL pilots into a hapless sellout me me me category. After reading all of your previous posts and realizing the utter void of intelligent rational thought that goes into them I have lumped you into the same category of poster with Tanker Clown and Instructor Dude. Here's to the Ignore option! Good Riddance!

 

[curtaindriver]

Initially I took offense at your response, but then I took some time (as I currently have a lot of time on my hands) and went back and read all of your previous posts. I am very sorry for you and what you have been through as it has turned you into a very bitter, vindictive and unhappy person with nothing but negative things to say about any topic/thread. Perhaps if you are so burnt out, down trodden and hate this career field so much....you should look elsewhere for a career outside of aviation. Your limited views and personal experiences have skewed your opinions so much to the negative that you lump ALL pilots into a hapless sellout me me me category. After reading all of your previous posts and realizing the utter void of intelligent rational thought that goes into them I have lumped you into the same category of poster with Tanker Clown and Instructor Dude. Here's to the Ignore option! Good Riddance!

Andyd,

I think you completely misunderstood his post. He was complimenting you on your stance and understanding of the scope problems. There are a lot of pilots who believe exactly what he said, and history supports this. Hopefully more and more people like yourself will infiltrate the ranks and stop the scope erosion plague.

CD

 

[jayme]

... The other HUGE realization from the top down is that scope also can and will impact the widebodies. Anyone who doubts this take one look at the current mess with UAL/Air Lingus, et al.

I could care less if they give me a C2K wages + inflation and cola.....if I am scoped out of a job the wage does NOT matter.

Rant over, I need a drink but can't on my meds....this sucks....

The thing is... you WON'T be scoped out of a job. You will face the dilemma of selling out future pilots - the "scum" slugging it out at the regionals - vs. padding your paycheck for a few years. I don't know how you'll vote, but I know how the majority will: The same way the majority of your predecessors did. ME ME ME!!! It's human nature, man.

 

[pipejockey]

After reading all of your previous posts and realizing the utter void of intelligent rational thought that goes into them I have lumped you into the same category of poster with Tanker Clown and Instructor Dude. Here's to the Ignore option! Good Riddance!

Funny how he put a guy like me who actually agreed with his thoughts on standing firm about scope relief on his ignore list. Perhaps it was he, who was not intelligent enough to understand the meaning behind my post. What a shame. Typical pilot who actually can't even figure out who stands with him and who wants to cut his throat, so what do pilots do in that case? They all cut each others throats instead of the throats that need to be cut...MANAGEMENTS!!!

Your limited views and personal experiences have skewed your opinions so much to the negative that you lump ALL pilots into a hapless sellout me me me category.

No I don't lump ALL pilots into the sellout category. I lump the MAJORITY, as thats all it takes to approve these contracts we have seen since 2002 that the rat bastards in management have gotten away with, all the while they have not had to feel the pain. And it's true that ones personal experiences with people and things has a tendency to skew ones opinions of those very things. And since I have had nothing but bad experiences with this industry, your comment about me is like saying the sky is blue! Not an epiphany is it?

Andyd,

I think you completely misunderstood his post. He was complimenting you on your stance and understanding of the scope problems. There are a lot of pilots who believe exactly what he said, and history supports this. Hopefully more and more people like yourself will infiltrate the ranks and stop the scope erosion plague.

CD

Hmm, perhaps you are one of the 10%ers. Thats is, one of the pilots in this industry that actually can understand the problem and not tell another one of the 10%ers like me, to get out of the industry. News flash for andyd...by getting rid of the people like me who will stand strongly beside you against scope relief for management, is not the way you actually win the battle you seem interested in fighting. Whether you like me or not! So you keep surrounding yourself with the members of the 90%ers, that is the sissies, and me me me sellouts, and keep offending the people who support your stand, and you're sure to lose! Good Luck, you'll need it!!

 

[andyd]

You are right sir and I stand corrected and apologize. In the future I won't post when i'm pissed off and tired!

Cheers.