turbodriver
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NWA Wants....WHAT?
- Thread starter Deli Guy
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waverunner
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Lear70
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I've been saying this for the last several years... all the focusing on preserving pensions was NEVER going to amount to jack sh*t. It's gone. Period. Now it's time to focus on saving jobs at a wage that's livable.
The really depressing thought is that, at the new pay scale they propose, I'll make more as a 5 year CRJ CA than I would as a 10 year DC-9 driver. I'm sure it won't get quite that bad (the judge would likely not allow them to cut THAT deep) but it's depressing the company would even try.
Sad what all this is coming to...
The really depressing thought is that, at the new pay scale they propose, I'll make more as a 5 year CRJ CA than I would as a 10 year DC-9 driver. I'm sure it won't get quite that bad (the judge would likely not allow them to cut THAT deep) but it's depressing the company would even try.
Sad what all this is coming to...
Hey IB6
I don’t interpret his message as a threat but rather as a matter of fact. Obviously the issues with their contract, work rules, and lifestyle degrade, are not the fault of jetBlue pilots. All we are is a convenient punching bag. The dilemma is that no one with the ability is correcting the miss-information.
For anyone that depends on NWA for your commute you should carry a non-rev pass as a back up. You can obtain a pass authorization by filling out an online form on the Pass Bureau website:
Also, please continue to send any reports of jumpseat issues on NWA. Each report is followed up with and is the only avenue we are offered toward a remedy at this point. We’ve been assured that each incident is followed up with the offender. We need: DATE, LOCATION, FLT #, CITY PAIR, and the name of the captain if possible.
As we persist to work on this issues, please continue to welcome all our off line jumpseat riders with our renown hospitality. Any type of retaliation or intimidation would only further deteriorate this situation.
I can only tell you that this is really isolated. I have not heard of any conspiricy to deny a js pass to anyone and I apologise for any disgruntled Capts who have inconvienced your pilots. This is not widespread that I know of and I will post it on the ALPA web board. I just called our JS rep and left a message to call me back. The topic of my discussion will be that instead of saying it is the Capt's discression, it should be accompanied by a lecture on being an a$$hole.
In defense of Nu Guy,
If you have a beef, rather than venting here, I suggest that you have your Jumpseat Coordinator (or equivalent representitive of your pilot group) call 1-800-NWA-ALPA. Ask for the contact point for our JS Coordinator. Please provide details such as flight number, departure point and date, name and contact point for your pilot denied boarding, and any other pertinent details.
If these are multiple events, as you seem to allude to, provide those details as well.
Our JS guy is fastidious about following up on things like this. After you hear back, be a sport and post what you found out.
I really do not think he was being sarcastic. I think he was trying to get some action taken because nobody should be doing this. I am sure that the Capt's involved are "head up their a$$" types who are living 30% beyond their means and somehow missed that the landscape in the aviation industry has changed. I think Nu Guy is as appalled as 99.9% of our guys are/will be when they hear this.
Deli
I don’t interpret his message as a threat but rather as a matter of fact. Obviously the issues with their contract, work rules, and lifestyle degrade, are not the fault of jetBlue pilots. All we are is a convenient punching bag. The dilemma is that no one with the ability is correcting the miss-information.
For anyone that depends on NWA for your commute you should carry a non-rev pass as a back up. You can obtain a pass authorization by filling out an online form on the Pass Bureau website:
Also, please continue to send any reports of jumpseat issues on NWA. Each report is followed up with and is the only avenue we are offered toward a remedy at this point. We’ve been assured that each incident is followed up with the offender. We need: DATE, LOCATION, FLT #, CITY PAIR, and the name of the captain if possible.
As we persist to work on this issues, please continue to welcome all our off line jumpseat riders with our renown hospitality. Any type of retaliation or intimidation would only further deteriorate this situation.
I can only tell you that this is really isolated. I have not heard of any conspiricy to deny a js pass to anyone and I apologise for any disgruntled Capts who have inconvienced your pilots. This is not widespread that I know of and I will post it on the ALPA web board. I just called our JS rep and left a message to call me back. The topic of my discussion will be that instead of saying it is the Capt's discression, it should be accompanied by a lecture on being an a$$hole.
In defense of Nu Guy,
If you have a beef, rather than venting here, I suggest that you have your Jumpseat Coordinator (or equivalent representitive of your pilot group) call 1-800-NWA-ALPA. Ask for the contact point for our JS Coordinator. Please provide details such as flight number, departure point and date, name and contact point for your pilot denied boarding, and any other pertinent details.
If these are multiple events, as you seem to allude to, provide those details as well.
Our JS guy is fastidious about following up on things like this. After you hear back, be a sport and post what you found out.
I really do not think he was being sarcastic. I think he was trying to get some action taken because nobody should be doing this. I am sure that the Capt's involved are "head up their a$$" types who are living 30% beyond their means and somehow missed that the landscape in the aviation industry has changed. I think Nu Guy is as appalled as 99.9% of our guys are/will be when they hear this.
Deli
Last edited:
Deli Guy
I posted a fairly sarcastic post, which usually gets lost when it is read over the internet versus hearing it in person. I wanted to draw attention to the fact that some of us who live in NWA cities are getting a little frustrated. It was just isolated incidents up until last week. Last week it happened to three different people. It is now becoming something more than isolated. Not a whole lot we can do about it, except keep reporting these incidents. From the looks of the reply from the NWA JS coodinator, his position is there is not a lot he can do about it either. I had this happen to me about 6 months ago, along with 2 or 3 others, and they were all reported. Through this all we have never ceased to welcome any and all NWA employees that qualify to the 4 jumpseats we offer, and any of the 156 seats that are empty. We would like to see something done about it, because if it continues I can assure you that the welcome may not be as warm in the future. That is certainly not a threat, but the attitude of some of our guys is going downhill when this shat keeps happening. What will that solve? Absolutely nothing but get us further from where we would like to be, but if you kick your dog enough times...well...you know. This is happening in MEM, MSP, and DTW, and I know because I have spoken first hand with some of our pilots that live in these cities. Some of us are being treated like scabs, many of us are furloughed from legacy carriers, all of us just want to have a career that gets the bills paid. I don't think we should have to run around with a pay stub and a copy of our work rules to help smooth things over when we are asking for a ride to work. Personally, I jumpseat on NWA usually twice a week. The majority of guys have been jovial and professional, "no problem, welcome aboard"...20-30% are a little frosty, but whatever, and a select few have been ugly. The main purpose of my original post was to do two things, (1)point out that this is becoming something more than just the occasional isolated incident, and (2) point out that we carry a lot of NWA people to work, that without us would have a beatch of a time getting there. Rant over, I want to thank you for trying to get involved and somehow help the situation out a little.
I posted a fairly sarcastic post, which usually gets lost when it is read over the internet versus hearing it in person. I wanted to draw attention to the fact that some of us who live in NWA cities are getting a little frustrated. It was just isolated incidents up until last week. Last week it happened to three different people. It is now becoming something more than isolated. Not a whole lot we can do about it, except keep reporting these incidents. From the looks of the reply from the NWA JS coodinator, his position is there is not a lot he can do about it either. I had this happen to me about 6 months ago, along with 2 or 3 others, and they were all reported. Through this all we have never ceased to welcome any and all NWA employees that qualify to the 4 jumpseats we offer, and any of the 156 seats that are empty. We would like to see something done about it, because if it continues I can assure you that the welcome may not be as warm in the future. That is certainly not a threat, but the attitude of some of our guys is going downhill when this shat keeps happening. What will that solve? Absolutely nothing but get us further from where we would like to be, but if you kick your dog enough times...well...you know. This is happening in MEM, MSP, and DTW, and I know because I have spoken first hand with some of our pilots that live in these cities. Some of us are being treated like scabs, many of us are furloughed from legacy carriers, all of us just want to have a career that gets the bills paid. I don't think we should have to run around with a pay stub and a copy of our work rules to help smooth things over when we are asking for a ride to work. Personally, I jumpseat on NWA usually twice a week. The majority of guys have been jovial and professional, "no problem, welcome aboard"...20-30% are a little frosty, but whatever, and a select few have been ugly. The main purpose of my original post was to do two things, (1)point out that this is becoming something more than just the occasional isolated incident, and (2) point out that we carry a lot of NWA people to work, that without us would have a beatch of a time getting there. Rant over, I want to thank you for trying to get involved and somehow help the situation out a little.
IB6 UB9, I understand that you're frustrated with the situation, but what do you expect the NWA JS Chairman to do? The NWA CBA specifically states that the jumpseat is at the Captain's discretion. The only exception is the previously mentioned FAA inspector. The Chairman can do nothing more than call the Captain in question and ask him to not be such a jerk in the future. He can't force him to allow JB pilots, nor should he. The jumpseat is one of the few areas where Captain's authority is still recognized.
Deli Guy said:
True...I've been hoop jumping trying to nail this down...it seems that there are a few guys out there making like difficult for themselves. 10% rule, I guess.
It's no means isolated to NWA (http://www.usaviation.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=21094) , but still not cool.
Nu
Ualexpress
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Lear70
JAFFO
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- Oct 17, 2003
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Put down the crack pipe and step away... Before you hurt "your fragile little mind".Spooky 1 said:
2 months, minimum to train a new pilot. Max pilots through the program at any time is probably 40-50.
How many thousands of pilots to train?
Get real... the company would grind to a halt and Chapt. 7 would be the next thing knocking on their door.
castle bravo
Well-known member
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- Sep 25, 2003
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AA717driver
A simpler time...
- Joined
- Mar 27, 2003
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PCL_128 said:
What he should do is turn it over to the Pro Standards people. NO ONE needs a "range war" over jumpseats.
On the SCAB issue--There is a supply of trained DC9-typed and 757-typed pilots out of work between the TWA people who are laid off and TMA, Ryan...etc. Not saying that the TWA people would SCAB but ALPA created an entire force of potential strikebreakers by turning their backs on the TWA people.
You get what you pay for.TC
Lear70 said:
I'll pass on the personal insults. It can be done. It has been done, and probably will be done again. You seem to think that you are not replaceable which is the first step in a very slippery slide to the bottom. The whole operation might come to a grinding halt when it's over, but the results are the same. With ALPA in it's current state of suspeneded animation, anything is possible.
Hey AA717 driver and Spooky 1,
There are probably a handful of guys out there that have types in the planes, but they would have to go through the FAA approved NWA designed course even if they were typed in the plane. This training could maybe put 40-50 guys through at a time and would take 2 months with the training on a 24 hour basis. Then there is the in flight period being conducted by who? If you are trying to imply that at this time, NW pilots could be replaced you are wrong. What could be done much easier is to promise the senior guys higher pay / incentives (retirements seem to have settled themselves) to sell out the junior guys, reduce the "mainline guys" to a conquerable number, THEN the mainline pilots could be replaced. My take is mgmnt is trying to get mainline down to a defeatable number. I (.....gulp....) am trusting ALPA when they are saying "SCOPE IS THE FOCUS". I think they see the divide and conquer scheme and it is not in ALPA's best interest to lose so many guys.
There are probably a handful of guys out there that have types in the planes, but they would have to go through the FAA approved NWA designed course even if they were typed in the plane. This training could maybe put 40-50 guys through at a time and would take 2 months with the training on a 24 hour basis. Then there is the in flight period being conducted by who? If you are trying to imply that at this time, NW pilots could be replaced you are wrong. What could be done much easier is to promise the senior guys higher pay / incentives (retirements seem to have settled themselves) to sell out the junior guys, reduce the "mainline guys" to a conquerable number, THEN the mainline pilots could be replaced. My take is mgmnt is trying to get mainline down to a defeatable number. I (.....gulp....) am trusting ALPA when they are saying "SCOPE IS THE FOCUS". I think they see the divide and conquer scheme and it is not in ALPA's best interest to lose so many guys.
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