NWA very upset with Pinnacle

[saabass]

Has anyone else heard about this? I heard there was a pretty big meeting between NWA Mgmt & Pinnacle Mgmt about their overall performance. I also heard that NWA took over part of their operations a couple days ago??

 

[mwmav8r01]

I doubt that considering they keep getting more flying.

Matt

 

[T-Gates]

I doubt that considering they keep getting more flying.

Matt

Doubt it as you may.... But it happened.....

This in relation to mostly this past week....

 

[FN FAL]

Beat on me if you will, but I heard through someone who's family member works for NWA, they weren't happy with how the jets were maintained...long before the CRJ went in a month ago.

 

[T-handle]

I don't know how performance numbers were specifically in MEM or DTW, but flying out of MSP last week through the weekend, MSP was a complete mess- total embarrassment if you ask me. Mesaba departures "averaged" 30% and arrivals within 14 minutes averaged maybe 40%.

Because so many PCL flights were cancelled/delayed the last few days up to Christmas, Mesaba flights were delayed. However I'm not implying that PCL flightcrews are to blame. Mesaba delays were mostly because we sat at the gate or de-ice ramp waiting on rampers to park us and gate agents to hook up the jetbridge. It was just a bad ripple effect. Right now in MSP, things have not improved at all.

 

[FN FAL]

Any Pinnacle guys hit me with a PM... I've got a buddy starting class next month whose a really good dude.. keep an eye out for him.

Why would they have to keep an "eye out for him"?

 

[flagshipper]

I just did a 4 day through all three bases and I had the least trouble in MEM where the weather sucked the most. All of my problems came from the horrible MESABA ground service in MSP and DTW. 9e has wanted to dump xj rampers for a while. Maybe it will finally happen. But yeah our scheduling and dispatch didn't do too hot either

 

[Dodge]

Funny thing, we MESABA flight crews would like our ramp agents to focus on our flights instead of being told by their supervisors to work the CRJ's because they pay us. I will admit in DTW it was absolutely pathetic. We and the Avro beside us waited well over an 90 minutes to get ramp agents to load bags, after the pax were onboard. I wonder what gates those ramp agents were working instead......

A NWA pilot told me that their hotline said to not commute on Pinnacle, as they are operating at a distressed level. Nice.

 

[Lear70]

The majority of the problems were caused by the ice storm in MEM. Schedulers and Dispatchers couldn't even leave to go home because the roads were covered in ice - evidently MEM doesn't have salt trucks for the general public roads. Some walked to nearby hotels and shared rooms to get some sleep and food. Crews were stuck at outstations and reported to airports just to find out dispatch wouldn't do releases inbound. For those who got into MEM they were parked on ice-covered ramps where no jetbridge, much less a LECTRO push cart was EVER going to get the flight back out again - VERY bad judgment move IMHO by our management - those flights should have been redirected to MSP or DTW but that's the rest of the story:

Because we can only handle one base catastrophe at a time, and Mesaba's inability to adequately staff their ramp operations to handle both Mesaba and PCL flights in DTW and MSP was bad the week BEFORE the ice storm in MEM (I personally sat over an hour EVERY PUSH waiting for ramp crews in MSP for the three days leading up to the night of the 23rd and missed my flight home by two hours because of it when I was originally scheduled to be back in MSP 90 minutes prior to my commute - all Mesaba delays), once MEM took a dump, there was no way Dispatch or Crew Sked was EVER going to catch up with the flight release changes necessary as a result of MSP and DTW delays - all their focus was on MEM.

Don't shoot the messenger, but Pinnacle as a business entity has ABSOLUTELY NO BUSINESS using our "competitor" as a vendor - that's just business suicide and these last several days have proven it. Our management has repeatedly asked NWA for permission to dump Mesaba for ground handling and has repeatedly been told "No" over the last three years; hopefully this will help move the issue to a needed change. No offense guys, but the ground crews in DTW and MSP just aren't hacking it and while MEM has its problems, it's still heads and shoulders above everyone else for ground handling.

I also hope that our management will be forced to revisit their staffing levels not just for pilots and f/a's (we have canceled 5% of our daily operations the last two days for insufficient F/A's to cover) but for dispatchers and crew schedulers also. The main problem is staffing and resources (phone lines, computers and updated servers, etc).

I would like to believe this rumor, simply because it might bring about necessary change. NWA isn't going to drop us for CRJ flying - they have too much invested in us - but I think the crystal palace on "Noncaring" needs a little "shake-up" and this might be the catalyst for that change... One can only hope.

 

[T-handle]

We can point out all the problems, point all the fingers we want, but no one will take any responsibility. I'm sure after these holidays are over, heads will roll and pink slips will be given out. Mesaba folks may blame Pinnacle and Vice versa.

But Lear70, you blame "Mesaba's inability to adequately staff their ramp operations". Who the hell would want to work when it's -2* F as the high temp and -20* wind chill all week long?? I do not blame the rampers one bit for calling in sick or giving a sh!t if one flight went out on time. Hey, we can sling mud all you want, but lets not. We're all in this together and working for the same parent company.

 

[saabass]

We can point out all the problems, point all the fingers we want, but no one will take any responsibility. I'm sure after these holidays are over, heads will roll and pink slips will be given out. Mesaba folks may blame Pinnacle and Vice versa.

But Lear70, you blame "Mesaba's inability to adequately staff their ramp operations". Who the hell would want to work when it's -2* F as the high temp and -20* wind chill all week long?? I do not blame the rampers one bit for calling in sick or giving a sh!t if one flight went out on time. Hey, we can sling mud all you want, but lets not. We're all in this together and working for the same parent company.

AMEN!

 

[SmackYourPappy]

We can point out all the problems, point all the fingers we want, but no one will take any responsibility. I'm sure after these holidays are over, heads will roll and pink slips will be given out.

Ahhhhhh HA! This is where you are mistaken my friend!

IMHO this industry, more specifically the "regional airlines", will NEVER achieve anything close to resembling a professional run airline because they cannot/will not pay for the caliber of personnel that is required. You say heads will roll... I will patiently wait for the press release knowing full well that it will not happen simply because the company will not be able to find a suitable replacement for the wage that is advertised.

We have had similar instances, and I have specifically written up dispatchers for GROSS negligence on multiple issues, only to be told that they (offending employees) are given a slap on the wrist but cannot be fired because the company cannot hire a replacement and train him/her before they end up leaving. It's a catch 22 and proves the old adage "You get what you pay for"

Unfortuately it leaves us crews as the last word in trying to appease our passengers and well..... we know how that goes. Not much new said here, I just would like to see some truth to your comment about heads rolling when they SHOULD!!!!

Tailwinds-

 

[405]

IMHO this industry, more specifically the "regional airlines", will NEVER achieve anything close to resembling a professional run airline because they cannot/will not pay for the caliber of personnel that is required. You say heads will roll... I will patiently wait for the press release knowing full well that it will not happen simply because the company will not be able to find a suitable replacement for the wage that is advertised.

You're exactly right. This statement applies to the whole company including pilots not just dispatchers as you imply in your post.

 

[Monster Buck]

What cracks me up, NWA forces many stations to switch between Mesaba and 9E like it means nothing. Take Appleton WI for example. All these people do is change shirts. If DTW or MEM or MSP changed to one or the other many of the people would just change shirts. The others would still be hired from the same pool of available workers for that wage as the other airline had. No rampers commute. If you think that just because one airline hires them or that one airline has higher standards, you are kidding yourself. Its all the same.

The real problem. No one wants to take one for the team and show up in bad weather during the holidays. Can you blame them. Airline exec's use bankruptcy protection to drop wages down the drain, take their own back door bonuses, and then wonder why the average worker doesn't give a sh!t. This virus tracks through all the airlines, in bankruptcy or not. I have to admit, it is wearing on me to.

 

[dondk]

When Pinnacle comes into "take over" a station.. 2 things happen.. the salaries get cut, or they are forced to part time to save a few bucks..

I don't see 9E taking over XJ's op's in DTW or MSP.. IF they did, it would be a bigger cluster than we had for the last several days.

XJ does have a staffing issue, everyone knows it.. I think the term I hear is "staffing challenged" and this is regardless of the weather or temp.

The regional operation in both MSP and DTW are just getting too big, period... At times you would be able to see the place empty with just a few gates occupied.. Theses days you rarely see many open gates for any extended period of time. I don't know how many Saabs or Avro's per base, but there are at least 30 CRJ's per base and growing.. Sheer numbers alone will tell you this will only get worse.

As for 9E, we have our own staffing issue's, but like mentioned this is the way of the regional's... run it as thin as possible to make as much as possible.