NWA/DAL JPWA highlights

[800Dog]

Best post thus far!! I concur :beer:

No, this is the best post thus far. Where are we all going to meet for beers? My vote is the Cheetah in ATL.

 

[Superpilot92]

Northwest is parking DC-9s, A319/A320s, and 757s. Delta is probably parking a few soon, but announced defers of 777s.

Parking airplanes means less pilots, so am I missing something? Why do you believe there will be no pilot layoffs at the new mega Delta?

Somebody said something about the pilot staffing ratio of the combined carrier will need to be bought up at the Delta mainline level, which means NWA has to hire more people. Maybe that has something to do with it?

I dunno, anytime I hear airplanes are getting parked, I can't help but think of impending pilot layoffs.

We just got the staffing email that said no staffing reductions will occur with the cutbacks in the fall. I added up the number of year end positions that are projected with the new revised fleet plan and without any DAL staffing model we will have just under 5000 positions needed and without anyone leaving between now and then (which people are leaving) we have around 5200ish pilots on the list currently. I dont know how many people on the list are offline guys or people out on leave so someone else will have to answer that question. But from what i can tell with the new revised plan we wont be overstaffed. Especially if we change to any form of the DAL staffing model.

As of right now there will be no staffing reductions. We have only hired 170ish pilots in the past 7-8 years so needless to say there isnt much of an over staffing issue even with the reductions. Also there is a significant cost associated with furloughing a small number of people and sending people back to compass or mesaba. NWA and soon to be DAL will foot the training costs and everything associated with the flowbacks. It just insnt worth the cost considering the furlough will be short lived and the lack of confidence that the over 60 guys we do have will stick around after the equity is paid out. We'll see.

 

[Noserider76]

We just got the staffing email that said no staffing reductions will occur with the cutbacks in the fall. I added up the number of year end positions that are projected with the new revised fleet plan and without any DAL staffing model we will have just under 5000 positions needed and without anyone leaving between now and then (which people are leavi we have around 5200ish pilots on the list currently. form of the DAL staffing model.

Dude, your enthusiam and the effort you put in are appreciated but I'm a bit worried about you as you try to break Gen Lee's posting record. Can I suggest a girlfriend, surfing, water skiing, golf, parcheesi, or twister?

 

[DYLIN]

Dude, your enthusiam and the effort you put in are appreciated but I'm a bit worried about you as you try to break Gen Lee's posting record. Can I suggest a girlfriend, surfing, water skiing, golf, parcheesi, or twister?

Maybe it is simply his position -- near the bottom of a really huge airline in tough economic times!

I, too, as someone awaiting a class date at one of the wholly owned regionals of this big huge airline, try and figure all this stuff out to the extent that numbers allow. Flowback is on my mind!

 

[DYLIN]

Also -

I think that at least 200 out of 5200 would be out on medical leave or military leave at any given time. A portion each month also unfortunately take medical leave and will never return to the line.

 

[Superpilot92]

Dude, your enthusiam and the effort you put in are appreciated but I'm a bit worried about you as you try to break Gen Lee's posting record. Can I suggest a girlfriend, surfing, water skiing, golf, parcheesi, or twister?

Hey living the dream in the crashpad is tough!! This site is a good time waster while i am away from home and family. Also it helps me stay informed of the goings on, which during these serious times its good to be informed IMHO. More importantly it keeps me from going out and spending money, which is very important considering the paycut i took to take this job. Crazy huh?

Oh and I dont think my crashpad buddies would enjoy a game of twister here, but thanks for the ideas.

 

[Superpilot92]

Also -

I think that at least 200 out of 5200 would be out on medical leave or military leave at any given time. A portion each month also unfortunately take medical leave and will never return to the line.

Between that and LTD, Mgmt positions, retirements and people still on voluntary furlough i just dont see any over staffing right now. I too hope the flowback isnt an issue.

 

[General Lee]

Northwest is parking DC-9s, A319/A320s, and 757s. Delta is probably parking a few soon, but announced defers of 777s.

Parking airplanes means less pilots, so am I missing something? Why do you believe there will be no pilot layoffs at the new mega Delta?

Somebody said something about the pilot staffing ratio of the combined carrier will need to be bought up at the Delta mainline level, which means NWA has to hire more people. Maybe that has something to do with it?

I dunno, anytime I hear airplanes are getting parked, I can't help but think of impending pilot layoffs.

Where did you come up with 777 deferrals? Our board just approved an ADDITIONAL 2 777LRs for next year (8 total), and we are looking for more 737-700s and possibly some MD90s. A lot of our planes won't be flying in the States, where there is a slow down in pax.

As far as possible layoffs, I guess anything is possible, but we haven't heard of any yet. I guess the NWA guys were told today that they won't see any, and on our side a couple chief pilots have stated we will be hiring in the Fall.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[ThisistheDream]

I can see NWA doing what CAL is doing. Offering some early retirement buyouts and company leaves prior to any possible furloughs.

 

[~~~^~~~]

Lets be honest here. NWA is expecting furloughs this fall to address an "expected over staffing problem" (their MEC's words quoted, not mine).

They passed LOA 8-46 to try to not have anyone furloughed before SLI. This is likely the reason for the delay in announcing agreement with the JPWA. This LOA is:

Letter of agreement 8-46 addresses the "expected over staffing problem" that will occur this fall.

1)Partial month leave(pml)
2)Pilot early retirement program (perp)
3)Special incentive leave program
4)Transition monthly maximum modifications

Is this a list stacking trick? Part time pilots holding seniority numbers? Pilots on leave holding seniority?

NWA pilots called us scabs for our LOA19 which increased the floor for their pay. I'm not calling them names. Nor am I calling on Prater not to sign it. But this looks like they are playing hard against the DAL guys. The DAL guys have been playing a very "clean" game. This sort of muddy water is an effective way to confuse an arbitration.

Round three goes to NWA.

 

[Voice Of Reason]

Lets be honest here. NWA is expecting furloughs this fall to address an "expected over staffing problem" (their MEC's words quoted, not mine).

They passed LOA 8-46 to try to not have anyone furloughed before SLI. This is likely the reason for the delay in announcing agreement with the JPWA. This LOA is:
Is this a list stacking trick? Part time pilots holding seniority numbers? Pilots on leave holding seniority?

NWA pilots called us scabs for our LOA19 which increased the floor for their pay. I'm not calling them names. Nor am I calling on Prater not to sign it. But this looks like they are playing against the DAL guys. The DAL guys have been playing a very "clean" game.

Why should a Delta pilot vote for te JPWA?

NWA 4
DAL 0

It might be more effective, if you really feel that way to post this on the ALPA board....otherwise it's just a bunch of FUD to cause trouble for everyone....

 

[~~~^~~~]

Voice - The Delta pilots know about this. It isnlt a secret.

In this merger, by the time the membership knows, it is too late to do anything about it.

 

[DTW320]

Lets be honest here. NWA is expecting furloughs this fall to address an "expected over staffing problem" (their MEC's words quoted, not mine).Lets be honest here: You're clueless. NWA has NEVER said they expect furloughs to be necessary this fall. They HAVE said for several months now that they expected to handle any overstaffing by reducing the monthly max's in those categories. This LOA simply codifies what NWA management already suggested.

They passed LOA 8-46 to try to not have anyone furloughed before SLI. This is likely the reason for the delay in announcing agreement with the JPWA.
Is this a list stacking trick? Ummmm. NO.Part time pilots holding seniority numbers?How about RETIRED pilots holding seniority numbers and flying the 777 part time?Would that be better? Pilots on leave holding seniority? You mean just like they do at DELTA?

NWA pilots called us scabs for our LOA19 which increased the floor for their pay.No it didn't. The JPWA that was just MUTUALLY negotiated did. I'm not calling them names. Nor am I calling on Prater not to sign it. But this looks like they are playing hard against the DAL guys. The DAL guys have been playing a very "clean" game. This sort of muddy water is an effective way to confuse an arbitration.

NWA 4
DAL 0

We have yet to hear anything from our MEC. Maybe there is another side to this story. But the NWA report has it looking like they won another round.

Relax. Take a deep breath. We are reducing SOME monthly max's to 77 hours to avoid displacements. 77 hours. Pretty sneaky huh? We're offering some 15 day unpaid leaves in SOME categories. WOW. They keep their seniority during those 15 days too! Oh, the conspiracy!! (NWA has periodically offered a No Availability program for several years where the few pilots in the few categories where it was offered get 55 hours pay for taking the entire month off......see.....we've been planning this all along!! BUWAHAHAHAHA!!)

 

[Speedbird34]

Relax. Take a deep breath. We are reducing SOME monthly max's to 77 hours to avoid displacements. 77 hours. Pretty sneaky huh? We're offering some 15 day unpaid leaves in SOME categories. WOW. They keep their seniority during those 15 days too! Oh, the conspiracy!! (NWA has periodically offered a No Availability program for several years where the few pilots in the few categories where it was offered get 55 hours pay for taking the entire month off......see.....we've been planning this all along!! BUWAHAHAHAHA!!)

Just let your vote count and vote no to this TA. We can do better!:smash:

 

[Speedbird34]

Lets be honest here. NWA is expecting furloughs this fall to address an "expected over staffing problem" (their MEC's words quoted, not mine).

They passed LOA 8-46 to try to not have anyone furloughed before SLI. This is likely the reason for the delay in announcing agreement with the JPWA. This LOA is:
Is this a list stacking trick? Part time pilots holding seniority numbers? Pilots on leave holding seniority?

NWA pilots called us scabs for our LOA19 which increased the floor for their pay. I'm not calling them names. Nor am I calling on Prater not to sign it. But this looks like they are playing hard against the DAL guys. The DAL guys have been playing a very "clean" game. This sort of muddy water is an effective way to confuse an arbitration.

Round three goes to NWA.

We need to win a round on the Delta side. I am starting to hate this losing game.

Lets show them we have a will and win a round for the crew.

:beer: