General Lee
Well-known member
- Joined
- Aug 24, 2002
- Posts
- 20,442
I can see a lot of people are upset about the Delta TA. I admit it, I was shocked when I first saw the intial numbers, and there are still some negatives out there for me.
But, I am getting tired of the Delta bashing on this website. First of all, we have had ZERO help in trying to bring up overall wages and benefits from the other legacies out there. ZERO. The only ones to help us were the Southwest pilots, and the Fedex/UPS guys. That's it.
The last contract at a legacy was our joint contract with NWA in 2008. It was done during high oil (it was hitting $130 a barrel at the time), and the Delta/NWA pilots got a 17% wage increase over 4 years (5,4,4,4), that ended last January. It wasn't a great contract, but it did get us higher than the BK wages both DL and NWA were handed by BK judges.
What has happened since then? The UAL and CAL guys CAN'T GET IT TOGETHER. They can't. They can't come together and agree on anything. There doesn't look like any TA or SLI or anything will be done over there, and it would have really helped us out here if they had some sort of an agreement 6 months ago.
What about USAir or AA? AA took 5 years and got NOTHING, and then went into BK. USAir starting infighting, the Easties formed USAPA and the NIC award was shelved, and they too haven't done squat to move up any of their wages. ZERO.
Who has kept the bargain? Southwest. Even though some of us rag on them from time to time (they are West Texas Corndogs, right?), they actually kept the wages from falling, brought them up to a high level, and didn't falter. Even though they took over the "cockiness King" award from the old Deltoids, they did set and keep the bar high. If this TA does go through for Dalpa, the DL 737 pilots, PER HOUR, will be paid more than the SWA pilots (even adjusted for their trip time) if you add the DC fund compared to their 401K match. That's good, and the SWA guys can use that next time for themselves to bargain with.
The FedEx and UPS guys are in a different league, primarily because their companies can charge whatever they want, and will still be profitable. But, those pilots too are well paid and did a great job for the profession.
It's not about getting a 40% wage increase all at once. I don't think that happens anymore. It's about grabbing what you can and adding to it. 7 year contracts are bad. Short ones need to have good compensation for the length of time, plus positives in other areas. I think it needs to be reasonable, and again when I saw this TA, I was dissappointed with the pay raises. But, I will look over this TA and listen at the roadshows and ask questions. The emotion around this is huge, and that needs to subside a bit and then look at this thing rationally.
Bye Bye---General Lee
But, I am getting tired of the Delta bashing on this website. First of all, we have had ZERO help in trying to bring up overall wages and benefits from the other legacies out there. ZERO. The only ones to help us were the Southwest pilots, and the Fedex/UPS guys. That's it.
The last contract at a legacy was our joint contract with NWA in 2008. It was done during high oil (it was hitting $130 a barrel at the time), and the Delta/NWA pilots got a 17% wage increase over 4 years (5,4,4,4), that ended last January. It wasn't a great contract, but it did get us higher than the BK wages both DL and NWA were handed by BK judges.
What has happened since then? The UAL and CAL guys CAN'T GET IT TOGETHER. They can't. They can't come together and agree on anything. There doesn't look like any TA or SLI or anything will be done over there, and it would have really helped us out here if they had some sort of an agreement 6 months ago.
What about USAir or AA? AA took 5 years and got NOTHING, and then went into BK. USAir starting infighting, the Easties formed USAPA and the NIC award was shelved, and they too haven't done squat to move up any of their wages. ZERO.
Who has kept the bargain? Southwest. Even though some of us rag on them from time to time (they are West Texas Corndogs, right?), they actually kept the wages from falling, brought them up to a high level, and didn't falter. Even though they took over the "cockiness King" award from the old Deltoids, they did set and keep the bar high. If this TA does go through for Dalpa, the DL 737 pilots, PER HOUR, will be paid more than the SWA pilots (even adjusted for their trip time) if you add the DC fund compared to their 401K match. That's good, and the SWA guys can use that next time for themselves to bargain with.
The FedEx and UPS guys are in a different league, primarily because their companies can charge whatever they want, and will still be profitable. But, those pilots too are well paid and did a great job for the profession.
It's not about getting a 40% wage increase all at once. I don't think that happens anymore. It's about grabbing what you can and adding to it. 7 year contracts are bad. Short ones need to have good compensation for the length of time, plus positives in other areas. I think it needs to be reasonable, and again when I saw this TA, I was dissappointed with the pay raises. But, I will look over this TA and listen at the roadshows and ask questions. The emotion around this is huge, and that needs to subside a bit and then look at this thing rationally.
Bye Bye---General Lee
