Noise abatement at SMO SUCKS!!!

[FLYLOW22]

There is a frequency in the FOM, and I think on the 10-9 Jepp page. There is also a phone number. Usually they don't answer either one. I call them on the phone and leave a message stating my name, tail, departure time, and call back number. I will normally have a vioce mail waiting when I land.

Also, inside SMO Atlantic Aviation there are flier handouts with the noise abatement info available.

Basically, if you bust it the plane is barred from flying into SMO for life.

Silly but true.

 

[Chewbacca]

I wouldnt sweat it, that shiz box of an airport will be gone in 5 years anyhoo. Yuppie freaktards.

 

[glasspilot]

I believe the idea of the noise abatement departure is to gain as much altitude over the airport so you can lower the nose at the departure end of the runway which in turn points those noisy engines away from the ground.

rotate, climb v2 + 30, at the end of the runway reduce power to about 75% n1 and climb at 500fpm to the shore line. Works good last long time.

Incorrect, it's not about pointing engines away. By lowering the nose you need less power to maintain a given airspeed. By reducing power you reduce noise. It's just as noisy next to a jet engine as behind it. It's just a lot more windy behind.

 

[doylehargraves]

It's an UNSAFE MANEUVER. Forget worrying about noise and fly the airplane. If they don't like the noise, close the airport.

 

[CA1900]

If they don't like the noise, close the airport.

I have a better idea: If they don't like the noise, move away from the f---ing airport that's been there for over ninety years. I have no patience for these people who move next to existing airports. None.

 

[G100driver]

Do not like the noise procedure at SMO procedure ... go to LAX.

SMO like airports are going to become more and more common. Ever go to Europe ... better not be setting off the noise moniters there!

Get used to it, SMO rules are going to become more and more prevelent in the future.

 

[G100driver]

It's an UNSAFE MANEUVER. Forget worrying about noise and fly the airplane. If they don't like the noise, close the airport.

????

What is unsafe about pulling the power back and lowering the nose? Airplane is still climbing.

If you do it right one guy flies and the other adjusts power ....

But you are right about closing the airport. Just close it if you do not like the noise. LAX is less hastle.

 

[Rokit88]

I agree with G100. What is so unsafe about that maneuver? Your always above V2 (usually a few knots above). So you pull the power back a little bit, BIG DEAL! FLY THE AIRPLANE! The airplane will not all of a sudden fall out of the sky.

My .04 cents (adjusted for inflation)

 

[HSDriver]

Yes, it is a hard maneuver if you are trying to keep the plane in the air with your ass cheeks squeezed really tight. Just relax. Climb fast. At the end of the runway level off somewhat and pull the power back really far as you cross the sensors, you'll never even register. The plane won't fall out of the air.

HS

 

[hammer2]

I agree with G100. What is so unsafe about that maneuver? Your always above V2 (usually a few knots above). So you pull the power back a little bit, BIG DEAL! FLY THE AIRPLANE! The airplane will not all of a sudden fall out of the sky.

My .04 cents (adjusted for inflation)

In the 45 it's actually a simple manuever. Just my .06 cents

 

[doylehargraves]

I guess you guys took that as an opportunity to prove that your piloting skills are better? I think it's an unsafe maneuver; therefore, they can listen to my pipes every time I go out of there. Or, is this just my little way of pissing off all those morons that live at the end of the runway that's been there 90 years?

 

[G100driver]

I guess you guys took that as an opportunity to prove that your piloting skills are better? I think it's an unsafe maneuver; therefore, they can listen to my pipes every time I go out of there. Or, is this just my little way of pissing off all those morons that live at the end of the runway that's been there 90 years?

I am still confused ... what is dangerous about reducing the power 10 or so percent and lowering the nose 5 or so degrees?

Do your hands tremble when when you level off?

 

[hammer2]

Guttsiest manuever I ever saw!!

 

[ultrarunner]

Airlines do these noise-abatement climbs ALL the time.....

...AND, in many cases, are doing a FLEX T/O to begin with.

Pretty cool doing a FLEX T/O, then hitting the CLMB-PWR button and watching the EPR roll back and the plane pitch to V2+10.....

It 'aint that big a deal.

Next time you're at FSI, blow off the steep turns and do something useful....

...like practice some real-world line-flying ops....

Just a thought. But IMHO, you'll get more out of a scenario like that then those same old steep turns you always do.......

...think about it....

 

[ProFracPilot]

Airlines do these noise-abatement climbs ALL the time.....

...AND, in many cases, are doing a FLEX T/O to begin with.

Pretty cool doing a FLEX T/O, then hitting the CLMB-PWR button and watching the EPR roll back and the plane pitch to V2+10.....

It 'aint that big a deal.

Actually, performing a Flex T.O. will usually put you at a disadvantage in a noise abatement manuever. The idea (especially at SMO) is to both accelerate and gain altitude as quickly as possible. Assuming you're not too heavy, the combination of power reduction and pitch-over prior to the noise sensors should combine to drop your dBa to well below limits.

Next time you're at FSI, blow off the steep turns and do something useful....

...like practice some real-world line-flying ops....

Just a thought. But IMHO, you'll get more out of a scenario like that then those same old steep turns you always do.......

...think about it....

This is a wonderful theory and I agree with you wholeheartedly. But unless you've got unlimited sim time and / or this maneuver is secifically writtten into your training manual, it rarely works in (135) practice. For example, according to our training guidance the first 2 sim sessions (high and hot, then cold, ASE, etc.) are practice for the 3rd session checkride. No progressive checking here. There's barely enough sim time available to accomplish our minimum training requirements.

Now if you have a cool sim instructor, then I guess what goes on in the sim stays in the sim...

 

[bailey3083]

How is this a tricky maneuver? Climb like a bastard, reduce the power, that's it.

With LAX so close you can not climb that high. SO you pitch up to fast you will bust your altitude and SOCAL will violate you. In the 60 I find the easiest thing to do is rotate, gear up, V2 until the end of the runway then nose to 5 degrees power to 70% and coast out to the shore. Everytime I do this we do not even register with the NAO.
Now if the new laws that Santa Monica is working on passes then pretty much all jets will be banned from SMO. "Safety" ya know.

 

[barnyard]

With LAX so close you can not climb that high. SO you pitch up to fast you will bust your altitude and SOCAL will violate you. In the 60 I find the easiest thing to do is rotate, gear up, V2 until the end of the runway then nose to 5 degrees power to 70% and coast out to the shore. Everytime I do this we do not even register with the NAO.
Now if the new laws that Santa Monica is working on passes then pretty much all jets will be banned from SMO. "Safety" ya know.

Oh no, you mean I have to level off at 2 or 3 thousand feet? Sounds difficult.

 

[pers-headwall]

I guess you guys took that as an opportunity to prove that your piloting skills are better? I think it's an unsafe maneuver; therefore, they can listen to my pipes every time I go out of there. Or, is this just my little way of pissing off all those morons that live at the end of the runway that's been there 90 years?

All Flexjet aircraft are capable of a DNR (did not register) noise abatement departure at SMO. That means less than 80 decibles.

To the best of my knowledge, all multi-engine jets fly safely at V2/T.O. flaps very safely. Even after an engine failure. Best on 2 or all engines though.

If you are exceeding the 95 decible limit you are either doing nothing to reduce noise, or you are a hack.

 

[ksu_aviator]

I just thought I'd throw this out there. The NBAA lists just about every procedure put forth above, and when to use them.

http://web.nbaa.org/public/ops/quietflying/#Standard

Plus you can check your aircraft's DB level on the AC.

http://web.nbaa.org/public/ops/ac/AC36-3H.pdf

 

[anonymous1]

Damn, when did everyone in the frac board become a bunch a__holes. This really has turned into another regional board.