No more excuses= up your pay!

[Mamma]

Nope, but I have an MBA. Does that make me evil?

Nobody cares about your free military MBA. I think the poster was calling into question your incredibly stupid remarks that show you as some kind of Judas. Would you walk a picket line in support of your fellow UPS pilots or would you cross it?

 

[BigLebowski]

I agree completely with Lil J Seinfeld regarding our pay. Max pay for an airline pilot capt should not exceed 150K and FO pay shouldn't top 100K. We are raping our companies for anything more.

are you an idiot?

 

[instructordude]

are you an idiot?

No. Are you gay?

 

[jmreii]

For seven years after 9/11 i've seen excuse after excuse - and delay after delay.

I've seen management steal pensions and concessions worth millions to each of us, w/ barely a fight- and line their own pockets.
I've seen senior legacy pilots vote to furlough junior pilots while at the same time outsource their job.

It is time for Legacy carriers to stop cutting the legs out from under this industry- get their pay and work rules back up- and find a meaningful solution to the scope problem.

What progress is going on right now?
Who is working on what?

This is just unacceptable- how long will this pilot recession last?
It is embarrasing. And for many of our peers-= it is an extremely difficult hardship.

Management reponse will be, kick rocks!

 

[JumpJetter]

although it may be easy, the pay should reflect the massive responsibility that is easily taken for granted....especially by those of us doing it every day.

 

[Mamma]

although it may be easy, the pay should reflect the massive responsibility that is easily taken for granted....especially by those of us doing it every day.

Exactly! Many seem to forget that...Lil Seinfeld.

 

[Wesb737fo]

You're crazy dude. Wake up and smell the reality. There are thousands of guys who are not in the airlines that could fly the planes just as safely and efficiently as the fat, lazy, 50-something baby boomers doing it now.

Yes our profession takes years of training and a lot of sacrifice. But so does nursing and you won't see RNs making the ridiculous wages we make. Any Capt that thinks he deserves the 300k he makes at UPS/FDX or the 200k at the pax carriers is crazy.

Don't get me wrong--I'll take the wages. I just don't have any illusions about how much I deserve to be paid. First year FO pay should be around 75k and top capt pay should be no more than 150! I'm a 4th year FO and I make a lot more than a lot of doctors!!

Hmmm....fourth year UPS pilot with military background lecturing about how much Airline Pilots should be paid. Are you low time as well?
You don't have much credibility, but you are an airline manager's wet dream.

Sure it's crazy for a Captain to want $300K. It's crazy right up to the point when the sh!t hits the fan and an experienced crew saves lives and a multi-million dollar airliner.

Jumpjetter said it right.

PS. L'il J.Seinfeld......uggghh...what a disgrace for an awesome screen name.

 

[pipejockey]

MBA types are in demand and those with the know how can negotiate their pay.

Are these the same people that have run corporation after corporation into the ground, all the while pocketing millions for themselves. Are these those people with "know how" you speak of? The only "know how" they have is that they know how to screw over their labor and the American people. I suppose that scum sucking, bottom feeding, pile of monkey sh*t, Richard Fold from Lehman Bros. is the kind of MBA with "know how" you speak of huh? He was paid 300 million dollars from 2000 to present fro doing such a fine job over there, then he has the audacity to expect a 20 million dollar severance to compensate him for all his stock options that are now worthless?? How about the peon on the street who had some stock in the company that now ends up with nothing to show for it. I'd love to see that pathetic sorry excuse for a human being, run down like a dog in the street along with all the other crooks who have given the American people the shaft.

 

[BigLebowski]

No. Are you gay?

nah, but based on that pic of yours...i'm certain that you are.

dont' worry about the fa in the back...he'll never tell

 

[JoeMerchant]

So are you suggesting that we continue to let our pay slide? The oncoming global depression doesn't seem to be hurting the wages of management, or doctors and lawyers for that matter. Why are we different? Why shouldn't they share in the pain?

Management, doctors, and lawyers aren't union...yet we are.....Why is their pay doing better than ours? Answer that...then we can continue this discussion...

People like you and liljerry are pathetic! You are managements wetdream. You people have no respect for yourselves and cave at everything management demands. When will people like you start asking yourselves why you think management deserves the excesses they get all the while demanding more from us for less.

What do you want ME to do about it? I have a great job with a great schedule....Answer my question above and we can continue with a discussion...or you can act like the typical union crybaby and hurl insults....your choice....

 

[JoeMerchant]

As for the rest of you...
It takes years of training to be a pilot as well./ You're attitudes are awful about what you do- And you clearly don't know many who did not make it- or any good pilot that has died in an a/c. We are responsible for a LOT- And a lower amount of people than you think are willing to do this job at all, much less for what the average pilot ACTUALLY earns +the instability and real possibility of starting over.

BS!.....I have FO's who have taken 11 month "crash" courses (no pun intended) to get in the right seat of a 121 cockpit....Many times the captains are having to take the controls during the landing or talk the FO through a visual approach.....It is much easier to become a 121 pilot than a doctor, lawyer, or CEO....fix that and then we can talk....ALPA has yet to do anything about that....

As for the recession... it's nothing new to any of us... If 50+% paycuts and pensions stolen hasn't equalled a recession- i don't know what does. ... so now this monster created by corporate greed... That should somehow equal workers continuing to take it in the arse how?

That's all fine and dandy....but increases costs on companies now will push those companies closer to failure....Go ahead and push yours toward the cliff...You are my competition and I encourage you to go first.....

I'm worth every penny i've ever been paid in this career and a WHOLE lot more.

I'm sorry you all don't feel the same. Maybe you should do your job more professionally and work a little harder and maybe you would feel the same way.
Could you imagine any exec saying the crap you all just typed out? He!!, i've never seen the average real estate agent say anything like that.

Waveflyer.....CEOs, doctors, and lawyers don't have a union....we do....looks to me like the free market without unions is trumping our sorry a$$ union.....

Your worth what you negotiate...We are too easily replaced, have no unity, and cannot transport our seniority....No amount of ALPA chest thumping can trump those realities....Maybe it's time to try something different.....

 

[AC560]

You are paid for your experience and judgement.

Actually you are paid for the longevity of your service. Experience and judgment are not the basis for pay under collective bargaining.

 

[Mamma]

Actually you are paid for the longevity of your service. Experience and judgment are not the basis for pay under collective bargaining.

Thanks for the lesson genius. Once you get out of the regionals you will hopefully be paid for your experience. That's how you get the job.

 

[AC560]

Thanks for the lesson genius. Once you get out of the regionals you will hopefully be paid for your experience. That's how you get the job.

Sorry to disappoint I am evil management scum so I get paid rather well already. When I bankrupt your company though you can enjoy taking your vast years of experience back to the right seat and earn $21k a year because you are on the bottom of the list.

 

[JoeMerchant]

Actually you are paid for the longevity of your service. Experience and judgment are not the basis for pay under collective bargaining.

BINGO...We did it to ourselves....Experience and judgement mean NOTHING in this business and our own union contracts validate that thinking.....

What does a 15 year pilot with 15000 hours of experience get payed his first year at CAL? 30K!....Tell me again about getting paid for experience and judgement?

 

[Mamma]

Sorry to disappoint I am evil management scum so I get paid rather well already. When I bankrupt your company though you can enjoy taking your vast years of experience back to the right seat and earn $21k a year because you are on the bottom of the list.

Hey everyone, Lorenzo is back! Obviously you are not management at a major airline because lower management lackeys don't get paid squat and the higher paid ones would not waste their time here. If you are management at a little bug-smasher operation as your profile indicates, then I wish you all the luck in bankrupting us...and don't spend all your Christmas bonus at Walmart! Oh, and don't forget your carburetor heat this winter!

 

[800Dog]

Joe, lawyers and doctors have the most powerful unions in our country. They are known as the AMA and the ABA. You blame ALPA and I blame those who vote yes for substandard contracts. Personal responsiblity Joe.

 

[Mamma]

Waveflyer.....CEOs, doctors, and lawyers don't have a union....we do....looks to me like the free market without unions is trumping our sorry a$$ union.....

Screen Actors Guild, Writers Union, all professional sports....what about them? Last I checked the writers held out and got a good contract. The SAG right now is getting ready to strike against the studios who are trying to steal services and what about the strikes in hockey and baseball in recent years? There are many other unions that are doing fine and ones that are hurting. But, you like to pick and chose to make your rather shallow argument.

 

[pipejockey]

Management, doctors, and lawyers aren't union...yet we are.....Why is their pay doing better than ours? Answer that...then we can continue this discussion...



What do you want ME to do about it? I have a great job with a great schedule....Answer my question above and we can continue with a discussion...or you can act like the typical union crybaby and hurl insults....your choice....

Give me a break, you're an ASA pilot! Great job and schedule? You must not be too hard to please. All regionals suck! And mainline just sucks not as much.

So what, doctors and lawyers are not union, whats your point? are you saying if we were not union, we'd be better off? How is that? Being fired at will doesn't sound too nice to me. Management would have a field day.

 

[waveflyer]

The job is easy- if you're proficient.

I simply think it's amazing that i'm here convincing pilots of their own worth.

Joe=- you're just not that smart. Lawyers and doctors are represented by unions and several associations... their voices are heard. Hell- dairy farmers have representation. Where their career lends itself to free markets- ours does not... look at all the non-union carriers... don't they still operate under a seniority list? Don't they still collectively bargain?

Do you Joe-- really want to compete w/ me in the free market? How quick would you be out of a job, realistically?

I think you take a lot for granted.