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No furloughs at Delta!

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Time will tell! Are you on the bottom of some list?


This time I would be worried if I was in the bottom 5%. We at DAL are still leaner than pre 9-11. There is a heck of a lot less fat to cut.

As for the regionals. Don the flack jacket. I am not sure if you will see many jets replace the 50 seat flying. (DAL's goal is to replace three 50 seaters with one MD-90. We are looking at having 50 on them in two to three years)

I would be more worried if I were at Compass. I still don't think there will be any furloughs, but if there are they would go to Captain on the E175 (even at 20 a month). That would be very expensive for Delta, along with removing 6 seats from some 76 seaters. All of that leads to even more revenue loss.


Bye Bye--General Lee
 
AMEN brother.....How about this Speedtape....

Let's negotiate a one directional flow up to Delta....No bi-lateral flow...One way only....UP...

Those who want to can flow up which decreases our costs and makes us more cost effective.....Those of us who are happy here can just stay here....What say you?

I say it's a complex issue that to date, except at Continental, has never worked well.

Eagle was sold a bad bag of goods with their worthless flowthrough by NALPA, which included a 15 year contract. It worked well for NALPA because it saved them money by not having to negotiate a contract on that property every 4 years. The agreement was a sentence to indentured servitude. Their flow through has never worked for Eagle pilots. It worked for NALPA, though.

The same benefit will be enjoyed by NALPA if they have 4 or 5 ALPA regionals sign on. In addition, the quid pro quo will be a standardized contract that locks in costs for years!
 
How do you know the tinfoil hat gets itchy? Does playing in the sandbox at F.I. with regional pilots make your motor kick? You must miss it!



There are always a few turds that get by, as well as some of some great guys that don't get hired. One of my close friends was one of those that somehow didn't make the cut although he is one of the sharpest guys that I know- things have worked out well for him otherwise. For the most part, good comes to the really sharp ones who deserve it in this industry. Overall the process works quite well at DL. All of the ones that I knew specifically had issues did not make it through. As one of the first noobs on property, I ended up having direct input and feedback through the hiring process this last cycle. Only 1 out of 700 had to be let go, and under 10 others ended up with any issues. I'd say that's a decent process by any measuring stick- no hiring process is ever perfect, of course.

Although you say that CPZ was not screened by NWA, the pilots there were screened by people with a direct interest in NWA. Nitpicking- sure you can find flaws and I would have rather them have been screened by NWA directly. The system is better than others, though. Thank you, bankruptcy and the screwed up system that we have.


As far as the regionals sandbox, I have an interest in DAL and 9E specifically- as well as some of the stupid rumors that get spread. If you don't like my bulldozer in the sandbox, I'm sure your mom would be happy to comfort your crying. ;) (note the sarcasm)


btw- thank you for the congrats on the hire. I stronly believe it is flying time, qualifications, personality...and then the elusive timing issue as far as getting on with a major. It's unfortunate how massive the regionals have been allowed to get which nukes the chances of proper timing for many who realy deserve to get the major shot. Here's to that getting corrected. It's not going to be a small fight by any means.
 
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There are always a few turds that get by, as well as some of some great guys that don't get hired. One of my close friends was one of those that somehow didn't make the cut although he is one of the sharpest guys that I know- things have worked out well for him otherwise. For the most part, good comes to the really sharp ones who deserve it in this industry. Overall the process works quite well at DL. All of the ones that I knew specifically had issues did not make it through. As one of the first noobs on property, I ended up having direct input and feedback through the hiring process this last cycle. Only 1 out of 700 had to be let go, and under 10 others ended up with any issues. I'd say that's a decent process by any measuring stick- no hiring process is ever perfect, of course.

Thanks for acknowledgement that there is no perfect system. I had several friends that did not make it, that were good employees, good people, and great pilots. I know, however, there could have been things that were below the surface--I guess. However, I knew some that were hired, that had proper screening been done, they would still be causing headaches for employees and the CPO at my company. I guess one has to accept the aberation.

Although you say that CPZ was not screened by NWA, the pilots there were screened by people with a direct interest in NWA. Nitpicking- sure you can find flaws and I would have rather them have been screened by NWA directly. The system is better than others, though. Thank you, bankruptcy and the screwed up system that we have.
What I wrote, was that the Compass pilots were not screened by Delta HR--the HR that I suppose selected you. My other comment was, it will be interesting to see how that works out for the Compass pilots, when Delta hires again. A loophole will be found.


As far as the regionals sandbox, I have an interest in DAL and 9E specifically- as well as some of the stupid rumors that get spread. If you don't like my bulldozer in the sandbox, I'm sure your mom would be happy to comfort your crying. ;) (note the sarcasm)

Welcome to the sandbox--bulldozer and all! My Mother would have said, "play fair and share!" I guess it's hard to take the Regional out of a Regional pilot. Many of my friends that have moved on, have commented that there are things they miss--more comraderie and smaller pond! But, none said they were reapplying.


btw- thank you for the congrats on the hire. I stronly believe it is flying time, qualifications, personality...and then the elusive timing issue as far as getting on with a major. It's unfortunate how massive the regionals have been allowed to get which nukes the chances of proper timing for many who realy deserve to get the major shot. Here's to that getting corrected. It's not going to be a small fight by any means.

Deregulation created more flying jobs--not all at the legends. Pre 1978, if you were not military, you were not getting a legend job, and there wasn't really any other flying jobs--except in ALASKA.

WADR, nothing will change in regard to scope as far as the "recapturing." The political dynamics of your pilot group has changed with the addition of the NWA pilots--real Unionists. However, within your membership, there will never be a consensus or solid support to recapture the flying because of the negotiating capital required. Protecting what you have as a pilot group will be high priority. Bad times are ahead. Also, once the one certificate operation is accomplished, it will be interesting to see if the honeymoon with MGMT goes forth. Everyone is on their best behavior right now, but I fear that will start changing next year, and especially if the economic downturn is long lasting.

Good Luck! Aside of those issues, you should enjoy a pretty good career at what looks to be one of the surviving legends.
 
I say it's a complex issue that to date, except at Continental, has never worked well.

Eagle was sold a bad bag of goods with their worthless flowthrough by NALPA, which included a 15 year contract. It worked well for NALPA because it saved them money by not having to negotiate a contract on that property every 4 years. The agreement was a sentence to indentured servitude. Their flow through has never worked for Eagle pilots. It worked for NALPA, though.

The same benefit will be enjoyed by NALPA if they have 4 or 5 ALPA regionals sign on. In addition, the quid pro quo will be a standardized contract that locks in costs for years!

I'm not talking about a Bi-directional flow....This would only be for ASA folks to flow up....This would allow us to lower our costs without giving up pay or workrules, while protecting folks like you and me by not having a flowback....Delta might actually be interested as they wouldn't have to worry about the high cost associated with flowbacks and it lowers the longevity cost at the regional.

My fear is an Eagle style flow...maybe we should pre-empt that.
 
count me as one of those that wants NO part in a bi-lateral or bi-sexual blow, I mean flow back.

it doesn't work, it will never work and I don't want the dalpa having any more say in what we do with our contract.

a few years ago i would have bought off on a staple, but no thanks now.
 
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I'm not talking about a Bi-directional flow....This would only be for ASA folks to flow up....This would allow us to lower our costs without giving up pay or workrules, while protecting folks like you and me by not having a flowback....Delta might actually be interested as they wouldn't have to worry about the high cost associated with flowbacks and it lowers the longevity cost at the regional.

My fear is an Eagle style flow...maybe we should pre-empt that.

:bawling::bawling::bawling:

Not gonna happen. You guys had your chance. Not even a thought in the MECs mind.
 
count me as one of those that wants NO part in a bi-lateral or bi-sexual blow, I mean flow back.

it doesn't work, it will never work and I don't want the dalpa having any more say in what we do with our contract.

a few years ago i would have bought off on a staple, but no thanks now.

What if the only ones who can flow down are the same number who flowed up, and they go back down to a spot that was opened by someone leaving (not the top of the list)?
 
What if the only ones who can flow down are the same number who flowed up, and they go back down to a spot that was opened by someone leaving (not the top of the list)?


flows have never worked... they ALWAYS hurt the regional far more than they ever help. Its as very bad idea...
 
flows have never worked... they ALWAYS hurt the regional far more than they ever help. Its as very bad idea...

During my previous life on the Comair MEC, the Vice Chairman of the Delta MEC once told me at the bar after I got him drunk: "Flow throughs are furlough protection."

But we already knew that.
 

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