No comment on ASA PBS LOA yet?

[Oakum_Boy]

Exactly what kind of growth opportunites will there be for clapped out, duct taped CRJ-200's??? No PBS system is going to finance new airplanes. Ever ride in the back of these heaps? I smell a slow but steady Mesaisation of ASA by Inc. If any nice new opportunites to fly NextGen -900's come along, guess who's gonna take 'em. Not us, and not even us with PBS.

 

[GeekMaster]

I still haven’t gotten a good answer why this will be the best offer and we will get garbage later? The best answer that I have gotten is. “You don’t understand section 6 negotiations“. That’s not an answer. That’s just an intimidation tactic. You guys like to fall for those just as fast as the smoke and mirrors tactics.
I don’t even know why I bother when you guys openly say you don’t care about what this might do to the future just what will you get out of it right now. Again I’m sure that is what the people said when they voted your high paying job away by relaxing scope. I hope you all enjoy the 5+ years of section 6 you are setting yourselves up for nicely.

Ok, I've stated earlier how section 6 starts. Each party presents an opener. In that opener, each party presents an offer as far to their side as imaginable. The purpose is to negotiate to an agreeable middle. Once it gets to mediation, each side doesn't get to tell the other that they are being unreasonable anymore. They get to try to convince a mediator of that fact. The mediator has no favoritism. He/she considers both sides. So that leaves us spending a considerable amount of time just to negotiate back to the point we're at now. Once we do, the mediator looks and considers whether it's reasonable.

So then, let's look at it in advance. Is it reasonable? You yourself have already acknowledged that you think it probably is. If the mediator thinks it's a reasonable deal, he/she will NOT release us into self help.

I DO CARE about the future of this company. This LOA is a good agreement. I consider it on its own merit. Now it's your turn. I asked you previously and now I ask again.

What exactly would you expect to gain in this agreement that's not already there by rejecting it?

 

[jetracer5]

Too many loopholes? Have you read the TA yet? WTF is up with you ASA people. A bunch of whining, complaining children who think ALPA can solve everything and that the company is out to screw you over every chance they get because they want to hear you complain. Yeah right. If I could get my way, I'd just have those guys impose this without a vote just to torque off the whiners. Unfortunately, I am just one vote. I like the system and think it will be good for me. I can choose what I want to work and am not bound by the rigidity of the current system. Plus, it will make my company (the place where the paychecks come from) more efficient.

This is why I make 30K a year flying a jet

 

[GeekMaster]

This is why I make 30K a year flying a jet

Reality check:

If that's what you're making at ASA, it's because you are at the very bottom of the seniority list. Otherwise you don't work at ASA. With that conclusion, it means that you were hired with almost no experience OR you have experience from another airline and lost your job and came to ASA. In either case, it's the same result.

EVERY airline has a weighted 1st year pay. Even at Delta you're going to make less than 50K first year. IT'S THE INDUSTRY STANDARD !!!!

Back to the issue here: Is THIS a good PBS LOA for ASA ?? On it's own merit?

 

[aircombat]

Ok, I've stated earlier how section 6 starts. Each party presents an opener. In that opener, each party presents an offer as far to their side as imaginable. The purpose is to negotiate to an agreeable middle. Once it gets to mediation, each side doesn't get to tell the other that they are being unreasonable anymore. They get to try to convince a mediator of that fact. The mediator has no favoritism. He/she considers both sides. So that leaves us spending a considerable amount of time just to negotiate back to the point we're at now. Once we do, the mediator looks and considers whether it's reasonable.

So then, let's look at it in advance. Is it reasonable? You yourself have already acknowledged that you think it probably is. If the mediator thinks it's a reasonable deal, he/she will NOT release us into self help.

I DO CARE about the future of this company. This LOA is a good agreement. I consider it on its own merit. Now it's your turn. I asked you previously and now I ask again.

What exactly would you expect to gain in this agreement that's not already there by rejecting it?

I have already answered that question as well. A quicker section 6 negotiation then if we give them PBS in advance. They want PBS fast how can we not use that in section 6. About the mediator in section 6 why can’t you tell them we have negotiated PBS thus far and I think the pilots will agree to the terms if improvements are made in the other sections. Why would the mediator think the pilots would agree to something worse then the already voted down LOA. I know it’s going to be more work for you guys but I think you can handle it.

 

[jetracer5]

Reality check:

If that's what you're making at ASA, it's because you are at the very bottom of the seniority list. Otherwise you don't work at ASA. With that conclusion, it means that you were hired with almost no experience OR you have experience from another airline and lost your job and came to ASA. In either case, it's the same result.

EVERY airline has a weighted 1st year pay. Even at Delta you're going to make less than 50K first year. IT'S THE INDUSTRY STANDARD !!!!

Back to the issue here: Is THIS a good PBS LOA for ASA ?? On it's own merit?

Reality Check!

YTD as of 12/15 paycheck $33487.46
3rd year line holding F/O roughly #250 of the CRJ200 at ASA

I guess its been awhile since you have been a f/o. Welcome to reality!

 

[Jack-O-Lantern]

Reality Check!

YTD as of 12/15 paycheck $33487.46
3rd year line holding F/O roughly #250 of the CRJ200 at ASA

I guess its been awhile since you have been a f/o. Welcome to reality!

Waaah Waaah, Ive been with a regional for two years and I only make 33K Waaah. Your such the typical Whiner of which we speak that think they deserve everything a 25 year captain gets and makes.
For F#$K Sake!
Sit back down and have another beer!

 

[Flybywire44]

Is anyone else wondering why they (ALPA) so hell bent on pushing this through right now, before February? What do our union officials know that they aren't telling us? PBS provides nothing to the company until the company starts to grow, so why are they saying this. PBS was thought of very poorly by the association until recently, so what is the general pilot group not seeing here?

They'll save money this summer when they don't recall our furloughed pilots. Additionally... there will be less upgrades. We should vote no, at least the first time.

 

[sweptback]

We should vote no, at least the first time.

What makes you think that either the company or union will be interested in negotiating further after a failed TA?

The company will say, "We gave them the best PBS system in the industry and they gave us the finger."

The union will say, "The pilots have spoken, and they don't want PBS. No sense exploring this further."

And just so you know, they'll both be right.

 

[aircombat]

What makes you think that either the company or union will be interested in negotiating further after a failed TA?

The company will say, "We gave them the best PBS system in the industry and they gave us the finger."

The union will say, "The pilots have spoken, and they don't want PBS. No sense exploring this further."

And just so you know, they'll both be right.

Because the company wants this badly. What's in the koolaid that makes us think we are the ones that want PBS the most. Why wouldn’t they negotiate further? That’s what we pay the union to do. In section 6 we can improve the other sections in order to sweeten the deal. This is giving them a new contract without even having to give a bonus check. This LOA totally changes the two largest sections of the contract.