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Nji Gpac

Gruman Fan

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Like so many fellow pilots, I have seen the good, the bad and all the ugly that flying airplanes has to offer. I personally never thought I would find myself working at NetJets, but here I am. And I have to be honest; I love this place.

We are at a crossroads in aviation. To my knowledge two pilot groups have never traveled this road quite the way we are. Therefore we have the ability to make great strides, or great mistakes. NJI pilots will soon become NJASAP members. Our ranks are filled with ex-airliners, scabs, corporate guys, regional guys, old union reps, ex-pats, cargo dogs, and guys who cant spell u-n-i-o-n. It is safe to say that getting NJI pilots to do anything collectively could be characterized as “herding cats”. But like someone said, a marriage is about to happen and a quick divorce is not an option. We must find a way to work together, and integrate together so that our great company can continue on the road to success. Sure, it takes a 10 people to move a plane and only two are pilots; but without a doubt we are the key of the entire operation. And with that comes tremendous strength and responsibility. We have before us a chance to rewrite the book on pilot mergers. For the 1st time in modern history we can do something positive in this crappy business of pilot vs. pilot vs. management vs. union vs. pilot.

I flew at Delta Airlines, and looking back it was miserable. ALPA couldn’t get their head out of the sand long enough to realize they were robbing Paul to pay Peter. It was sad to watch the never-ending death spiral and know that I couldn’t do anything about it. Well now I’m here at NetJets and I personally think NJASAP has their heads on straight and have learned a thing or two from other “unionized” groups. The mere fact that they dumped the Teamsters was enough for me to acknowledge they are truly blazing a new path in this industry.

WE NEED TO WORK TOGETHER!

NJI pilots can no longer ignore the future. We need to support the GPAC effort and send them forward to meet with the union to help us merge… smoothly and peacefully. We need this to happen for too many reasons to list here. But we all have been at places that were rotten gigs, shame on us if we turn NetJets into that.

We have nothing to fear from NJASAP. If we go into this with an open mind and stick our hand out, I’m willing to gamble it wont get bitten off. But we need a few folks who can speak on our behalf and get this merger done right. Management cannot speak for us on union issues. It’s sort of like asking the cop who gave you a ticket for the name of a good lawyer.

We have nothing to fear from Okatie Management. They know we’re going into the union and they know its only natural for us to start preparing for it now. One member of management actually told me it was a good thing for everyone if we are open and proactive about this. As long as our intentions are positive and we aren’t trying to throw a grenade in the tent, I’m willing to gamble they will accept GPAC as a legitimate voice.

  • I’m standing up and supporting NJASAP. Please open the union boards for us to have private discussions. I look forward to being in a “new” union.
  • I’m standing up and supporting GPAC. I’ve nominated my 4 people and hope they will go forward and help us accomplish a smooth transition. I hope they will work with the union in getting us off on the right foot. I hope they offer their assistance to NJASAP and help them to understand our operation.
  • I’m standing up and supporting our Management. Even though I feel we have not always been given the straight talk, I do think that Bill Noe and company have treated us well (I take back the comment about him lying to us). We do have a fun, family feeling to NJI and I greatly enjoy flying here. Our management certainly deserves our acknowledgement for that.

Please get the word out… Lets get proactive about this NJI, its time.

Register, nominate, and send a group of solid people to speak for NJI pilots.


njipilots@gmail.com is where it all happens.
 

Diesel

TEB Hilton resident
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very well thought out post.
 

Diesel

TEB Hilton resident
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Gulfstream Pilots Action Comittee
 

jetlag7

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Good post Grumman! I like the mantra of solidarity and cooperation.

If I may, what specifically are the issues NJI pilots are concerned with during the merger that haven't already been addressed and worked-out in the LOA???
 

Gruman Fan

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Do we think GPAC will get the info flowing?

NJASAP has all the communication tools necessary to run a presidential campaign if need be. I think once we have a group who is working with NJASAP, information will flow through that mechanism.

NJI pilots need not fear the union, as I believe there are enough pilots here who never want to see an “ALPA” style organization again. I also believe that Mr. Santulli never wants ALPA style pilots flying his billionaire owners around the globe.
 

G4dude

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Good posts all. For us At NJI to integrate into an in-house union, we probably need to be represented at the table, for anything that might come up regarding the melding of our different corporate cultures. After all, we are vastly outnumbered by a group of very good pilots, some of whom are quite different in their views on how they want the pilots to perform for the company. I mean no disrespect, except to the radicals we run into every now and then on the road.
 

TCA

Lgt. Chop @ Lower Alt.
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Ident

I received an email asking me to join the effort to form a group to speak for the NJI pilots. I replied twice"you know who I am, who are you"?

Now I have an answer. "For job security reasons, the key organizers will not be revealing their identity."

I and others have tried to form a group to sit at the table during negotiations . This was put to B.N. and S.E. both were open and receptive. They are not the final answer in these matters and we have been told that this is logistically not possible (at this time).

We were open and transparent, we sign our work sort of speak.

My personal email spells out who I am as well as the posts on this open board. Those involved either know who I am or can figure it out easily enough.

I cannot at this time trust a group or individual
that can't or won't trust me. I don't mind working in the dark, but I don't think your my type..:blush:

Even my religion doesn't require "blind faith", just faith.

I would like to know more and believe that better communications is required. It has not been a one way street with regards to communications to and from the "Swamp" ever.

If this rattles your cage then your then your in the same buggy as the office has been from time to time. I guess that would be a "swamp buggy"

I had one blind date once and I should have been blind. So how about this time lets talk, date ?, hell
maybe we can even dance:eek:

Regards,
TCA
 

wolfpackpilot

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Even my religion doesn't require "blind faith", just faith.

I would like to know more and believe that better communications is required. It has not been a one way street with regards to communications to and from the "Swamp" ever.

If this rattles your cage then your then your in the same buggy as the office has been from time to time. I guess that would be a "swamp buggy"

I had one blind date once and I should have been blind. So how about this time lets talk, date ?, hell
maybe we can even dance:eek:

Regards,
TCA


Are you drunk? Seriously...


I for one have no problem with the organizers keeping quite about their identity. Who cares, they have no power, no voice, no authority. They did however have the balls to call the union and get us moving. They simply designed a process for us to pick a few people who could work with the union to help the integration go smoothly.

When the GPAC team is formed, they will have to show the union they were selected through a process that was legal and fair. Who cares who the brainchild behind it was.

Focus on the big picture here look and look 24 months in your future.

And put the bottle down while you're doing it.
 

TCA

Lgt. Chop @ Lower Alt.
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Why hide...I didn't.
I called em both and told what was needed that we wanted a seat at the table.

I see your one that can't have a discussion or post without name calling.

I forwarded their request to the others in my address book, thought they should know or have opportunity to respond.

Not drunk or stupid, just ignorant and I know the difference. I just want to know who I am in the boat with...
 

learflyer

Time to drill Congress!
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Did the NJI guys have to provide any customer service experience examples as a pre-condition to the merger? oh hush, I kid. :)
 

Mountain Troll

What, me worry?
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I would like to say my original thoughts on GPAC were wrong. I took their intentions the wrong way. That being said, I would like you to consider the following:
1. Why do the construction plans for building in CMH have an area labeled as NJI?
2. Flight Safety has a GIV and a G-50 series simulators on order for placement in their CMH(NJA) facility. They are being told to not issue a press release.
3. NJI was told that no-one would be forced to move, not there isn't a move ever going to happen. Go back and read the leader notes or info releases.
4. Why would NJASAP welcome GPAC into the talks yet NJI management is upset with the idea and has all their kool aid drinkers trying to badmouth GPAC and trying to block it's start?
5. Has anyone else noticed that all of NJI management pilots except one went or is going to GV school?

I understand why the originators of of the GPAC want to stay unknown, it is to protect their jobs from an emotional decision to terminate their employment from the likes of the D.O. or other head-strung management thug. It is going to be about fifteen thousand dollars a year to the average NJI pilot to switch over to NJA work rules. Thats what NJI management wants to fight. Will you gamble with that much income? Give GPAC a chance. Register, nominate four people that you think have a good idea of what to do. Help NJASAP get the most for NJA and NJI pilots. Thank you, I am sure someone is not gonna approve of this message!
 

Cavpilot

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Joined
Nov 26, 2001
Posts
249
G Fan, Troll, Et. Al.,

I think you guys are on the right track here. Having a voice is a good thing for all parties involved. It could potentially avoid some bad decisions made through ignorance with the best of intentions. What I don't understand is how GPAC intends to approach the situation. Not having legal and recognized representation throws a wrench into the works. I think that all parties (NJA Management, NJASAP and NJI Pilots) pretty much want the same things, so this should not be a contentious event so long as one group is not angling to gain an unfair advantage over another.
 

jenex

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I don't believe a minority group of 350 pilots will be fairly represented by a majority group of 2800 pilots.
This is about wanting more higher paying seats in the scope of the contract. Then when the contract is up for renogation in 2016, there will be no more fences left. The will of the many will out weigh those of the few.
 

Gruman Fan

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What I don't understand is how GPAC intends to approach the situation. Not having legal and recognized representation throws a wrench into the works.

Cav,

NJASAP leadership is way out in front of this thing. They are already in contact with the organizers and I know personally that communications are wide open!

The only thing the GPAC organizers have to show is a legal, fair and honest method in electing the GPAC. Once these 4 people step forward, they are automatically protected under the NMB because the NJASAP leadership will accept them and the method they were formed under. Management could mess with the organizers, but they cant touch the GPAC members.

Management can also choose (a mistake if they do) to totally ignore GPAC and shut the door. It would be ashame for that to happen, but it doesnt change anything because GPAC will be "NJASAP" for the interm.

This is an absolutely brilliant plan, and Im smiling from ear to ear because for once, it seems that pilots out smarted management. Sorry, just had to say that.

To follow on Trolls line of thought:

  • Why hasnt management sent a letter to the organizers asking for a meeting if they are so concerned about GPAC?
  • Why havent we heard "ANYTHING" of substance from management about the intergration or the process?
  • Why is management willfully violating the NJASAP contract and sending NJA FO's through upgrade class for the GIV?
  • Why hasnt management contact one of the dozen or so NJI pilots who stepped up and asked to help with the integration process?
For years senior management kept the two pilot groups seperate and fearful of each other by playing one another off. They didn't want us together for a very good reason... and we are seeing why; once together, NetJets pilots will be a powerful voice. NJA pilots pushed and pushed and pushed (while NJI pilots did nothing, sorry 'bout that :erm:) and broke the wall down. Now its our turn NJI guys and gals. Step up and be people of character! Register, nominate, and vote. Bring GPAC to the table. The union has extended an invitation.
 

ozpilot

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  • Why is management willfully violating the NJASAP contract and sending NJA FO's through upgrade class for the GIV?

Would love to hear more about this! If its true the proverbial will hit the fan on the NJA side!
 

wolfpackpilot

Diehard Republican
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I don't believe a minority group of 350 pilots will be fairly represented by a majority group of 2800 pilots.


I totally disagree, (respectfully).

There will be no minority in the future if we do this thing right the 1st time. I have no interest in being part of a divided group, NONE!

I'm willing to learn from my past, put aside a little anger (no NetJetsWife, we're not gonna be buds), respect the leaders of NJASAP, stick my hand out and make sure we integrate two professional groups of pilots with one collective voice that speaks for all without holding grudges from the past.

My declaration (this is serious):

I, Wolfpackpilot, do hereby state that from this date forward I will never refer to any pilot (to include NetJets Europe) that operates a QS tail aircraft for parent company NetJets in any fashion other than "a NetJets pilot".


My rant (this is not serious):

Now... please support GPAC and get on board this bus, its leaving KSAV and will soon be arriving in KCMH. Approximate travel time is 1 to 24 months. All those pilots holding valid GPAC support cards will be given 1st choice on bus seating, where we stop for gas and snacks, bathroom rights, sightseeing stops, and movies played on the DVD system. All other pilots will be given a bag lunch, a mason jar, and placed under the bus.
 

Going2Golf

Facta, non verba
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:
1. Why do the construction plans for building in CMH have an area labeled as NJI?
2. Flight Safety has a GIV and a G-50 series simulators on order for placement in their CMH(NJA) facility. They are being told to not issue a press release.
3. NJI was told that no-one would be forced to move, not there isn't a move ever going to happen. Go back and read the leader notes or info releases.

Troll,

Having a area in the "campus" when its built in CMH makes sense, its not going to be locked off behind closed doors, probably just some class rooms set aside for training and such.

As for Sims on order for CMH, that makes sense to centralize training and if they are building the largest FSI in the world why not put all of the training under one roof.

NJI pilots will probably not be forced to move, the same can not be said for the instructors at FSI-SAV. If they want to keep instructing for NJI they might have to move to CMH. Or are you counting the contract employees of a separate company as NJI employees?
 
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