NJA TA in principal reached!!!

[realityman]

Latest info on the coming TA: Better gains than 2005/2007 contract, healthcare remains same (funded by company), COLA added, extend FO pay scales, bonuses based on months of service (no penalty for furlough time).

That is all I know for now. Waiting to read the whole document.

Oh, and I hope retirement is greatly improved!

 

[Helmsalee]

Prediction! G4 will be on here soon saying that he hopes that the gains don't make the company noncompetitive. He will say the contract will sink NJ. Any bets on how long before that shows up?
Helm

 

[imacdog]

He'll also say the TA had nothing to do with our public-facing campaign.

 

[realityman]

He'll also say the TA had nothing to do with our public-facing campaign.

True. It was probably a letter from AJ to WB that got us the TA.

 

[Diesel]

True. It was probably a letter from AJ to WB that got us the TA.

Lol now your sounding like the guy I flew with that was amazed that the union thought they had anything to do with getting hansel fired. lol

 

[Imissmypilot]

I'll be interested to see if this thing comes out with an enforcement from your E-board.

Said they would not put anything out that they wouldn't endorse.

Unless what they're quietly endorsing is a move towards a strike,, right?

I'm hoping you guys got everything you want and then some. Unlike the poster above, what little I've heard is unimpressive but admittedly it's still all rumor. So, in light of that possibility, let's just play devils advocate for a minute.

If it's a real $hit sandwich and the negotiations weren't going anywhere, wouldn't it be a precursor move to an effective strike to just put out something vanilla and have a resounding NO! vote on the TA?

What are the bylaws and/or federal regs regarding strikes? Aren't there some dominoes that have to fall first? Maybe they're just taking care of the dominoes.

Not trying to stir the pot, just honestly asking as one who's not offended by the concept of choking the golden goose til it lays it's egg.

 

[imacdog]

I'm willing to bet there's a reason that the union decided to not press forward with the NYC picket. We'll see when the actual details come out.

 

[acaTerry]

LOL

You're just desperate to get away from flying with me again as fast as you can so it SEEMS like your bid is taking forever...

Nah I gotta fly with you enough to butter up some free high-powered range time first, then you'll have served your purpose.
Seriously though, bringing my jerky next time. You'll piss on Jack Link.

 

[av8trinabarrel]

Lets hope he found the nearest rock and crawled back under it after getting Pedro's email. Excellent work ladies/gents. Sure makes going out for 7 tomorrow a little more bearable!!!

 

[acaTerry]

He'll also say the TA had nothing to do with our public-facing campaign.

I'm glad y'alls furlough doesn't count against your service time for the bonus. That was an unexpected plus.

 

[gunfyter]

Unless what they're quietly endorsing is a move towards a strike,, right?

I'm hoping you guys got everything you want and then some. Unlike the poster above, what little I've heard is unimpressive but admittedly it's still all rumor. So, in light of that possibility, let's just play devils advocate for a minute.

If it's a real $hit sandwich and the negotiations weren't going anywhere, wouldn't it be a precursor move to an effective strike to just put out something vanilla and have a resounding NO! vote on the TA?

What are the bylaws and/or federal regs regarding strikes? Aren't there some dominoes that have to fall first? Maybe they're just taking care of the dominoes.

Not trying to stir the pot, just honestly asking as one who's not offended by the concept of choking the golden goose til it lays it's egg.

We have little to no solid info. However, the E-board and the NC have stated very clearly over the last many months that no TA would be presented unless it was something they believed the membership should endorse and that they believed would be ratified.

I strongly suspect this will be a deal that should pass in the election.

I also suspect this because management erred in 2004 by offering a deal so horrible that the reaction was so unanimously negative it resulted in a far more expensive contract for them just a year later. They won't want to make that mistake again.

 

[realityman]

They won't want to make that mistake again.

BWahahahahahahahaaaa!!!

You honestly think this management team has learned ANYTHING from the past?

If this TA is good enough to be ratified, it's because our union leadership has learned from the past. It's because pilots, slow as many in our group have been on the uptake, have figured it out.

But a TA that's good enough to ratify because MANAGEMENT learned anything?! My goodness! What, in all their actions from the start of this, would give you any idea that they learned anything from the past?

Our best relationship we ever had with management, where both parties were relatively happy and were pulling on the same end of the rope which allowed the company to prosper like crazy was with IBB. If they had learned from the past then we would have seen this negotiation mirror IBB. And no, this "new" EMT did not take that road until we forced them to. Things got incredibly nasty, we forced JH out and embarrassed WB, and only THEN did our current EMT (who were the "old" EMT that worked with JH) decide to seriously negotiate.

They've learned nothing.

 

[G4dude]

Nah I gotta fly with you enough to butter up some free high-powered range time first, then you'll have served your purpose.
Seriously though, bringing my jerky next time. You'll piss on Jack Link.

An augmented trip with acaTerry and Gutshot, heaven!

 

[G4dude]

Prediction! G4 will be on here soon saying that he hopes that the gains don't make the company noncompetitive. He will say the contract will sink NJ. Any bets on how long before that shows up?
Helm

I would be saying those things but for the pilot shortage. The marketplace, along with the union, forced NJA to give us a good deal and it won't harm the company. I am really glad the FOs will get a significant bump.

 

[realityman]

I would be saying those things but for the pilot shortage. The marketplace, along with the union, forced NJA to give us a good deal and it won't harm the company. I am really glad the FOs will get a significant bump.

You do know that, as of right now, NJA has plenty of qualified applicants trying to come to work here?

Funny comments from you considering you called union "fanatics" ignorant of market forces. The current market forces would show NJA has no need to be worried about any pilot shortage.

And shortage or not, either the CBA will be affordable or not. A pilot shortage makes no difference in what the company can afford.

At least you give some credit to the union for this deal. Maybe you CAN be taught!

 

[G4dude]

You do know that, as of right now, NJA has plenty of qualified applicants trying to come to work here?

Funny comments from you considering you called union "fanatics" ignorant of market forces. The current market forces would show NJA has no need to be worried about any pilot shortage.

And shortage or not, either the CBA will be affordable or not. A pilot shortage makes no difference in what the company can afford.

At least you give some credit to the union for this deal. Maybe you CAN be taught!

The shortage has EVERYTHING to do with what the company can afford. If the marketplace forces our competitors to pay more too, then NJA is not harmed by treating us generously. And those applicants are also applying at the majors.

 

[realityman]

The shortage has EVERYTHING to do with what the company can afford. If the marketplace forces our competitors to pay more too, then NJA is not harmed by treating us generously. And those applicants are also applying at the majors.

Have you seen or heard of our competitors paying more for pilots?

Still, nothing to do with it. The number of pilots available has zero to do with the company's revenue stream. Either they have the money to cover our costs, or they don't. If they do, our CBA won't harm them (it may affect how much WB puts in his bank account). If they don't, then we're doomed.

 

[Diesel]

The shortage has EVERYTHING to do with what the company can afford. If the marketplace forces our competitors to pay more too, then NJA is not harmed by treating us generously. And those applicants are also applying at the majors.

Lol you still don't understand.

But you're welcome for all the hard work that your fellow brothers and sisters did for you even though you didn't lift a finger and actively worked against us.

You're welcome.

 

[G4dude]

Have you seen or heard of our competitors paying more for pilots?

Still, nothing to do with it. The number of pilots available has zero to do with the company's revenue stream. Either they have the money to cover our costs, or they don't. If they do, our CBA won't harm them (it may affect how much WB puts in his bank account). If they don't, then we're doomed.

Where I think you are wrong is this: if we get a large raise, and our competitors could attract enough quality pilots without similar raises of their own because there are plenty of pilots out there, then we would be faced with competitors undercutting us and taking away some of our customers, without sacrificing pilot quality. With the shortage, everybody will need to pay their pilots more. Which attracts more young people to become pilots, thereby alleviating the shortage in the future, by the way. Good conversation!

 

[G4dude]

Lol you still don't understand.

But you're welcome for all the hard work that your fellow brothers and sisters did for you even though you didn't lift a finger and actively worked against us.

You're welcome.

Just because you don't understand price mechanisms and how the marketplace works, it still works in a predictable way. Our brothers and sisters did good work, but they were helped by the shortage. What is so wrong in saying that? if there was a glut of good pilots, a raise would have been either crippling to the company by empowering our competition, or not in the offing, which would have caused a strike, thereby severely damaging our employer.