nja owner tell me this ?

[pers-headwall]

Competition? why would I want competition in my industry. What were you "pro-competition" nabobs doing in Econ. 101. We don't want competition. We want demand to outstrip our supply of fractional jets, so we can charge exorbitant rates and all get rich. Get some remedial training on economics!

 

[netjetwife]

While we're getting back to basics, I'd like to point out that there are more "have-nots" than "haves". That being those who have enough money to be your pax. So while your picture looks rosy, I don't think it's too realistic. Sorry, PH.

With selection comes competition--an economic fact. I hope that frac pilots can view it with a friendly attitude and realize that a healthy amount can be an antidote to complacency, which leads to a reduction in service and does no one any good.

Frac pilots and their families have much in common. Please bring back the spirit of kinsmanship that Hogprint posted about. Your combined efforts could change the industry and make it the career you all deserve to have.

A note to my critics: check the dictionary. The word "deserve" doesn't have the negative connotation--asking for a handout-- that has been erroneously assigned to it. It actually means payment is due for something that has already been earned. The example given applies to frac pilot wages perfectly. To be worthy of; merit. See synonyms at earn. "You deserve a promotion after all the hard work you have done" NJW

 

[gunfyter]

Competition? why would I want competition in my industry. What were you "pro-competition" nabobs doing in Econ. 101. We don't want competition. We want demand to outstrip our supply of fractional jets, so we can charge exorbitant rates and all get rich. Get some remedial training on economics!

We want competition for pilot jobs. Which will occur if demand outstrips supply of fractional jets ... but not if ONE provider has a monopoly on the jobs.

we want a monopoly on pilot labor.... ie a Cartel of Pilot labor ... a union.

But whereas I am a consumer of pilot jobs... I want competition.

Like the ELOAN.com commercial.

When employers compete for your services... you win.

 

[GVFlyer]

The only kicker in this whole proposition is that no one is quite sure yet that the whole fractional aircraft concept is a sustainable business model. The entire fractional industry has yet to climb out of the red ink. While some economic mavens have forecast a profit, profitability for the fractional providers has been an elusive target. Not one fractional has shown a profit, ever.

I sincerely hope the fractionals achieve profitability. They're good for pilots. They provide a viable alternative to the regionals and they create jobs by getting people into airplanes who otherwise couldn't afford them. Only time will tell.


GV

 

[BombJet45]

Profit at flex

Correction, Flexjet made a profit. However, they don't "show" it because it is intertwined with Bombardier.

 

[Just Peachy]

Profit

Why would any fractional show a profit??? The owners who pay to have this service would demand money back. Pretty dumb to advertise, "Hey we're makin' money." Better to pay a bonus to the execs and buy more capital equipment and expand.......

 

[Ultra Grump]

We want competition for pilot jobs. Which will occur if demand outstrips supply of fractional jets ... but not if ONE provider has a monopoly on the jobs.

we want a monopoly on pilot labor.... ie a Cartel of Pilot labor ... a union.

But whereas I am a consumer of pilot jobs... I want competition.

Like the ELOAN.com commercial.

When employers compete for your services... you win.

The problem with that scenario is that if there is more competition in the marketplace, the players must keep their prices lower than the next guy in order to compete. How do aviation managements keep prices lower? Step 1: lower labor costs. See the deregulated airline industry for numerous examples.

If your scenario were true and would result in higher demand for pilots, and by extension higher wages, then those higher wages would result in more people wanting to enter the profession. Supply of pilots would increase, and wages decrease. Ugly cycle.

pers-headwall had it right. If NetJets were the only fractional provider, the only competition would be the cost of private ownership and charter. Prices could increase more than they otherwise would, and 1108 could justifiably demand more for pilots' salaries. (Of course, the nature of a capitalist society would result in creation of new fractionals to provide the service at a lower cost. And the cycle continues...)

God I hated my Econ classes...

 

[Publishers]

There is a reason that the standards are not set across the industry and it is the thing that makes hash of the airlines, ALPA, and seniority. In a deregulated environment, someone will always come into compete that refused to do so by rules established by others. Airline unions worked great when they operated in a fixed group of regulated carriers.

In the fractionals, there are even more issues because the product is not transportation. If the costs of crew services becomes more than the owners think is reasonable, they will bolt. The two things that will kill nationwide fractionals are dead head/positioning flights, and airline type crew rules.

 

[gunfyter]

What keeps the supply of Doctors down and their prices high?

The medical cartel (Union) known as the AMA.

There are many Hospitals competing with each other FOR DOCTORS.

If there were only one or a few hospitals... they could dictate what doctors could charge.

 

[gunfyter]

The two things that will kill nationwide fractionals are dead head/positioning flights, and airline type crew rules.

You forgot Mismanagement.

The very thing that did in some of the Majors.

Airline crew rules:

We are flying more hours now than we did before 91K. They complained it would kill them but they figured it out by scheduling more efficiently.