New Mailing from Leonidas,llc to USAIRWAYS East Pilots"

[charlie2]

I think most East pilots would prefer to get back on a contract that looks more like the one you were on in 1999. Not your present contract that looks more like 1969. Why do you guys assume that the West pilots will flood East in hordes if the Nic. award was implemented? I honestly don't think you'd see more that 20 guys move out there.

The majority of the airline pilots that I know would commute to a higher paying position...they owe it to their family to make more money. I have in the past and would in the future. I would even commute to ANC to be a wide body captain so my kid could go to a good college...wouldn't you? The higher paying jobs are in PHL and CLT and the nic award puts many PHX based pilots on those higher paying jobs.

 

[Milmil]

The majority of the airline pilots that I know would commute to a higher paying position...they owe it to their family to make more money. I have in the past and would in the future. I would even commute to ANC to be a wide body captain so my kid could go to a good college...wouldn't you? The higher paying jobs are in PHL and CLT and the nic award puts many PHX based pilots on those higher paying jobs.

And the east pilots remember what happened with PSA. Once merged the company closed all west bases and all the PSA pilots came east. Don't think for a second that if things turn bad and SWA started a fare war out of PHX the company wouldn't think about retrenching in the east core. Now that I have said all that I believe binding is binding the Nic is the list and when the company puts enough incentive on the table I might consider a joint contract. It hasn't happened yet.....

 

[charlie2]

And the east pilots remember what happened with PSA. Once merged the company closed all west bases and all the PSA pilots came east. Don't think for a second that if things turn bad and SWA started a fare war out of PHX the company wouldn't think about retrenching in the east core. Now that I have said all that I believe binding is binding the Nic is the list and when the company puts enough incentive on the table I might consider a joint contract. It hasn't happened yet.....

Are suggesting PHX isn't a profitable hub? LAS wasn't and PHX might not be so without this merger AWA would be what? You are right though US Airways management has historically folded light a cheap tent (except for the heroic Metro Jet) when it comes to Southwest and I believe they will continue down that proud path.

 

[becket]

The majority of the airline pilots that I know would commute to a higher paying position...they owe it to their family to make more money. I have in the past and would in the future. I would even commute to ANC to be a wide body captain so my kid could go to a good college...wouldn't you? The higher paying jobs are in PHL and CLT and the nic award puts many PHX based pilots on those higher paying jobs.

To each their own but No. I wouldn't commute for more money. I owe it to my family to actually be home. I provide more than money for them. I know one guy who is from Maryland that might consider going back East...because off his family. Not the money. That's it. One guy. It seems to me that espousing the "never ratify separate ops" mentality is akin to burying your head in the sand and ignoring reality. How many more years of LOA93 are you seriously willing to endure? 10+? That's a very real possibility. I don't think there are too many of your fellow pilots willing to spend another decade at your current pay rates. USAPA....as currently operated and envisioned, will never EVER get you a contract. That should be obvious by now as well.

If money is the driving factor for you; you need to consider the fact that there is no other path off LOA93 for the foreseeable future other than to support the mutually agreed upon final and binding arbitration results. The several seniority arbitrations that have taken place since Nic. virtually mirror what Nicalau did. It should be obvious by now that no other arbitrator was going to give you DOH. That was never a possibility. Your ALPA leadership did your group a huge disservice by getting your expectations up to anywhere near DOH. That was a big mistake.

 

[charlie2]

To each their own but No. I wouldn't commute for more money. I owe it to my family to actually be home. I provide more than money for them. I know one guy who is from Maryland that might consider going back East...because off his family. Not the money. That's it. One guy. It seems to me that espousing the "never ratify separate ops" mentality is akin to burying your head in the sand and ignoring reality. How many more years of LOA93 are you seriously willing to endure? 10+? That's a very real possibility. I don't think there are too many of your fellow pilots willing to spend another decade at your current pay rates. USAPA....as currently operated and envisioned, will never EVER get you a contract. That should be obvious by now as well.

If money is the driving factor for you; you need to consider the fact that there is no other path off LOA93 for the foreseeable future other than to support the mutually agreed upon final and binding arbitration results. The several seniority arbitrations that have taken place since Nic. virtually mirror what Nicalau did. It should be obvious by now that no other arbitrator was going to give you DOH. That was never a possibility. Your ALPA leadership did your group a huge disservice by getting your expectations up to anywhere near DOH. That was a big mistake.

So it seems an easy fix then. West pilots sign an agreement to not come east like you suggest they wont anyway so I'm not sure what the problem is then.

 

[charlie2]

Plus you're probably a good parent. I owe it to my family to drink in hotel bars instead of home.

 

[charlie2]

You guys would really give up higher paying long overnights in Europe for lower paying Fargo overnights? I don't get it. Someone who is a crappy parent like me explain...please.

 

[becket]

You guys would really give up higher paying long overnights in Europe for lower paying Fargo overnights? I don't get it. Someone who is a crappy parent like me explain...please.

I know I would. Who the hell wants to commute 3 time zones away then fly a 10 hr flight? Not me. I love the East coast...i don't however want to live there, pay their taxes, tolls and other huge cost of living increases. Most Phoenicians like the weather and the cost of living and the thought of moving the PHL gives them nightmares.

Also, I've been all over Europe...for vacation...when I've actually had time to enjoy it. I couldn't give a rats azz about where my hotel is located. I just want to get to my days off fairly well rested. Not a zombie. Hawaii overnights aren't really Fargo either btw.

 

[reepicheep]

It should have been written that the majority of east pilots will commute for money - with those domiciles what else is there to do anyway? Commute from CLT to PHL to hold a higher paying job - big deal. 2,000 mile commute across 3 time zones and with possible anti-commuter fatigue rules in the offing - not gonna happen. And the PSA pilots didn't come east en masse until forced to by the downsizing/closure of the west. Most stayed put and went to 737 school. I think the only "flood" would be westbound into PHX. Take a look out the window right now - wanna spend your Golden Years in Eastern PA, or Arizona?

 

[charlie2]

Good for you Becket but I asked for a crappy parents input! Good for you for having your priorities in place and enjoying a good family and professional life. There are more than fifteen hundred (sorry I don't know the exact number) west pilots and I would bet that more than half don't share your lifestyle. That's a lot of pilots taking my seat.

 

[charlie2]

It should have been written that the majority of east pilots will commute for money - with those domiciles what else is there to do anyway? Commute from CLT to PHL to hold a higher paying job - big deal. 2,000 mile commute across 3 time zones and with possible anti-commuter fatigue rules in the offing - not gonna happen. And the PSA pilots didn't come east en masse until forced to by the downsizing/closure of the west. Most stayed put and went to 737 school. I think the only "flood" would be westbound into PHX. Take a look out the window right now - wanna spend your Golden Years in Eastern PA, or Arizona?

Don't understand...I can live whereever I choose and after retirement there is no commuting.

 

[reepicheep]

Take a look at the proposed new fatigue rules - commuting cross-country would be impractible if not impossible. As for moving - I think the guys/gals who live in the West generally have a different mentality. I think you'd find a surprisingly small number that would be willing to take such a huge lifestyle hit.

 

[charlie2]

Take a look at the proposed new fatigue rules - commuting cross-country would be impractible if not impossible. As for moving - I think the guys/gals who live in the West generally have a different mentality. I think you'd find a surprisingly small number that would be willing to take such a huge lifestyle hit.

Not enforceable. Nice rules though.

 

[LearLove]

If the west guys all want to stay west [side of the country] then they will have no problem signing a lifetime fence keeping them in PHX/LAS, right.

You guys can have NIC all you want just sign a lifetime fence on your PHX and LAS base. If you bid out of PHX/LAS then it is DOH.

 

[smails]

I'm sorry, but are the ones who would rather be on long overnights in Europe, the same ones who are mad when they come home and find out thet their wife has been giving airstarts to the neighborhood,the teenage daughter is pregnant,and son is wearing a dress? My comment is not directed at any specific post, but rather, are some peoples choices made in the best interest of your family, or your own selfish desires?