New Contract

[Occam's Razor]

Just out curiousity, does ALPA or any other union hand out a contract at a meeting and say "here it is, vote on it."

No, but we've had other situations where membership ratification has been bypassed altogether. 13-days into the '98 strike at NWA the Negotiators reached a TA. Since ALPA didn't have electronic balloting in those "dark ages", and since the pilot group was on strike and scattered around the country...the MEC approved the deal.

The MEC conducted a large poll of almost half the pilot group, and 80% wanted the MEC to make the call, rather than remaining on strike for another 2-weeks to conduct balloting.

Since electronic balloting, all other large issues (assessments, contracts, extensions, the '03 pay rase, etc) have been handled via mulitple roadshows and a 2-week-long voting window.

Unless you guys have been receiving comprehensive SITREPS from your union on the progress of the negotiations, and the items that have been settled...I'd vote "no" and buy yourself some time to sort through everything.

Good luck!

 

[405]

Unless you guys have been receiving comprehensive SITREPS from your union on the progress of the negotiations, and the items that have been settled...I'd vote "no" and buy yourself some time to sort through everything.

Good luck!

I haven't gotten any SITREPS from the unions since it was voted in. Anyone else care to comment? I don't know of anyone other than the union chairman in the office and management that even has the slightest hint of a clue of what that elusive contract might even contain.

At this point, I'd just assume walk in their meeting, get a ballot, check "no", walk out and head to the house. If they aren't going to give us a chance to read our contract before their meeting then I just assume start all over. What's another seventeen months? Here's another genius, common-sense idea: If the contract isn't going to be ready before the meetings, why not push the meetings back so we can at least review the thing? Pretty crazy idea, huh? Give us one week to look over the TA for God's sake. What's the rush?

 

[405]

Update

Contract is posted.

Review it carefully and make your own decision.

 

[ShutupandFly]

An eight year contract?!?!?! WTF. And I get to make less money than I would have without the union. Way to go TWU.

 

[Gimpy]

If the contract is 8 years, then I would reccomend you vote no just on that alone. It seems that the new buzzword these days is "RFP". All the majors are shortening the contracts with there regional carriers to shorter and shorter time periods. Why would you want a contract that is a lot longer than your company potentially has business strategy for? 8 years in this enviornment is an absolute eternity. If your company wants a quick ratification I'd throw it back and say then you only want the first contract for a year. That way you get to see how it works and then negotiate for a much better contract the second go round.

 

[405]

If the contract is 8 years, then I would reccomend you vote no just on that alone. It seems that the new buzzword these days is "RFP". All the majors are shortening the contracts with there regional carriers to shorter and shorter time periods. Why would you want a contract that is a lot longer than your company potentially has business strategy for? 8 years in this enviornment is an absolute eternity. If your company wants a quick ratification I'd throw it back and say then you only want the first contract for a year. That way you get to see how it works and then negotiate for a much better contract the second go round.

I agree, Gimpy.

If anyone in this office is even actually comtemplating ratifying this TA then I feel they need to have their head examined. There is NOTHING in this contract that is even remotely beneficial for our workgroup in my opinion. However, as I said in my last post - make your own decision. Make it wisely though because this is an eight year contract as ShutupandFly stated. That is an eternity in airline time.

 

[homerjdispatch]

just curious....

What would starting pay be?

 

[DispaccioDaddyO]

12.63/hr... starting pay now is 12.88

This TA is total garbage and I also hope no one is seriously thinking about ratifying it.

 

[homerjdispatch]

WOW that sucks....Paycut and all...where do they make up for it?

 

[XPOO]

Emphatically vote no and start passing out PAFCA fliers. This helped remedy our situation. Goodbye TWU and hello PAFCA.

 

[405]

WOW that sucks....Paycut and all...where do they make up for it?

They don't make up for it. The union wants our dues and our company doesn't want to pay us for what we do. So we take a paycut. That's it in a nutshell.

I will say that before this union was voted in, it was much easier to work with management on issues that needed to be addressed. When the union was voted in, that all went away along with pay raises and any bonuses we used to get. Now, management seems to be making retaliatory decisions about what work the dispatchers will do. That's how we got stuck with the weight and balance which used to be a separate full time job here. Before you ask me how hard that could be, sit in there for a shift when all of the flights are full, every flight needs an alternate or two and almost every station is whining about being restricted to 46 pax but put 50 pax on anyway. Throw in a diversion, a couple of mechanicals and maybe a computer problem and the day gets really interesting kind of fast.

Management can't quite figure out why they can't keep people here. I'll take a stab at it. This is for management:

Our job sucks now and has sucked since August 2005. Not everyone here voted for the TWU but I guess you all assume that since we're all dispatchers, we all supported it. Remember that it got voted in by ONE vote and most of the TWU supporters either quit or got fired for being stupid. No pay raise since 2005 may have something to do with new dispatchers not even making it out of class before they throw in the towel. Workload may have a little bit to do with attrition, too. On a good weather day with light pax loads, CLC is mostly all auto-close. On a bad weather day, it's just a wee bit more involved than that. None of you would know what the workload is like because none of you have done dispatch and CLC at the same time.

We'll see what happens Wednesday after the last TWU meeting. I think we'll be back to square one.

 

[Gimpy]

12.63/hr... starting pay now is 12.88

This TA is total garbage and I also hope no one is seriously thinking about ratifying it.

Don't forget to factor in the dues you will have to pay as well. What percentage does the union want? 2%,3%?

 

[DispaccioDaddyO]

Don't forget to factor in the dues you will have to pay as well. What percentage does the union want? 2%,3%?

12.63 is after union dues are taken out at i assume 2%. Also some more gems are sick time payed out at 75% where we get 100% now. 1 week of vacation for the first 3 years. Vacation time has to be bid at the beginning of the year. All this when our company's stock price has doubled in the last 6 months and we just bought an airline.... if that is not bargaining leverage I don't know what is!

 

[propsarebest]

For christ's sake, do EVERY dispatcher in this country a favor and vote that POS down.

 

[XPOO]

I smell a sick out. One day everyone needs to call in sick. Then see how well that airline runs without all of you there.

 

[Gimpy]

12.63 is after union dues are taken out at i assume 2%. Also some more gems are sick time payed out at 75% where we get 100% now. 1 week of vacation for the first 3 years. Vacation time has to be bid at the beginning of the year. All this when our company's stock price has doubled in the last 6 months and we just bought an airline.... if that is not bargaining leverage I don't know what is!

All I can say is.....WOW! I have to give them credit for new and creative ways of screwing you with your pants on! From what you guys are saying, you guys might have one of the most poorly negotiated contracts I've ever heard. It definatly sounds subpar to any comparable airline. Tell them no thanks and negotiate again after the pilots have ratified there contract and the colgan deal is hammered out.

 

[homerjdispatch]

somebody post it...Let us all see how bad it is!!!

 

[Markm1811]

sad to hear..

You know as one who voted but then later walked from the office (and I voted NO btw to dispell rumors) it does not suprise me whatsoever that you guys are being screwed. Heres my take.

1. The union Rep is the number 1 in seniority who had (and has) a grudge with the Management for ever and ever.
2. self appointed with no vote and it was assumed that he would be the rep due to his contacting the TWU.
3. I would hazard a guess that the union contract is weighted toward "senior" dispatchers which of course covers him and the management would agree as they know the attrition is high.
4. I asked in the meetings I attended why anyone would be in a union and the reps sold the group on equality and one voice.

I am sorry beyond all believe that you have gotten such a bad deal especially after all this time. If you can out them all power to you but I think with your new managment it will not make one bit of diference at this point.. 405 .I tip my hat to you. everything you said would happen has....

Midnight brit..
Heading back to Memphis..

 

[dispatchguy]

I smell a sick out. One day everyone needs to call in sick. Then see how well that airline runs without all of you there.

Back in the Fall of 2002 the dispatchers at American Eagle/Executive did that - a shift-long sick out and management had to whack like 30+ flights due to inadequate staffing; and the rule at the time was that an EGF domestic dispatcher couldnt touch a caribbean flight, and vice versa. Within hours the Union website (TWU by the way) had a nasty-gram that all scheduled dispatchers had to report to work as scheduled, and that further invocations of "self-help" we're illegal under the RLA and could subject the union to sanctions.

But I agree, as long as nothing is coordinated - who's to say you all didnt get sick eating the fish, and put the screws to the bastiges!

And I would vote HELL NO just on principle, especially if the manager at Blockbuster would beat me on pay...

 

[SKC]

Give a quick "wink, wink" on this site/PM if your office is going to feel under the weather, since I commute on you guys twice a week.