New AirTran TA Thread

[j41driver]

Rediculous, just rediculous. When's the voting begin?

 

[Eagle757shark]

By the way mr and ms reserve, here is what you can expect under the new TA: lets say you are on the last day of a 4 day trip assigned on reserve. The 4th day has one leg back to domicile. After you land and call scheduling, they tell you that you need to sit ready reserve. While sitting ready reserve they find another trip for you that overnights in another city. Now I can move your day off, so now you will have to fly into your day off or perhaps two days off to work with scheduling after they fumbled with the reserves. These schedulers mismanage the current reserves under the current contract, now we want to give them more leeway to mess with the reserves? Oh yea Mr FO you will probable upgrade under this new TA and be subjected to these horrible reserve rules, so you better think twice about giving into this mess. New hires, the hourly pay currently is $42.75. Under the new TA, AirTran will lead the industry as being the only airline that will allow management to set the starting pay rates according to market conditions, not to go lower than $38.50. By the way, you have to pay for lodging while in initial training! This is deplorable! I'm embarrassed by this junk! We will set a new low in this industry with this mess. But AP and the NC say this isn't concessionary. Hmmm!

 

[EMBATP]

one problem that the union and company will have getting this turd passed is this...no one on reserve or close to upgrade will vote this in...that plus at least half of this list now is made up of commuter guys and guys that were furloughed from others carriers and took it in the shorts and guys like that are not gonna put up with this crap any longer...

nice try bod and nc....start over...

oh and any midwest pilot better hope this thing gets flushed.....

 

[CitationLover]

oh and any midwest pilot better hope this thing gets flushed.....

which ones on here has given you the impression that they want it to pass?

 

[twepilot]

the reserve lines that have movable days off are voluntary. Don't bid it unless you want it. If you do bid it, you receive 12 days off min.

RV

 

[Kharma Police]

the reserve lines that have movable days off are voluntary. Don't bid it unless you want it. If you do bid it, you receive 12 days off min.

RV

Are you kidding, who would bid for that kind of abuse for one extra day off? I'm guessing you are a line holder?

 

[DougCorp-9]

the reserve lines that have movable days off are voluntary. Don't bid it unless you want it. If you do bid it, you receive 12 days off min.

RV

Wrong. Read the TA. Where does it say that all reserve lines can't have moveable days? If you can show me I will stand corrected.

d. Reserve Line holders:
1) All reserve lines will contain at least two (2) blocks of days off containing three (3) consecutive days off.
2) Reserve Pilots will receive not less then ten (10) calendar days off in a thirty (30) day bid period, or eleven (11) calendar days off in a thirty-one (31) day bid period
3) The Company may convert reserves to a system of movable days off as defined in 14.d.4). below. Each Reserve Pilot will then receive not less than twelve (12) calendar days off in that bid period.
a) Should the Company make this conversion, the Association will meet with the Company after three (3) full bid periods to evaluate the effectiveness of the new system. Either party may discontinue this system with written notice to the other.
b) With said notice, the Company will return to the day off limits set in 14.d.2. within three (3) full bid periods.
4) Reserve Lines with Movable Days Off (R-MDO):
a) R-MDO holders will receive a minimum of twelve (12) days off each bid period. At least two (2) of the day off blocks shall be three (3) consecutive days.
b) Crew Scheduling may move a R-MDO Pilot’s days off in two (2) ways:
(1)Reserve Period Adjustment
(a)Three (3) or more calendar days prior to the first day affected, one (1) or two (2) consecutive days off may be moved in either direction to receive a reserve TAP assignment. Once moved, those days off may no longer be adjusted utilizing the MDO method.
(b)The new reserve TAP shall be the same type as the TAP removed and will comply with F.11.a.
(2)Flight assignment
(a)Flying may be assigned to a R-MDO that spans into his day(s) off.
(b)The assignment may span no more than two (2) current calendar days off in either direction.
(c)The assignment must occur within the three (3) day assignment window provided that:
(i)The notification is made during a TAP or an existing duty period.
(ii)Such flying assignment must be scheduled to start no later than the last calendar day of the current block of reserve days, or scheduled to arrive no earlier than the first day of a block of reserve days.
5) Movable days off may not result in a R-MDO Pilot receiving a single calendar day off.
6) After the Final Schedule Award, a R-MDO Pilot may designate up to two (2) of his blocks of days off as “golden days off” (GDO) which the Company may not move, except by mutual consent between the Pilot and the Company, after the Final Schedule Award. GDO’s will not apply if the Pilot is awarded a move-up line.
7) Crew Scheduling may move a R-MDO’s days off only when consistent with need to protect reserve availability.

 

[Kharma Police]

Golden days off?!? More like a Golden Shower from scheduling for the rest of the month.......

 

[BFL370]

Like I've said, if this is voted down with a large bang (+80%) we can have some push at the table, if this goes marginal (55%) or so this could look like the good TA. If it dies we have to supprt the BoD/NC who ever theyare in the Picketing etc, if not we are screwged because the ability to hold the company fast is lost. I would bet the BoD is supporting this because they feel the pilot group may not be up for the fight it would take to gain a stronger contract. Prove them wrong if you can.

So other than to vote NO, do you guys have any REAL ideas on how to fix the TA.

 

[XRMEFLYER]

So other than to vote NO, do you guys have any REAL ideas on how to fix the TA.

Current book plus COLA raise for starters!

 

[instructordude]

Current book plus COLA raise for starters!

I think we're all in for paycuts unfortunately. Look at the legacies. Now it is the LCC's. Time to deal with reality and the likely paycuts ahead.

 

[XRMEFLYER]

I think we're all in for paycuts unfortunately. Look at the legacies. Now it is the LCC's. Time to deal with reality and the likely paycuts ahead.

Go back to jerkin it in your mom's basement troll. The grown ups are trying to have a conversation here.

 

[instructordude]

Go back to jerkin it in your mom's basement troll. The grown ups are trying to have a conversation here.

Grown ups don't say "Jerkin it in your mom's basement troll."

Say what you want but companies just aren't making enough money to afford raises yet. If pilots get a raise then everyone else is going to want one. I highly doubt you guys can afford it. How much did you g uys make last year? Try adding in a raise and those profits turn to a loss.

BTW I never said yuou shouldn't get a raise but am trying to look at the reality of the industry. That reality just doesn't support it.

 

[Eagle757shark]

Like I've said, if this is voted down with a large bang (+80%) we can have some push at the table, if this goes marginal (55%) or so this could look like the good TA. If it dies we have to supprt the BoD/NC who ever theyare in the Picketing etc, if not we are screwged because the ability to hold the company fast is lost. I would bet the BoD is supporting this because they feel the pilot group may not be up for the fight it would take to gain a stronger contract. Prove them wrong if you can.

So other than to vote NO, do you guys have any REAL ideas on how to fix the TA.

WRONG! The BODs did the right thing sending this to the pilots. Now the whole pilot group can see what our negotiating committee and the company have been up to the last couple of years. If the board had voted this down, then the company would have started with the propaganda letters all over again telling us how the board didn't give us a chance to decide for ourselves. Now that the pilot group will have an opportunity to see what the Negotiating committee has come up with, the whole pilot group can decide for themselves. If this is voted down by a large margin, the company can't say the board voted down a good contract and the pilots didn't have a chance to decide for themselves. Been there seen this before, MR! The board did exactly what it was supposed to do....send it to the body and let them decide!

Now the negotiating team is another matter all by itself. Depending on how the vote goes. It will either be a vote of no confidence in the NC with a large turn out and a overwhelming NO or support with a close vote! After this thing is hopefully shot down, there will be some ideas brought forward, I for one will be first at the table. But this TA is not good enough for this pilot group and sets a dangerous precedence going forward!

 

[XRMEFLYER]

Grown ups don't say "Jerkin it in your mom's basement troll."

Say what you want but companies just aren't making enough money to afford raises yet. If pilots get a raise then everyone else is going to want one. I highly doubt you guys can afford it. How much did you g uys make last year? Try adding in a raise and those profits turn to a loss.

BTW I never said yuou shouldn't get a raise but am trying to look at the reality of the industry. That reality just doesn't support it.

Here's another reality for you dude. Our management is among the highest compensated in this business. We are poised to make some serious coin in the coming years. I like hopefully most others here do not wish to skin the sheep, merely to join Joe and his minions in fleecing it.

 

[Eagle757shark]

I think we're all in for paycuts unfortunately. Look at the legacies. Now it is the LCC's. Time to deal with reality and the likely paycuts ahead.

Sir, you don't understand what is going on! We have to be willing to fight for our careers and preserve our profession. If you are a RJ driver, be thankful. That is part of the problem with this industry. Jets should be flown by mainline at RATES the market can sustain. Keep believing that nonsense you keep printing and you will forever be flying a RJ at wages just above minimum wage. If that is what you think of your profession, then please do us all a favor and GET OUT! We need people in this profession that will protect it and are willing to fight for what they have earned. When the men and women at UNITED, DELTA, AND US AIRWAYS lost their pensions, unions all over this country should have stood up and fought for what was by law supposed to be funded, but was stolen for the sake of executive bonus'. YOU WOULDN'T UNDERSTAND THAT! Americans, wake up and start fighting for what you worked so hard for and don't let a soul take it away from you!

 

[rtmcfi]

hook, line, sinker

 

[mnboyev]

saving my money for my strike fund!....gonna start drinking ol swill I guess !

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

The BK era is over... when our companies start making money you don't want a BK era TA...

 

[SLEDNECK]

So other than to vote NO, do you guys have any REAL ideas on how to fix the TA.

How about recalling the BOD and getting some new negotiators that actually represent the rest of the 80% of the group? Three years at 100 hours a month of pay for this garbage? LOL, we've been getting ripped off whether if it passes or not! We should have just put the money in to the strike fund. The TA is seriously so bad that I have to think(and hope) that maybe this is all a negotiating technique, and that the overwhelming F*CK NO vote will be more meaningful than anything else. However, after the holiday raping, age 65 crap, etc. even if we vote no, I have no confidence that they will actually be honest about the result. Who's to stop them from saying, " Oh yeah, it passed 65/35"? We'll get stuck with this turd even though we won't be able to find anyone who actually voted for it. How can anyone sit there with a straight face and say this isn't a concessionary contract? That's just an insult and a slap in the face, and not from the company, but from "one of us".

VOTE NO!