New AAI ALPA Strategy: Fire SWA Haters!

[Ty Webb]

You think a year? I know every tranny Pilot would like it before then, except Ty he don't need the money, just wants a title.

Yawn . . . . I got a title for you . . . . it sounds a lot like "master flame-baiter".

 

[waveflyer]

PCL-After digesting- why would the rest of your officers claim you're interfering with the SLI just for politics? Wouldn't there be easier ways to recall, w/o adding to the fears that Swapa pilots have?
And to be clear- you're saying there's no truth to the claim that TO was involving himself in the SLI?

Another USAIR would be bad- but this is apples to oranges. The same dynamics aren't there.

 

[GuppyWN]

......... and is the recall at the local level via the MEC or does it go to the membership for a vote?

Gup

 

[-9Capt]

It was an appointed position, no membership vote.

 

[GuppyWN]

How many union/NC positions have changed in the past couple weeks?

Gup

 

[ASADFW7]

Well, the comments on flightinfo are public record. Now that the identity of the individual was known it may have been a conflict of interest, and a violation of sharing information publicly for the MC to work within. SWAPA has asked SWA pilots not to talk about SLI specifics, and to keep the gas off the fire. As for as I know there are no SWAPA pilots making statements here with known identities. Being bold in public can back fire, when it is stays out there forever in cyberspace.

 

[canyonblue]

We were acquired cause we're awesome!! 1st round draft pick! Happy memorial day guys!

I don't care which way anyone is thinking, that's some funny sht. :beer:

 

[PCL_128]

PCL-After digesting- why would the rest of your officers claim you're interfering with the SLI just for politics? Wouldn't there be easier ways to recall, w/o adding to the fears that Swapa pilots have?

You're thinking too logically, wave. They aren't thinking about the perceptions of SWAPA pilots, or even our own pilots for that matter. They're just looking to settle a political grudge, without giving a second thought to the possible consequences.

And to be clear- you're saying there's no truth to the claim that TO was involving himself in the SLI?

None whatsoever. As far as I know, anyway.

Another USAIR would be bad- but this is apples to oranges. The same dynamics aren't there.

I'm not talking about the exact same situation or outcome, I'm just talking about a merger that blows up in one way or another. That's the last thing that anyone at ALPA wants. Any conspiracy that alleges ALPA's interest in seeing this go poorly is simply not well thought out.

How many union/NC positions have changed in the past couple weeks?

In the past couple of weeks, just one. In the past couple of months, two of the three officers have left, one from recall, and one from resignation. No NC positions have changed.

 

[Fubijaakr]

......... and is the recall at the local level via the MEC or does it go to the membership for a vote?

Gup

Read the thread, Gup. For the third time, MEC officer recalls DO NOT get voted on by the rank and file.

 

[carl p]

To my SWA brothers:

If we reached a negotiated deal that was passed by AAI and declined by SWAPA, which led to an arbitrated list "worse" than the negotiated list for SWAPA how could GK possibly hold that against the AAI troops?

One of the concerns here is that anything we would vote to pass, you'll shoot down. I'm not saying an arbitrated list will favor us, but my scenario is a possibility (however remote it may be).

 

[shootr]

Having been in contact with a few on the NC, your scenario of a proposal being sent to the SWAPA pilots that has any possibility of being turned down is highly unlikely. They'd rather go to arbitration.

shootr

 

[SWA/FO]

They'd rather go to arbitration.

Who? You lost me.

 

[shootr]

Who? You lost me.

Our (SWAPA's) NC would rather go to arbitration than send us (the members) a proposal that we are likely to turn down as a group. If our NC is willing to send us something, it's probably an OK deal for us. With that in mind...I'll still read it, evaluate it, and vote for my best interest which may still be a "no". Better?

shootr

 

[ArcadiaMaxima]

Our (SWAPA's) NC would rather go to arbitration than send us (the members) a proposal that we are likely to turn down as a group. If our NC is willing to send us something, it's probably an OK deal for us. With that in mind...I'll still read it, evaluate it, and vote for my best interest which may still be a "no". Better?

shootr

Kind of reminds me of TA1. I trust the NC but just because they send something to vote does not mean it is a good deal...you can't be serious?

 

[K-Mart]

To my SWA brothers:

If we reached a negotiated deal that was passed by AAI and declined by SWAPA, which led to an arbitrated list "worse" than the negotiated list for SWAPA how could GK possibly hold that against the AAI troops?

One of the concerns here is that anything we would vote to pass, you'll shoot down. I'm not saying an arbitrated list will favor us, but my scenario is a possibility (however remote it may be).

He wouldn't hold it against any of the AAI guys. He'd probably laugh at the SWAPA guys and say "Told you".

Mr. Kelly is not our (AAI and SWA) friend though. He really could care less about pilots and believes we are paid way way too much. I don't trust him.

 

[Lear70]

In the past couple of weeks, just one. In the past couple of months, two of the three officers have left, one from recall, and one from resignation. No NC positions have changed.

You forgot to mention one who narrowly avoided recall, then through his own lack of paying attention, lost his office because he changed bases then forgot to submit for council bypass, thus solving the situation.

Straight out of the file of "Things you can't make up"...

 

[Taco Rocket]

Mr. Kelly is not our (AAI and SWA) friend though. He really could care less about pilots and believes we are paid way way too much. I don't trust him.

Finally a dose of reality. It's been amusing reading numerous posts where everyone thinks he is going to double his unit labor costs for the sake of "culture."

You are overpaid relative to your peers on similar equipment. It's a fact. Couple this with slimming margins in a saturated market, and a stock that has gone nowhere in almost 10 years, and... well -- you figure it out.

 

[GoodTimes]

Good one Taco. Another pilot spouting off about stock price, labor costs and how to run an airline. You missed your calling.

 

[slaquer5]

delete

 

[jonjuan]

delete

Smart boy....

 

[Taco Rocket]

Good one Taco. Another pilot spouting off about stock price, labor costs and how to run an airline. You missed your calling.

Typical FI: attack the person, not the ideas.

 

[slaquer5]

Typical FI: attack the person, not the ideas.

It might be, because its hard to reason with an idiot. Go back to your village.

 

[GoodTimes]

OK Taco,

Enlighten us with your expansive knowledge of SWA's "unit costs" in a this "saturated market" with "slimming margins". And while you're at it, why don't you tell us all which stocks are worth buying. No one's attacking you. We'd really like to hear from an expert.

 

[ATLplt]

And while you're at it, why don't you tell us all which stocks are worth buying.

"Blue Horseshoe loves Anacott Steel."

 

[waveflyer]

And taco-
While you're at it- maybe you and Kmart can tell us how GK is so unworthy of trust...

 

[PapaWoody]

Finally a dose of reality. It's been amusing reading numerous posts where everyone thinks he is going to double his unit labor costs for the sake of "culture."

You are overpaid relative to your peers on similar equipment. It's a fact. Couple this with slimming margins in a saturated market, and a stock that has gone nowhere in almost 10 years, and... well -- you figure it out.

I have three points in response to your post, which is just thinly veiled envy, imo:

1. SWA pilots are paid approximately what we were paid in the mid 80's, adjusted for inflation. So it would seem that we aren't "overpaid relative" to our peers, our peers are underpaid relative to us. The leverage that you have in your next negotiations will be due to us, whereas we will gain nothing from your anemic contract. You're welcome.

2. At which point, when SWA has continued to be profitable come hell or high water, should we, in your esteemed opinion, consider giving some of our "overpay" back? Sorry your company's business plan can't support a decent contract - a problem that we don't currently (and probably never will) have.

3. Herb has always run his airline with the concept that although a viable culture might cost him a little money in the short term, it would save him / make him money in the long term. Every time. And I'm pretty sure Gary knows that also.

Thanks for your concern. However, we and our AirTran brothers and sisters will be just fine without it. Now go work on getting back what you gave away.

PapaWoody

 

[K-Mart]

And taco-
While you're at it- maybe you and Kmart can tell us how GK is so unworthy of trust...

Sorry bubba but Mr. Kelly cares about a profit and that is about it.

As far as trust is concerned I'll give you an example: Frontier. If you do work at Southwest then you will know what I am talking about.

For the AAI guys, seriously, he would let you work at the wages you are curently at for as long as he could and blame it on SWAPA. He would do it, trust me. We should work to get this thing done without going to the mediation or even worse arbitration phase.

When asked about the problem of too many executives and VP's at Exxon and other oil companies making 150K-200K Mr. Kelly replied "I've got the same problem with over 5000 execs making that here too."

He's not on our team and will never be. And please stop calling him f@cking Gary. You don't know him and he probably wouldn't give you the time of day so stop kissing his a$$.

 

[maxthrottle]

You go PCL128! Stick it to SWAPA. SWA's only way of survival is AAI and we should be compensated appropriately. Sure you were recalled but we're all behind you. Like we were at PCL. Hopefully you can use your National position to gerrymander the outcome of this SLI. We're all counting on you.

 

[Quiet Flight]

Let's just say that the "little side business" made a whole lot more last year than any SWA FO did, that's for sure

You have a side business that grossed "a whole lot more than" $268,000 last year?

Could you define "whole lot more"? Just curious. Thanks.

 

[Quiet Flight]

Sorry your company's business plan can't support a decent contract - a problem that we don't currently (and probably never will) have.

I don't know it all when it comes to airlines, but I do know this: DO NOT EVER say "Never"!

And yes, I work for SWA. I'd love to stay near the top, but history and the cyclic nature of this industry seem to dictate otherwise. Best of luck to all of us.