New 1500 hour rule first affected

[Flopgut]

Flopgut,

Bubba doesn't realize that Hobby's shorter runways limit SWA on where they can fly and the size of plane. But, Bubba don't care, Bubba mainly likes Corpus and Little Rock turns! He is all over those! Good for him!


Bye Bye---General Lee

I don't feel like giving up on the guy. I'm fluent in bubbanese, but SWA is a real tricky dialect. The phrases "fair market" and "level playing field" have vastly different meanings if you're speaking to them.

 

[Flopgut]

Flop, you appear to have the same selective memory as General Lee. IAH will NEVER be a better choice than Hobby for Southwest. Never. Remember being told numerous times? All of our passengers are at Hobby. That's why we wanted to do our international flying out of Hobby in the first place....and exactly why Unical tried to keep us from doing it--to prevent us from competing with them on a level playing field.

Closing thought Bubba cause I got to bail. IAH just got two new airlines, Air China and Turkish. HAS [Houston Airport Authority] works really hard to get new service. What I've come to realize in the last week or so is that it appears HAS is going to work equally hard to get lots of new entrants into Hobby as well. SWA is paying for the terminal in exchange for free rent and preferential scheduling on 4of 5 gates, but does not *own* the terminal. As long as HAS works equally hard to get new foreign airlines into Hobby as it does into IAH and is successful, there is no problem. I won't name them, but I can think of at least a half a dozen that will probably want to link up with your domestic customer. What the United/Continental opposition wants to avoid first most is another Love Field situation where SWA could keep fair competition off the airport. And in the most recent comments made by HAS, it seems clear the goal is to make sure SWA has a lot of company at Hobby. They don't want another Love Field either. Not even the illusion of another Love Field. I maybe didn't give the Mayor and HAS enough credit. Seems they might understand exactly what your up to, and while they're happy to take your money, they are not going to make things easy. Good luck.

 

[redflyer65]

Flop,

I give you a lot of credit for looking at the whole deal. It takes some real honesty to step and make a post like this on FI. Well done.

Major difference from someone like the Genital, who will never admit he's wrong and constantly acts like he's the expert on every aviation subject (which is so far from the truth)...when most of the time he has his fact wrong(and tries to insert opinion for facts) and then can't debate the real issues. Over and over.

 

[General Lee]

Flop,

I give you a lot of credit for looking at the whole deal. It takes some real honesty to step and make a post like this on FI. Well done.

Major difference from someone like the Genital, who will never admit he's wrong and constantly acts like he's the expert on every aviation subject (which is so far from the truth)...when most of the time he has his fact wrong(and tries to insert opinion for facts) and then can't debate the real issues. Over and over.

Red,

The problem with you is that you think you are smarter than you actually are. I always bring up points that I can back with facts. We all know the SLI merger between your two companies was F'd up. We all know the majority of your trips at your airline have multiple leg days (high time productive). We know you will fly one airplane type for the rest of your career. We know that most of your pilots had to PAY for your type rating in order to get a class. We know GK wants to bring your airline back to LCC status. We know you barfed a quesadilla at LBB. We all know these things. It's easy to debate you, just use the facts.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[flyboyike]

I always bring up points that I can back with facts.

No, sir, you do not. Which makes you no different from every other pilot out there, myself included.

 

[General Lee]

No, sir, you do not. Which makes you no different from every other pilot out there, myself included.

Well, anyone can question my use of the facts, and I'd be happy to debate them. That is called a forum. Just because I seem to come up with practical answers that make sense, some people get frustrated. Again, feel free to debate anything, I am ready and I'll respond when I am not flying. What makes me different is I can debate multiple issues at once, because I have a better understanding of the industry as a whole than most on here. I am well informed.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[redflyer65]

Red,

The problem with you is that you think you are smarter than you actually are. I always bring up points that I can back with facts. We all know the SLI merger between your two companies was F'd up. We all know the majority of your trips at your airline have multiple leg days (high time productive). We know you will fly one airplane type for the rest of your career. We know that most of your pilots had to PAY for your type rating in order to get a class. We know GK wants to bring your airline back to LCC status. We know you barfed a quesadilla at LBB. We all know these things. It's easy to debate you, just use the facts.


Bye Bye---General Lee

Dude, I have to say......that is F'ing hilarious!




Let me add..

WE ALL KNOW your a complete D-BAG. Thanks for the Tuesday evening laugh. Actually I'll be laughing all week long with this one. Talk about losing!






Here's a couple of facts that you continue to struggle with...

1 -Southwest has ZERO RJ's. Delta? More than 800.

2 -Southwest has ZERO codeshare. Delta? How many JV's and codeshare with 'Connection Carriers'? At least 20.

3 -Southwest has less than 3 Billion in debt with more than 3 Billion in cash.
Delta? Over 26 BILLION in debt. That's billion with a 'B'.

4 -Southwest 40 years of profits, year in and year out.
Delta? Bankruptcy and furloughs.

Southwest is only a domestic carrier with world growth ahead.
Delta? Covers the globe with no growth on the horizon, except for more JV's! Enjoy.

Oh, and as far as LBB and MAF, we make money there. Apparently you can't (that's why your aren't there) Oh, and even your Connection carrier pulled out. I'd fly into Goodland Kansas if we would make money. Why would it matter? Money is money and we continue to make it.....year after year after year. Delta? Not so much.

 

[General Lee]

Dude, I have to say......that is F'ing hilarious!




Let me add..

WE ALL KNOW your a complete D-BAG. Thanks for the Tuesday evening laugh. Actually I'll be laughing all week long with this one. Talk about losing!






Here's a couple of facts that you continue to struggle with...

1 -Southwest has ZERO RJ's. Delta? More than 800.

2 -Southwest has ZERO codeshare. Delta? How many JV's and codeshare with 'Connection Carriers'? At least 20.

3 -Southwest has less than 3 Billion in debt with more than 3 Billion in cash.
Delta? Over 26 BILLION in debt. That's billion with a 'B'.

4 -Southwest 40 years of profits, year in and year out.
Delta? Bankruptcy and furloughs.

Southwest is only a domestic carrier with world growth ahead.
Delta? Covers the globe with no growth on the horizon, except for more JV's! Enjoy.

Oh, and as far as LBB and MAF, we make money there. Apparently you can't (that's why your aren't there) Oh, and even your Connection carrier pulled out. I'd fly into Goodland Kansas if we would make money. Why would it matter? Money is money and we continue to make it.....year after year after year. Delta? Not so much.

Hillarious! 800 RJs? Really? Are you sure about that number? 215 50 seaters will be parked and the overall total will be pared down to 125 within the next 3 years. So, will there be 675 70/76 seaters? Nope. Wrong!

And $26 billion in debt? Long term debt will be whittled from $19 billion to $7 billion, (it's currently at $10 billion and dropping) and the pension liability fluctuates according to the stock market, and a certain big wig stated it would be paid off thanks to unbelievable profits forecasted. Your boss is looking for LCC status again, so the only ones with debts at your airline will be pilots who bought houses too big after pay concessions coming up.

You pointed out JVs and codeshares. Guess what Red? You can't fly within China and take people out. You need a codeshare to bring their domestic passengers to cities DL can fly to, to then take them out and to the US. You didn't know that? You thought DL could fly within other countries and take passengers? Wow, you are so misinformed. JVs have promise when complied with, because it can guarantee a flying percentage and allow you access to INTL airports that normally wouldn't be available. You do know Korean just cancelled 95 city pairs with DL codeshares, right? Ah, You fly for the Corndog, so you have no idea about that anyway. Heck, your pilots can't even fly INTL flights yet, instead giving it to more knowledgeable AT pilots. You're still trying to figure out VNAV and autothrottles.

With so little debt, why would your boss be asking for concessions? He's gonna do it, you know that. How many planes do you have coming? Isn't that debt? How many old 733s and 735s do you need to replace? Doesn't that add to debt? I know you still have bag fees at AT to pay for that merger, and the AT guys really appreciate the separate 737 payrates???

40 years of profits? What happened early this year and last year? The legacies make hundreds of millions, or BILLIONS. I guess you made "peanuts"....and why is your boss so nervous? He seems like he may want to figure out that LCC model again....yikes.

No INTL growth for DL? Just announced nonstop DL mainline from SEA to Heathrow, Hong Kong, and Seoul. An additional flight from ATL to São Paulo. Yeah, zero INTL growth.... You still can't fly anywhere INTL because your side can't handle it? AT guys can...and they are paid less on the 737???? Why?

How do you know you make money flying to LBB and MAF? You said you never go there....liar! Gotcha Red. You lose, again!



Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[redflyer65]

Okay General I'll take it line by line so you can't hide. Here we go...

Hillarious! 800 RJs? Really? Are you sure about that number? 215 50 seaters will be parked and the overall total will be pared down to 125 within the next 3 years. So, will there be 675 70/76 seaters? Nope. Wrong!

Yes, you have at least 800 RJ's flying for you. Recently it was close to 1,000. So I'm being generous. You have so much outsourcing spread through so many Delta Connection Carriers that it's hard to keep up. But at LEAST 800. And I'm being kind. Think of it this way....around 50% of all your domestic flying is.....wait for it......on an RJ. NOT mainline. These are the facts....not some opinion you'd like to be fact.

And $26 billion in debt? Long term debt will be whittled from $19 billion to $7 billion, (it's currently at $10 billion and dropping) and the pension liability fluctuates according to the stock market, and a certain big wig stated it would be paid off thanks to unbelievable profits forecasted. Your boss is looking for LCC status again, so the only ones with debts at your airline will be pilots who bought houses too big after pay concessions coming up.

Okay. Looks like you're trying to make a point about your debt, then trying to throw mud and see what sticks at SW.

26 BILLION is the latest number, and it was lower than that recently...then went back up to 26 B. That's with a big 'B'. I hope you can dig your way out of that one. Very similar to the General Motors bankruptcy...they came out with a ton of debt as well. It's a HUGE drag on the bottom line. Far from a clean balance sheet.

About our boss....you really think you have a clue what Gary Kelly wants? Really? Some d-bag at Delta thinks he knows. You have a hotline to Gary that we don't know about? Here's the facts....YOU HAVE KNOW CLUE so you sling sh!t hoping it sticks. It doesn't, so I call it complete BS.

You pointed out JVs and codeshares. Guess what Red? You can't fly within China and take people out. You need a codeshare to bring their domestic passengers to cities DL can fly to, to then take them out and to the US. You didn't know that? You thought DL could fly within other countries and take passengers? Wow, you are so misinformed. JVs have promise when complied with, because it can guarantee a flying percentage and allow you access to INTL airports that normally wouldn't be available. You do know Korean just cancelled 95 city pairs with DL codeshares, right? Ah, You fly for the Corndog, so you have no idea about that anyway. Heck, your pilots can't even fly INTL flights yet, instead giving it to more knowledgeable AT pilots. You're still trying to figure out VNAV and autothrottles.

Here we are again with a mix of defending Delta and trying to sling poo. Your specialty apparently.

I realize that Delta can't fly within certain cities, but from recent history your CEO LUVS the joint venture (see what I did there, pretty good right). Just like the recent 49% purchase of Virgin, Richard is stretching his wings into more JVs.....while you sit there and watch.

Ok, the poo. VNAV and Autothrottles? That's your insult? We've been doing it for around 2 years now. I think we've got it Gen. We have full up RNAV/GPS approaches available to us every day...on 3500 flights daily. So your poo didn't stick on that one either. Sorry.

With so little debt, why would your boss be asking for concessions? He's gonna do it, you know that. How many planes do you have coming? Isn't that debt? How many old 733s and 735s do you need to replace? Doesn't that add to debt? I know you still have bag fees at AT to pay for that merger, and the AT guys really appreciate the separate 737 payrates???

Ahhhh, your wrong again because you don't know any of the details....as usual. Our boss isn't asking for concessions at all. He's asking to keep cost flat. Isn't that what CEO's are supposed to do? Really just doing his job. I think will see some small improvements in the areas we want. NO concessions. That isn't even part of the discussion. So you're WAY off base here.

Add to the debt? Funny again. We OWN outright most of our planes. To the tune of 80% which is unheard of in the industry. What does AirTran charging for bag fees have to do with the Southwest side of the operation? You know it's two different cost structures, right? I know you do, because SWA Bubba has explained it to you about a dozen time. I'll just refer you to his post instead of stating the facts AGAIN for the THIRTEENTH time. Listen up next time! Payrates are the same as the bag fee BS you try to throw. Again, listen up and take notes if needed.

40 years of profits? What happened early this year and last year? The legacies make hundreds of millions, or BILLIONS. I guess you made "peanuts"....and why is your boss so nervous? He seems like he may want to figure out that LCC model again....yikes.

Again, yes 40 years of profits every year consecutively. (Something you can't even come close to saying)Again, you act like this is something new, it's not, it's 40 years running with 41 and 42 right behind them. Our boss isn't nervous (he's making profits!). We've made smaller profits that Delta because.........wait for it again.......we are a smaller company. As Max pointed out, we make more on a % basis than Delta does. Hard to believe isn't it?

No INTL growth for DL? Just announced nonstop DL mainline from SEA to Heathrow, Hong Kong, and Seoul. An additional flight from ATL to São Paulo. Yeah, zero INTL growth.... You still can't fly anywhere INTL because your side can't handle it? AT guys can...and they are paid less on the 737???? Why?

Delta is growing by FOUR flights? That's your argument? You should stick with the 'I banged your Mom jokes', because that accounts for what.....0.00015% growth for the flying Delta does. Fail General. What flights have you scrubbed? Forgot to add that didn't you? Get back to me on that, please.

SW and international? Wrong again General. Our pilots and planes are fully capable to go NOW. We have been working to get the Reservation system in place. That will be here JULY 2014. All of 10 months away. You'll probably see international destinations on the SW side within the next schedule. Need me to send you a reminder when that happens? Sure you would. I'll do it.

How do you know you make money flying to LBB and MAF? You said you never go there....liar! Gotcha Red. You lose, again!

I knew you couldn't leave out Lubbock! We make money there because we fly there. Not like Delta where they have to outsource a thousand planes because your (mainline) cost are too high to make it work. Talk about losing again.

Gothca? I haven't been there in years, but I'm glad to go when my company needs me too because......wait for it again......we make money there and you can't. I know that because not only is Delta Mainline not there, but neither is Connection......and that's sad. So you keep ripping on LBB and MAF, and we'll keep carrying those passengers at a profit. The profit that your company passes up because your too expensive, you know the friction of 12 fleet types strikes again. Thanks Gen!



You tried to make SEVEN points and you were wrong on all SEVEN. Amazing. Maybe you should stick to the 'WE ALL KNOW' bullsh!t.

That's was f'ing hilarious.

 

[General Lee]

Wow Red, you wrote in Red.....Amazing! Does that make your points correct? Nope.


There are not 1000 RJs. Comair is gone, ASA lost many 50 seaters for the DL side, Mesaba was chopped in half, and 215 more 50 seaters will leave in 3 years, while 70 come over, for a net total loss of 140 more RJs. 1000? Way off.

You like to throw in pension liabilities, which are a moving number. The long term debt is not, and that has been reduced by $9 billion in 4 years, with $3 billion more by next year. That is unbelievable, and the pension liability is in reach after the long term debt is taken care of. DL had a $500 million profit in July alone. That is equivalent to 3 of your quarters. No debt will last long if you can generate that much profit that fast.

What is your boss thinking? Well, here is part of an article from Businessweek last year:

"Southwest’s expenses grew by almost 13 percent through the first nine months of this year, outpacing a 12 percent rise in sales. Holding down costs is central to the Dallas-based airline’s business plan because it allows Southwest to remain profitable while offering lower fares that win customers.
“We’ll be very aggressive with our cost controls next year,” Kelly said. “It’s a reflection of concerns about high fuel prices and economic uncertainty.”


All I hear from the legacy CEOs is how great things are going, RASM is up. You lost your fuel hedge advantage, and pricing power. It ain't that great for you compared to the old days.....

It appears you still don't understand JVs. Do you see what DL gains with the 49% of Virgin Atlantic? They get to use slots at Heathrow DL couldn't buy themselves, and set up competition for lucrative corporate contracts for the most lucrative route in the World---NYC to London. Without the JV, DL would have 3 flights, with it equals 10 daily, to fight AA/BA's 12. That is huge. You have no idea because you have a "West Texas is best" mentality. Is that slinging poo? It's accurate. Do you have any idea how expensive one slot at Heathrow is? No, you probably don't. Here's a hint: it's more than your airline makes in profit in one quarter. And did you say your boss ISN'T nervous? Read the above again. Trimming head counts, cutting costs, etc. Sounds like he may be.

So, 4 INTL flights isn't expansion? How about adding 88 717s in 3 years? Thanks to you and $120 million, those 717s will add a lot of mainline flights back. Ever heard of hiring? You won't for many years, but looks like DL will start again, and likely won't stop for years. Not only are 717s coming, but 737-900ERs, MD90s, and apparently some of the 757s slated to go may not, instead getting overhauled. That means hiring and upgrades. Hey, what about retirements over there? Any significant retirements over the next decade? Nope. 4000 in 5 years over at DL(2020-2024, and probably 300 a year up until then, and those numbers are retiring at age 65). Sounds like stagnation is the word of the day for you.

12 fleet types is bad? It made $500 million in one month. Sounds like right sizing planes on routes. It sure is making big bucks, you should look into it....


And LBB and MAF are a part of your history. You started as a small intra Texas airline. Don't be embarrassed. You avoid those cities for some reason? Wow. I didn't mean to make you avoid those cities. Maybe you want to go there. Good. I don't. Enjoy it Red.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[redflyer65]

General,

Are you saying you don't have 800 RJs? Do I need to do the leg work to prove you wrong? (PS....Southwest has ZERO RJs, and just because your slow at facts....that's ZERO as in NONE)

Again for the facts.....Gary is NOT looking for concessions. That's from the table. What part don't you understand? Is it just because it doesn't fit your mantra? Read it again tool.

You have to admit there is NO growth for Delta. What new cities? Four? Please. Meanwhile, your arguing that SW won't go international? Good luck with that because you'd be wrong. Your arguing against a company that only goes to about 35 states in the US. ZERO international.....yet. You really want to put your money on the SW no-growth mantra. You'd lose.....again.


LBB and MAF embarrassing? Not even close. I love cities where we make money hand over fist and you can't. You know you can't because you don't even try with mainline. As a matter of fact you Outsourced feeder couldn't even cut it. Richard Anderson saw a money losing operation in West Texas and cut bait.


We All Know what a tool and a d-bag you are, it's okay to admit it. I won't tell. Just between you and me friend. Promise.

The truth will set you free. Full Steam Ahead!

 

[General Lee]

General,

Are you saying you don't have 800 RJs? Do I need to do the leg work to prove you wrong? (PS....Southwest has ZERO RJs, and just because your slow at facts....that's ZERO as in NONE)

Again for the facts.....Gary is NOT looking for concessions. That's from the table. What part don't you understand? Is it just because it doesn't fit your mantra? Read it again tool.

You have to admit there is NO growth for Delta. What new cities? Four? Please. Meanwhile, your arguing that SW won't go international? Good luck with that because you'd be wrong. Your arguing against a company that only goes to about 35 states in the US. ZERO international.....yet. You really want to put your money on the SW no-growth mantra. You'd lose.....again.


LBB and MAF embarrassing? Not even close. I love cities where we make money hand over fist and you can't. You know you can't because you don't even try with mainline. As a matter of fact you Outsourced feeder couldn't even cut it. Richard Anderson saw a money losing operation in West Texas and cut bait.


We All Know what a tool and a d-bag you are, it's okay to admit it. I won't tell. Just between you and me friend. Promise.

The truth will set you free. Full Steam Ahead!

Red, where will 88 717s go? And you think 4 new INTL routes is ZERO? Uh, what?? SWA just got SJU, and that's about it, and that's not really INTL, except for you guys.... You don't see growth for DL? Retiring 4000 in 5 years means upgrades and upward movement. How about you guys? Very little, mostly stagnation. That makes you MAD.

The DL boss probably saw the same most did, 50 seat RJs to LBB wouldn't work from a dying hub in MEM, and cut it. Ever wonder why most legacies don't fly mainline planes to LBB or MAF? If you had RJs, they might be flying there. You used to fly from LBB and MAF to ABQ and ELP, which are gone now. A downsizing has occurred at both.

Hey, it's ok to admit that you're unsure of your future. It just doesn't seem to mirror the past, lots of changes ahead. Just sit back and enjoy your 5 leg days ending in Harlingen. It's okay, 20 more years of it won't drive you "Nuts." See ya friend!


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[flyboyike]

You started as a small intra Texas airline.

Hey, I know an airline that started as a cropdusting operation in Monroe, LA. Ring any bells?

 

[flyboyike]

You don't see growth for DL? Retiring 4000 in 5 years means upgrades and upward movement.

Replacement of retirees does not necessarily equal growth. At best, it's status quo, assuming the retirees are replaced one-for-one, and I, for one, am not convinced they'll even do that.