NetJets Working on CASS Approval?

[Flopgut]

I'm not sure what you think I was trying to say. I was just pointing out, that even during the 2004/05 negotations, owner satisfaction never dipped below 85%.

http://www.reuters.com/article/domesticNews/idUSN2017264620080520

Owner satisfaction. Is that anything like your on-time performance numbers? (Which I'm sure are stellar) Big deal. You want me to pull out a bunch of JD Power awards? We got em! Big deal as well.

Let's drop the BS. OK? I'm sure you kept up sufficiently with man-servant, fartcatcher duties while being inflexible enough to exact your will upon contract negotiations.

 

[PCL_128]

This forum was filled with posts of NetJets pilots talking about writing up airplanes and delaying flights while fighting for the '05 contract. I was completely supportive, but just be honest about it. End the holier-than-thou crap about never drawing the customer into your battles. It just ain't true.

 

[Flopgut]

BTW, even though we purchase about 125,000 full fare same day tickets each year, even if we quadrupled our complaints, it's still a very small percentage of your total volume. We have no choice when booked with you. The paying public doesn't really give a damn. They fly whoever is cheapest and tolerate abhorent pax service the few times they do travel. If they have any recollection at all, they book on a different carrier. If our customers do that, it is a much bigger impact.

It would help more than you think. However, I believe you enjoy the complaining too much. And, in fact, aren't as interested in your fellow crewmwmbers seeing increase as your customers were in seeing you do well. I don't know what kind of person you really are, but that ought to bother you at least a little.

 

[BeeDubya]

End the holier-than-thou crap about never drawing the customer into your battles. It just ain't true.

You're reading A WHOLE LOT into what I wrote... things I NEVER said (nor implied). When having these discussions, I think it's important to discuss facts. If we're going to discuss owner satisfaction during negotiations, we ought to have the right number. If we want to compare it to any other operator's owner/customer satisfaction, we ought to use the correct numbers. Abstracts without foundation are worthless.

The comment was made "I think we all know what the NJA pilot group did to owner satisfaction when it came between them and a huge payraise." My response was to say that, yes, I DO know EXACTLY what we did to owner satisfaction. So, I agree, let's be honest about it.

 

[AvroJockey]

Now I don't hate the airlines, but I hate what they have become. Some of these gate agents and flight attendants have no customer service training at all. I feel like its a government run program. Just like the guy on here telling us to use our own airplanes to get to work, what an idiot, NJA buys close to 125,000 airline tickets a year.

Preach it brotha!

Yesterday I was on a ExpressJet flight home. I decided to forgo the $5 Starbucks because I could get a free cup on the airplane. When asked what I would like to drink the FA said, "You're not going to make me brew coffee just for you...are you?" OMG!...because throwing a coffee packet in a machine and pushing a button is so much work. I got a Diet Coke instead.

I'm so happy and blessed to have a job now where I can take pride in my product. I couldn't have said that 6 months ago.

 

[fischman]

This forum was filled with posts of NetJets pilots talking about writing up airplanes and delaying flights while fighting for the '05 contract. I was completely supportive, but just be honest about it. End the holier-than-thou crap about never drawing the customer into your battles. It just ain't true.

We always treated the owner with the upmost respect. Never bite the hand that feeds you.

 

[Flopgut]

The comment was made "I think we all know what the NJA pilot group did to owner satisfaction when it came between them and a huge payraise." My response was to say that, yes, I DO know EXACTLY what we did to owner satisfaction. So, I agree, let's be honest about it.

All right Mr. numbers, did you as a pilot group not do exactly what it took to get it done? Would you have gone further? Or would your abundant regard for you personal brand and character have caused you to just give up on a contract? The battlecry was: STFD. We all heard it.

BTW, be honest about how much you guys as a group want to match your own customers efforts on your behalf and show some regard for us? What if you have to get a little more uncomfortable for us to get done what we want to get done?

 

[glasspilot]

Preach it brotha!

Yesterday I was on a ExpressJet flight home. I decided to forgo the $5 Starbucks because I could get a free cup on the airplane. When asked what I would like to drink the FA said, "You're not going to make me brew coffee just for you...are you?" OMG!...because throwing a coffee packet in a machine and pushing a button is so much work. I got a Diet Coke instead.

I'm so happy and blessed to have a job now where I can take pride in my product. I couldn't have said that 6 months ago.

Here's a tip. Don't drink anything made from the water that comes out of the tanks of a 121 aircraft. The same guys that refill the potable water refill the blue juice and not in that order. Plus, the tanks are NEVER cleaned or sterilized. The "Trolley Dolly" did you a favor.

 

[gutshotdraw]

I won't even drink coffee on the G fleet unless the F/A made the java with bottled water. "Oh, but they change the filters every time it goes through Savannah." Yeah, right. Stick with the Diet Coke on the crowd-killer Avro.

 

[FLYLOW22]

We always treated the owner with the upmost respect. Never bite the hand that feeds you.

Then WHY Fisch, why do I feel thoroughly chewed on when I fly 121?

I just don't get it.

 

[FLYLOW22]

All right Mr. numbers, did you as a pilot group not do exactly what it took to get it done? Would you have gone further? Or would your abundant regard for you personal brand and character have caused you to just give up on a contract? The battlecry was: STFD. We all heard it.

BTW, be honest about how much you guys as a group want to match your own customers efforts on your behalf and show some regard for us? What if you have to get a little more uncomfortable for us to get done what we want to get done?

How does this relate to NetJets pilots getting treated like aviation professionals when traveling through TSA checkpoints?

 

[PCL_128]

We always treated the owner with the upmost respect. Never bite the hand that feeds you.

Bullsh--. The threads are still archived here for everyone to read.

 

[AvroJockey]

Here's a tip. Don't drink anything made from the water that comes out of the tanks of a 121 aircraft. The same guys that refill the potable water refill the blue juice and not in that order. Plus, the tanks are NEVER cleaned or sterilized. The "Trolley Dolly" did you a favor.

Thanks for the tip...but I drank that water for over a decade and I'm still here.

 

[FLYLOW22]

Bullsh--. The threads are still archived here for everyone to read.

What is written and what is actually practiced are 2 very different things PCL.

Time to stop believing everything you read in this biz. That's the #1 rule in aviation.

No wonder most pilots are such easy targets. Sheesh.

Take it from 2 that were actually here in 2004/2005. What Fisch said is accurate.

The investment/expense $ amount for travel, the duration of the travel contact, the level of communication and the bond between Owner and pilot as compared to 121 passengers could NOT be any more diametrically opposed.

Sorry if that last part threw you... that's the part that contains no Paris Hilton spectacularism. It's meat.

Let me put it this way. The last time (at work) an Owner I wasn't flying walked up to me an struck up friendly conversation (about something other than "are you a pilot?") because he knew I was one of HIS pilots was this week. We spoke as if we were already familiar with each other. It was pleasant and intelligent. It happens all the time.

When's the last time a passenger conversation with you didn't contain a question about where the gate to XYZ was or what time the 2:40 departs?

In summary: There's no sense of Ownership in the 121 world anymore among passengers. It's a bus ride. Consequently, there is LITTLE TO NO bargaining power potential within the pilot group of a 121 carrier. Hate to say it.

Here at NetJets, we took and take care of our Owners. They could tell what our issues were simply by talking to us.

You would have thought that our Owners were pilots themselves the way they defended us and stood up for us.

And key here is that by defending us (the face of the company) they protected their investments.

 

[JungleJett]

I spent quite a bit of time talking to an owner..during the flight I might add. The guy was in his late 80's and had an intimate knowledge of airplanes and had some great input from a pax standpoint. He could not have been nicer. When we dropped him off in Florida, he came around the side of the airplane to personally thank me for the flight...and then we chatted a bit more.

I like my job again....it has been a while.

 

[fischman]

Then WHY Fisch, why do I feel thoroughly chewed on when I fly 121?

I just don't get it.

Because, Flylow, you have no callous on your a$$. Tell your hot wife to spank that thang a little harder. That way the sack slap on the airlines won't sting so much.imp:

 

[fischman]

Bullsh--. The threads are still archived here for everyone to read.

Oh! I'm sorry. I didn't realize you were sitting around FBOs and watching us interact with the owners?

I will tell you that we treated the owners with the professionalism they expected out of a NetJets pilot. We also (and still do) demand the highest level of mechanical reliability and aesthetics for the aircraft. Do you do the same?

 

[BeeDubya]

All right Mr. numbers, did you as a pilot group not do exactly what it took to get it done? Would you have gone further? Or would your abundant regard for you personal brand and character have caused you to just give up on a contract? The battlecry was: STFD. We all heard it.

BTW, be honest about how much you guys as a group want to match your own customers efforts on your behalf and show some regard for us? What if you have to get a little more uncomfortable for us to get done what we want to get done?

I have never publically discussed negotiating tactics or practices. I will not start now.

As FLYLOW said, what is written and what is practiced may be two different things.

Our dispute was with the company, NOT the passengers, owners or cardholders. Recognizing that the owners/cardholders are paying big bucks for our service, I have always treated them with the best "service excellence" I could. Without them, there is no job.

I don't know what you're asking from the last paragraph.

 

[FLYLOW22]

Because, Flylow, you have no callous on your a$$. Tell your hot wife to spank that thang a little harder. That way the sack slap on the airlines won't sting so much.imp:

Well crap... all I have are these scars on my back.

No callouses.

 

[FLYLOW22]

As FLYLOW said, what is written and what is practiced may be two different things.

Our dispute was with the company, NOT the passengers, owners or cardholders.

And thankfully, the PAST.