NetJets TA Reached

[dukeofdub]

Grizz

Welcome back.

 

[Hawkered]

Not to alarm anyone, but most of the fractionals are in no financial condition to match the Netjets T/A.

I think this might be the beginning of the end for at least one of them, unless they are bought up fast!

 

[FamilyGuy]

Not to alarm anyone, but most of the fractionals are in no financial condition to match the Netjets T/A.

I think this might be the beginning of the end for at least one of them, unless they are bought up fast!

Good point Hawkered. I dont think Raytheon is too happy about having to constantly give cash infusions to Flops to keep them solvent.

This just puts more pressure on them.

 

[Texasskicker]

Get real Hawk

Not to alarm anyone, but most of the fractionals are in no financial condition to match the Netjets T/A.

I think this might be the beginning of the end for at least one of them, unless they are bought up fast![/quote=Hawkered]

Thats pure bullcrap.

I find it LOL funny you guys are treating this like its a done deal. Fat lady singin yet?

What happened to your retro pay?

 

[be-400xpdriver]

After 5 years pay by size is started. At 14 years a Capt in Cat. one would make 110000 Cat. Two 116600 Cat. Three 120000




pay by aircraft category structure based on aircraft marketing size and revenues:
Category One: 400XP, Ultra/Encore, XL/XLS
Category Two: Sovereign, Citation VII-X, 800XP(C)-1000-Horizon, G-150
Category Three: G-200, Falcon 2000
IPPW: Gulfstream IV & V, Falcon 2000EX
BBJ: Boeing Business Jet

 

[x402]

Not to alarm anyone, but most of the fractionals are in no financial condition to match the Netjets T/A.

I think this might be the beginning of the end for at least one of them, unless they are bought up fast![/quote=Hawkered]

Thats pure bullcrap.

I find it LOL funny you guys are treating this like its a done deal. Fat lady singin yet?

What happened to your retro pay?

Unless we have to give up our first born, this will pass. It's not perfect and yes the retro sucks. Just think SST's and G5's.

 

[Hawkered]

Hey Tex?

What's a fellow Southerner like you doin' spoutin' off like that?!

Don't you know you have just created a focal point for Netjets pilot's to find a new enemy?

If we're now the best paid, the best trained (Buffett owns Flight Safety!) and flyin' around the best stuff not dictated to us by some OEM....that means the other fractionals just plain suck! So do the 135s that fly around ancient Lears and so do the commuters that put 300 hour sausage factory graduates into the right seat.

Dude!!

NETJETS is the best, if you're not on Netjets, you're not flying the best equipment, your investment is not financially secure, you don't have the selection of equipment, you don't have a dedicated workforce and you don't have the fleet size to choose from!!!


That's why.....


THEY GOT IT DONE!!!!!!!

 

[Flying Illini]

This must be the most insane comparison I've ever seen..... IF you are a 5th year FO (FO pay) at NetJet's you have done something seriously wrong.

I bet you're a joy to be around. Thanks for not answering my question.
And being a 5th year FO is something that is going to happen down the road so my question was actually legitimate but you could have also just applied it to a 2nd or 3rd year FO upgrading, would he get 1st year captain pay or 2nd or 3rd year captain pay? I believe it was Grizz who answered my question a page or two back, thankyou.

 

[Hawkered]

Hey Flyin'

Excuse us there...but we're a little delirious here. You know, celebrating is so much easier to do when you know you've got the money now to pay for it.

Competitive minimums just went back up to about 8,000 hours, seeing as though we're gonna need about 2,000 pilots who can upgrade to captain at a moments notice.

The Marquis Program has been told to slow down selling cards until the new hardware arrives. There's some guy on our union message board that heard that we're gettin' another 119 firm aircraft deliveries and it was confirmed on the same thread.

With the airlines squeezing people into jungle jets, I don't see any possibility of a slow down.

 

[cosmotheassman]

Excuse us there...but we're a little delirious here. You know, celebrating is so much easier to do when you know you've got the money now to pay for it.

I'm glad you guys got the agreement but, money doesn't make you happy. And, it dang sure won't make a NJpilot happy based on the crying I've witnessed over the last few years...

 

[StarHustler]

Boy have I been waiting for this for a while. I have been holding back from sending my resume for the last 6 months at least, due to the low wages paid to the crews. I am going to send in my resume now (me and probably 5,000 others, especially in light of some of the regionals recent woes). Congrat's and hopefully I can join you.

 

[ce750drvr]

Turbo,
As long as we can work together and work for the common good you will find us agreeable. Like YR said, stop tearing down your fellow employees. It is time for you to review the TA, make your decision and vote. Then lets all get to work together. We have a lot of profit to generate and waste to find to afford this TA. We are ready to go all the way and make NetJets profitable and we will have to do it together.

What in the hell are you talking about. This company can already afford this TA. If they couldn't, they wouldn't have put it on the table. I'm all for bringing Netjets back to service excellence. If anything, we need to trim the fat so the other groups can get paid what they are worth.

Don't worry, we will be there for you unlike a lot of those in the puzzle palace were not for us. Remember this, because we will be back at it in four years.

 

[h25b]

Unless we have to give up our first born, this will pass. It's not perfect and yes the retro sucks. Just think SST's and G5's.

We've gone from "STFD" to this is the best place to work overnight... Entertaining... You didn't give up your first born, just your last and future hired (47K).

And I thought you weren't giving in on the retro pay ??? Now you're saying it sucks ? And you truely believe that you're going to see an additional 2000 pilots as we're getting ready to head in to another economic recession ??? "Just think SST's and G5's" ???? WTF ? I guess SJS has made it's way to NetJets with this new TA. I'm betting that they find something else to do with NJI and 3 years is a long time to do it.

And if Warren and Richard are as evil as you made them out to be they're not changing overnight. I think this TA is outstanding given the circumstances (the best you're ever going to get) but lets not act like the union didn't meet in the middle on this one. Spinning this in to a total cave in by management is just not the case. They're at least smart enough to realize that you'll see a time when upgrades take more than 5 years and by your own words you all caved in on the retro pay issue.

 

[Hawkered]

Ahhh H25B,

As somebody who has money and has had it for quite a while, I can tell you that "money won't make you happy" statements come from people who don't have any, to make themselves feel better about their lot in life.

For the record: money has an enormous bearing on your happiness, I hope you eventually get all of it you want.

Secondly, negotiations can take on a sour note. The negotiations are over, so its time to kiss and make up, get back to work and give our customers the best product, in the newest aircraft, piloted by the best trained airman with the financial security of Berkshire Hathaway behind their investment.

Sorry if we just closed down your flight department with your 25 year old Hawkersaurus, but we are the future of private VIP transportation.

 

[BoilerUP]

I'm glad to see NJAers haven't let this TA go to their head. Where is G200 hiding at?

I'm sure the details will be posted here soon. Until then, congrats to Griz and the rest of the union officials who fought to obtain this TA. It looks like you all got alot of what you wanted!

 

[Hogprint]

h25b posted:

I think this TA is outstanding given the circumstances (the best you're ever going to get) but lets not act like the union didn't meet in the middle on this one. Spinning this in to a total cave in by management is just not the case. They're at least smart enough to realize that you'll see a time when upgrades take more than 5 years and by your own words you all caved in on the retro pay issue.

I don't think anyone has claimed that they totally caved. I think they played high pay against high retro. We could have one, but not both. That was the strategy all along. String this out till people were ready to pounce on the first "big" deal that came down the pike. I think they underestimated our resolve, and were surprised by how we held out and did not jump at the first low ball offers.

I would have liked to see more retro, but as far as I know, no precedence has been set with 100% in the past (correct me if I'm wrong). I don't know all the details on what was painful for the company, but reading BBJPilots post in the other thread, you can read between the lines. They had to make some hard decisions.

One thing is apparent in this whole process. Someone was going to get their feelings hurt. I hope it's not the kind of hurt that can't be healed.

 

[Lear70]

Now the questions are:

1. Does the "CA override pay" still apply to F/O's if another F/O junior to them upgrades?

2. Did the 7/7 schedule disappear or did the regular schedule get better? Anything less than 14 days off and I stay at the airlines.

3. How long are upgrades projected NOW if someone put in an application and obtained an interview, say, early November and was given the nod?

Thanks, and congrats on making progress... I sincerely hope it's good enough for the majority to be happy (you can't please everyone).

 

[2EASYPilot]

"Sorry if we just closed down your flight department with your 25 year old Hawkersaurus, but we are the future of private VIP transportation"

Working for a corporation that has done the numbers, I would respectively chose to disagree. Maybe for the overpaid, ego centric athletes and movie stars or corporate supplement yes.A number of the departments that have been closed down were poorly managed or the executive management believed your slick sales guys and did not read the fine print. Read your sales contracts...fractionals are very expensive and if a company choses to ignore that fact so be it. This is not a slam on NJA just the truth...you have your place but there are opportunities for all of us in aviation and the idea that one size fits all ( "we are the future of private VIP transportation" ) is a bit over the edge.

 

[Stinkbug]

This is not a slam on NJA just the truth...you have your place but there are opportunities for all of us in aviation and the idea that one size fits all ( "we are the future of private VIP transportation" ) is a bit over the edge.

Not to mention extremely arrogant...sheesh Hawkered get over yourself...we're all happy for you but your last couple of posts have been a real turn-off...

 

[Hawkered]

So this is the deal guys:

We still have some of you posting on this board saying that we're not the "real" deal, in the meantime we have over 5,000 owners and counting. The only thing missing was a unified workforce and a known cost structure for our financial department.

Yes, we are expensive. You don't have to make excuses for cost when you are selling real value. Say I was an "A-List" celebrity with enough money for my own Citation X, and I bought it and flew to the islands. What do I do if it loses a generator just after touchdown? I have to go back and get my warranty people on the phone, have to negotiate a charter to pick me up and take me back to California, in the meantime, I have to house the crew and lose utilisation on my investment while it sits..say in Barbados.

If I'm a Netjets customer, I go to the resort..and I forget about it!

They get their own people to fix it, or service techs. If the aircraft was flown in to pick me up, they'd probably get me a G-V out of St Maarten.

That is real value!

Sorry if I have sounded conceited, but attitudes like, "well if they're gonna work me more than 14 days a month", just don't cut it!

I have maintained a very humble approach to much of the conflict on this board on recent months. I make no excuse for having been an important part of this conflict resolve and I continue to be an effective negotiator.

I will say this again! If you don't want to work hard and your measurement of success is how much time you have off, we don't want you!!

Confidence, stability, hard work, motivation and loyalty are a MUST to make this work.