Netjets new payscale

[gunfyter]

questions:

- Any concessions in the LOA? why would anybody vote no??

Many, many people will vote no.

 

[jetflyer]

The pay needs more inflation protections especially with a renewal date of 2016, which after delayed negotiations means 2018!!

What if we go through a massive inflationary period like the 1970's or worse with oil reaching all time highs? Netjet pilots' pay would get wiped out by inflation with purchasing power decreasing tremendously. By 2018, if there is massive inflation Netjet Pilots might be making less in real pay after the inflation than a janitor would make in 2018 after he received multiple raises to keep his quality of life.

This 2016-2018 date sounds almost as bad as the deal American Eagle pilots got.

Inflation Protection idea:
There needs to be some agreement that the pay will go up by either the pay in the pay charts which is 3.5% per year or by the Consumer Price Index inflation number.

So if the government inflation number says there was 10% inflation, then Netjet pilots get a 10% raise that year. If the inflation number says 2% then Netjet Pilots would get the standard 3.5% raise in the charts.

If you don't have this protection and inflation goes up like in the 1970's at a crazy rate like 15% in a year then Netjet pilots will take an 11.5% pay cut that year!! (15% MINUS the standard raise of 3.5%)

This is the only way to protect the pay from the inflation that is coming.....

If you add in the inflation protections then it doesn't sound too bad. Without them it sounds bad to me.

Question: If this gets voted "NO" will there be a second round of negotiations?
Jet

P.S. feel free to pass on this inflation protection idea to the union boards or union reps.......

 

[Dr Pepper]

Where can I get a list of the new "gateways?"

13.4 Identification of Crew Bases
The one hundred (100) Crew Bases are as follows:
FAA Identifier
Airport Name
City
State
ABQ Albuquerque Intl. Sunport Albuquerque NM
ATL Hartsfield Jackson Atlanta Intl. Atlanta GA
AUS Austin Bergstrom Intl. Austin TX
BDL Bradley Intl. Windsor Locks CT
BED Hanscom Field Bedford MA
BHM Birmingham Intl. Birmingham AL
BIL Billings Logan Intl. Billings MT
BNA Nashville Intl. Nashville TN
BOI Boise Air Terminal Boise ID
BOS Logan Intl. Boston MA
BTV Burlington Intl. Burlington VT
BUF Buffalo Niagara Intl. Buffalo NY
BWI Baltimore Washington Intl. Baltimore MD
CHS Charleston Intl. Charleston SC
CLE Cleveland Hopkins Intl. Cleveland OH
CLT Charlotte Douglas Intl. Charlotte NC
CMH Port Columbus Intl. Columbus OH
COS City Of Colorado Springs Municipal Colorado Springs CO
CVG Cincinnati Northern Kentucky Intl. Covington KY
DAL Dallas Love Fld. Dallas TX
DCA Reagan National District of Columbia VA
DEN Denver Intl. Denver CO
DFW Dallas/Fort Worth Dallas TX
DRO Durango La Plata County Durango CO
DSM Des Moines Intl. Des Moines IA
DTW Detroit Metro Wayne County Detroit MI
ELP El Paso Intl. El Paso TX
EWR Newark Liberty Intl. Newark NJ
FAR Hector Intl. Fargo ND
FSD Joe Foss Field Sioux Falls SD
GEG Spokane Intl. Spokane WA
GRR Gerald R. Ford Intl. Grand Rapids MI
GSO Piedmont Triad Intl. Greensboro NC
GSP Greenville Spartanburg Intl. Greer SC
HOU William P. Hobby Houston TX
HPN Westchester County White Plains NY
IAD Washington Dulles Intl. Washington, DC VA
ICT Wichita Mid Continent Wichita KS
ILM Wilmington Intl. Wilmington NC
IND Indianapolis Intl. Indianapolis IN
JAC Jackson Hole Jackson WY
JAN Jackson Evers Intl. Jackson MS
JAX Jacksonville Intl. Jacksonville FL
LAS McCarran Intl. Las Vegas NV
LAX Los Angeles Intl. Los Angeles CA
LGA La Guardia New York NY
LIT Adams Field Little Rock AR
MAF Midland Intl. Midland TX
MCI Kansas City Intl. Kansas City MO
MCO Orlando Intl. Orlando FL
MDW Chicago Midway Intl. Chicago IL
MEM Memphis Intl. Memphis TN
MFD Medford Oregon OR
MHT Manchester New Hampshire NH
MIA Miami Intl. Miami FL
MKE General Mitchell Intl. Milwaukee WI
MLI Quad City Intl. Moline IL
MSP Minneapolis St. Paul Intl. Minneapolis MN
MSY Louis Armstrong New Orleans Intl. New Orleans LA
OKC Will Rogers World Oklahoma City OK
OMA Eppley Airfield Omaha NE
ORD Chicago O’Hare Intl. Chicago IL
ORF Norfolk Intl. Norfolk VA
PBI Palm Beach Intl. West Palm Beach FL
PDK Peachtree DeKalb Atlanta GA
PDX Portland Intl. Portland OR
PHL Philadelphia Intl. Philadelphia PA
PHX Phoenix Sky Harbor Intl. Phoenix AZ
PIT Pittsburgh Intl. Pittsburgh PA
PNS Pensacola Regional Pensacola FL
PSP Palm Springs Intl. Palm Springs CA
PVD Theodore Francis Green State Providence RI
PWM Portland Intl. Jetport Portland ME
RIC Richmond Intl. Richmond VA
RAP Rapid City Regional Rapid City SD
RDU Raleigh Durham Intl. Raleigh/Durham NC
RNO Reno Tahoe Intl. Reno NV
ROC Greater Rochester Intl. Rochester NY
RSW Southwest Florida Intl. Fort Meyers FL
SAN San Diego Intl. San Diego CA
SAT San Antonio Intl. San Antonio TX
SAV Savannah Hilton Head Intl. Savannah GA
SDF Louisville Intl Standiford Field Louisville KY
SEA Seattle Tacoma Intl. Seattle WA
SFO San Francisco Intl. San Francisco CA
SGF Springfield Branson National Springfield MO
SHV Shreveport Regional Shreveport LA
SJC Norman Y Mineta San Jose Intl. San Jose CA
SLC Salt Lake City Intl. Salt Lake City UT
SMF Sacramento Intl. Sacramento CA
SNA John Wayne Airport Orange County Santa Ana CA
STL Lambert St Louis Intl. St Louis MO
SYR Syracuse Hancock Intl. Syracuse NY
TEB Teterboro TeterboroNJ
TLH Tallahassee Regional Tallahassee FL
TPA Tampa Intl. Tampa FL
TUL Tulsa Intl. Tulsa OK
TUS Tucson Intl. Tucson AZ
TYS Mc Ghee Tyson Knoxville TN
VNY Van Nuys Van Nuys CA

 

[dillfer]

Isn't netjets bargaining now because they can't keep pilots? If inflation goes up as much as you're speculating won't they in theory start losing pilots again and they will have to come back to the table before 2016? It seems as though guys would be happy with all of the extra money that will be earned between now and the original contract experation date of 2010 or 2011, whatever it is.

I don't work there and haven't seen the proposal so I'm probably way off base. Just had to ask the questions.

 

[B19 Flyer]

The pay needs more inflation protections especially with a renewal date of 2016, which after delayed negotiations means 2018!!

What if we go through a massive inflationary period like the 1970's or worse with oil reaching all time highs? Netjet pilots' pay would get wiped out by inflation with purchasing power decreasing tremendously. By 2018, if there is massive inflation Netjet Pilots might be making less in real pay after the inflation than a janitor would make in 2018 after he received multiple raises to keep his quality of life.

This 2016-2018 date sounds almost as bad as the deal American Eagle pilots got.

Inflation Protection idea:
There needs to be some agreement that the pay will go up by either the pay in the pay charts which is 3.5% per year or by the Consumer Price Index inflation number.

So if the government inflation number says there was 10% inflation, then Netjet pilots get a 10% raise that year. If the inflation number says 2% then Netjet Pilots would get the standard 3.5% raise in the charts.

If you don't have this protection and inflation goes up like in the 1970's at a crazy rate like 15% in a year then Netjet pilots will take an 11.5% pay cut that year!! (15% MINUS the standard raise of 3.5%)

This is the only way to protect the pay from the inflation that is coming.....

If you add in the inflation protections then it doesn't sound too bad. Without them it sounds bad to me.

Question: If this gets voted "NO" will there be a second round of negotiations?
Jet

P.S. feel free to pass on this inflation protection idea to the union boards or union reps.......

Wait a minute here.. all the posts on these boards have implied that the NJ contract is perfect. That's why the FLOPS guys are so excited! Has the union not negotiated a perfect and flawless contract? How could that possibly be?

Gee, to me a deal is a deal. If it was ratified by the masses, then it should stay just the way it is, good or bad. Isn't that the whole thing about trusting the union and being represented and having a single voice?

 

[niteflyr]

Yep, we should vote it down because of what inflation "might" do. Because if inflation goes way up, the economy will go way down. Business will slow down and then we can have furloughs and then go negotiate a better deal than this measly IBB is proposing. We all know NJA will never suffer a downturn from the 250 mil we are making per year right now so lets just put off any pay increases for a while.

On the other hand if we take the money being offered now we will be guaranteed these amounts for several years into the future in case the economy does fall off the toilet seat and start to swirl. Nahhhhh, couldn't happen.

 

[ProFracPilot]

Isn't that the whole thing about trusting the union and being represented and having a single voice?

Don't feed the troll by letting him hijack the thread.

Carry on.

 

[400pilot]

Wait a minute here.. all the posts on these boards have implied that the NJ contract is perfect.

No they don't.......just because people like a contract doesn't mean it is perfect.....

That's why the FLOPS guys are so excited!

We are not excited. This just reminds us how much our company sucks......yeah, I'm excited about falling more behind.....

Has the union not negotiated a perfect and flawless contract? How could that possibly be?

Another stupid statement. When both sides think they could have done a little better, it is usually a pretty good deal.

Gee, to me a deal is a deal. If it was ratified by the masses, then it should stay just the way it is, good or bad. Isn't that the whole thing about trusting the union and being represented and having a single voice?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believed it was NJ management that requested to open negotiations in order to attract and retain pilots.....

 

[doylehargraves]

Yep, we should vote it down because of what inflation "might" do. Because if inflation goes way up, the economy will go way down. Business will slow down and then we can have furloughs and then go negotiate a better deal than this measly IBB is proposing. We all know NJA will never suffer a downturn from the 250 mil we are making per year right now so lets just put off any pay increases for a while.

On the other hand if we take the money being offered now we will be guaranteed these amounts for several years into the future in case the economy does fall off the toilet seat and start to swirl. Nahhhhh, couldn't happen.

Since when has inflation ever affected your daily life when you're making near $100k a year? give me a freagin break. Inflation only affects lower class people. If you guys turn down this kind of a raise because you think milk will go from $1.99 to $2.23 a gallon in 6 years, you need to take a course in Money & Banking, because that would be a huge mistake on your part.

 

[skiandsurf]

Here is my thoughts on this IBB...

1. Money. Its is great for the FOs. "Most" of the captains will be making over $100,000...How many pilots are making 6 figures? Maybe a few in the regionals. Probably not that many in charter or corporate. And probably all major airline captains.

1a. Job security. How many pilot jobs are as secure as NJs? (corp, airlines)

2. Insurance. I read it again and again, I see no change, other than for the retirees.

2a. Retiree benifits. Would you want to rely on a company provided health care plan that they can eliminate or change, or take the money now and invest in your own plan.....Kinda like 401k....dont touch MY money.

3. Schedules....7n7, no change...still have 21 day vacations.

...15 day month....no trips longer than 5 days.. I am sure lot of guys will like having the shorter trips.

...18 day trips. This will be a "known" schedule. This is a huge improvement over the current "hello scheduling, am I off tomorrow?".

4. Vacations...15 days for both the 15 and 18 day schedules.

5. 401k...bigger paycheck now= bigger 401k later. And with the signing bonus, if you put it all in the 401k, they will again match up to 50%....= more money in the long run.

6. Company credit card...again, this is my hang-up. I had a great 8 day/7 night vacation at the Maui Grand Wailaei. $700/night x 7 nights=FREE. My family likes that benifit.

In summary, we all want to make tons of money and only work every other tues, wed and thurs. But reality hurts. We need to invest in ourselves. Instead of buying that 2nd boat or 3rd motorcycle, invest in something meaningful. I have 5 rental properties, sadly I dont have a boat. Unfortunatly, when we are young, we need the money to get started (house, kids, clothes) and as we get older we realize that we need to start saving for ourselves, unless you are depending on the gov't to take care of you.

Its like when a revision to the checklist comes out, everyone bitches about it for a week or two, then its back to normal.

GIVE ME THE MONEY NOW. Let me decide how to take care of myself.