Netjets Ain Article

[dime line]

Wow Cat Yack you sound like you have all the right answers! So I guess while your on strike you will make your Millions, go for it man.

Your an idiot

 

[CatYaaak]

Wow Cat Yack you sound like you have all the right answers! So I guess while your on strike you will make your Millions, go for it man.

Your an idiot

Where I am, unions aren't even legal. But enough said... it would be another form of folly to respond to someone who can't even figure out when to use contractions. Typos are one thing, but twice in two sentences out of three? Yikes.

 

[AcroChik]

Informational Picketting

I do not work at NetJets. I do not know every detail of the historical and painful dispute between my fellow pilots and management. But I do know one thing, and I know it well:

If you want to reach the NetJets owner population with the legitimate aspects of your grievances, informational picketing is absolutely not the way to do it.

Anything to do with picketting, demonstrations, potential confrontational debates, is the sort of thing people such as NetJets owners will avoid like a disease.

You are setting yourselves up to get a lot of negative attention from the people you want to recruit!

Why not reach out to them in the forums and style they best understand?

Magazines such as Fortune, Forbes, Investors Business Daily, Variety, etc.

Have your leadership have face to face meetings with such people who are leadership figures for the NetJets ownership.

A wise man said, "Style is the man to whom you are speaking." It's a home truth.

You're not speaking to economy class passengers. You are trying to reach out to people with a highly developed sense of their own self worth as well as significant assets. You have to reach out to them as who they ARE.

The tactical execution of your strategy has to fit who your ally is, not convert them to your enemy.

I might not have my ATP yet, but I know that what I'm saying here is a fact.

Disclosure: I've attended 11 Berkshire Hathaway shareholder meetings.

 

[Hugh Johnson]

If NJ goes on strike and your company picks up their flying, are you a scab?

 

[semperfido]

the ownwers could care less about yout your problems

 

[CatYaaak]

I do not work at NetJets. I do not know every detail of the historical and painful dispute between my fellow pilots and management. But I do know one thing, and I know it well:

If you want to reach the NetJets owner population with the legitimate aspects of your grievances, informational picketing is absolutely not the way to do it.

Anything to do with picketting, demonstrations, potential confrontational debates, is the sort of thing people such as NetJets owners will avoid like a disease.

You are setting yourselves up to get a lot of negative attention from the people you want to recruit!

Why not reach out to them in the forums and style they best understand?

Magazines such as Fortune, Forbes, Investors Business Daily, Variety, etc.

Have your leadership have face to face meetings with such people who are leadership figures for the NetJets ownership.

A wise man said, "Style is the man to whom you are speaking." It's a home truth.

You're not speaking to economy class passengers. You are trying to reach out to people with a highly developed sense of their own self worth as well as significant assets. You have to reach out to them as who they ARE.

The tactical execution of your strategy has to fit who your ally is, not convert them to your enemy.

I might not have my ATP yet, but I know that what I'm saying here is a fact.

Disclosure: I've attended 11 Berkshire Hathaway shareholder meetings.

By far, this is the most perceptive and intelligent post on the entire subject.

 

[h25b]

I think that the owners walking in would care that their pilots were working 70 hours --or more!--in a week. How rested could they be? That 14 hour days are considered normal, might make them uneasy, when viewed in light of recent accidents. Being made aware of the low wages these same pilots are paid, just might have them questioning the way their management fees are being spent. The whole purpose of informational picketing is to educate those that are affected by the contract dispute. Clearly, that would be the owners and given the amount of money they have invested, it is not unreasonable to think that they would, indeed, be interested.

Let me remove the mystery for you lady... THEY DON'T CARE. Most of them are with NetJets because it's a cheaper alternative of something (charter, an in-house flight department, etc...) For most of the people your hubby is flying a 14 hour day is the norm.

Ignoring these fundamental facts is not helping the cause.

 

[ultrarunner]

If NJ goes on strike and your company picks up their flying, are you a scab?

No, a scab would be someone that is hired by NJ, crosses the picket line, and begins flying the NJ aircraft that are parked due to the strike.

I hope that clears it up for you.

 

[Ace-of-the-Base]

Real smart....embarrass the owners while they're engaged in business affairs or annoy/encroach on them while they're paying top $$$ for private ones. No doubt they'll have forgotton all about it when it's time to renew their contracts (not). And because what NetJets offers is SO unique (not), like bargain-hunting airline pax searching the web for the cheapest fares (not) they have no other alternatives than to live with whatever hassles the pilots forced them to endure (not). They are a captive audience (not) and besides, the vast majority being pro-"collectivized labor" in spirit (not) anyway, the owners will no doubt rally to your cause (not).

And what would NJAowner know about owners or the realm of private aviation?.....after all, he's "just" an owner who's successful enough to access and engage in it...ultimately paying the bills... and given that skewed perspective, he could sure learn a lot about himself if he would only listen to ex-airline and ex-military pilots about what motivates people who fly in the cabins of business aircraft.

Personally though, I'm all for the picketing and a strike. If a strike does occur, it'll be a perfect opportunity to take a few years off from flying and get into corporate aircraft sales and consulting setting up new, small flight departments. Retire early. Join the Red Bull racing circuit for fun when I'm not skiing or dicking around on a new, Wyoming ranch, and in my spare time (for those dynamite fishermen using their unemployment benefits to go back to college), write a texbook entitled "Labor Relations; Obvious Things Not To Do". I'll autograph a copy (not a free one, though) for Griz.

So go for it guys, get in their face! Rah Rah! Owners are just airline pax with fatter wallets with no...um...Options. You're unique and highly-skilled professionals doing things nobody has ever done before, so don't settle for anything less than 200K/year, 10-hour duty days, 4/8 schedules, and 5 gateways per state.

Is there any way I can help?

Hey Catpuke, not many get your sense of humor and irony. I think the above post is great. Anyway, you are right. What they are doing is sh$ting where you sleep (and get your paycheck). But when dealing with employer and employee, both need each other. If you come to an impasse, you must cut off your own nose (a little), or they'll never take your resolve on the issue seriously. I've certainly been there before, and I've had it work and not work. You are very correct, it will pan out that feathers are ruffled and some 'owners' may ultimately leave. But what is improved should be far worth it, and if NetJets really is the best fractional, they will survive this small detour and arise better than ever with a well paid, well treated, happy workforce (which makes our buddy NJAowner a happy camper).



Ace

 

[Ace-of-the-Base]

You are setting yourselves up to get a lot of negative attention from the people you want to recruit!

Why not reach out to them in the forums and style they best understand?

Magazines such as Fortune, Forbes, Investors Business Daily, Variety, etc.

Close, but I think you're missing the obvious. Business leaders read articles about how the working class is getting hosed all the time. The plight of the downtrodden, including nurses, doctors, etc. is part of their consciousness already. A meeting, an article in the WSJ is going to be like a f&rt in a hurricane. NetJets is by FAR the largest fractional with the largest customer base. I don't think right now the employees that are being paid half of the industry standards and working harder than any of us are (nor should be) worried right now about 'recruiting'.



Yes, you have to break some eggs, there will be fall-out. But the only way these 'owners' will get involved, is when it affects THEM. And when NJ management gets the first whiff of that, things will progress quite quickly.



Meetings, articles, editorials, will just drag this out and accomplish nothing but a workforce further divided from their company

Ace

 

[bizjet737]

No, a scab would be someone that is hired by NJ, crosses the picket line, and begins flying the NJ aircraft that are parked due to the strike.

I hope that clears it up for you.

actually, that's not totally correct. yes, flying a netjets a/c (including ejm, nji, njla if they fly any netjets trips) would put you on a scab list. also, any flying done by subcontractors, those pilots will also be put on the scab list.

 

[h25b]

also, any flying done by subcontractors, those pilots will also be put on the scab list.

I doubt it... At least if you're referring to the outfits doing "sell-offs"...

 

[Ace-of-the-Base]

I doubt it... At least if you're referring to the outfits doing "sell-offs"...

I agree. That would be like saying American Airlines' pilots are scabs when Untited is on strike and American honors United's pax tickets.

Ace

 

[miles otoole]

I agree. That would be like saying American Airlines' pilots are scabs when Untited is on strike and American honors United's pax tickets.

Ace

Deleted-a bit of gray area

 

[niteflyr]

Don't be fooled...

Anyone operating a Netjets flight while the pilots are striking is considered crossing the picket line and will be considered a scab. It has been that way in the past and this would be no different. No it is not like going to a different carrier and them being scabs, I don't even see how you can compare your United and American scenario. That would apply if we were trying to call Options or Flex pilots scabs for operating while we strike, which we obviously aren't. We are talking about other pilots working for the company while we are in a stoppage, yes a sub-contractor would fall into this category.

 

[El Chupacabra]

Yes they will be considered scabs and placed on the scablist. No problem if the end of the line for you is flying at a 135 charter operation.

 

[h25b]

Anyone operating a Netjets flight while the pilots are striking is considered crossing the picket line and will be considered a scab. It has been that way in the past and this would be no different. No it is not like going to a different carrier and them being scabs, I don't even see how you can compare your United and American scenario. That would apply if we were trying to call Options or Flex pilots scabs for operating while we strike, which we obviously aren't. We are talking about other pilots working for the company while we are in a stoppage, yes a sub-contractor would fall into this category.

Whatever dude, go ahead and see it that way if you want. Our corporate a/c are on a charter certificate and we do work for Options, NetJets, and Citation Shares. I doubt VERY seriously that will change. You guys are AND SHOULD be grieving this, but to hold people like us accountable would be a HUGE mistake. There's no doubt that YOUR company is screwing with you on this one. But other people shouldn't AND WON'T be held accountable for the weaknesses of your situation.

The NetJets pilots better stop flooding corporate operations with resumes because that black-balling can AND will cut both ways. I just wouldn't recommend burning bridges when the time comes.

Remember who your friends are in this business. Doesn't matter anyway, NOT going to happen.

 

[miles otoole]

Yes they will be considered scabs and placed on the scablist. No problem if the end of the line for you is flying at a 135 charter operation.

Who's scab list? NetJets? So these scabs won't be able to be hired by NJA in the future? Doubt ALPA airlines would recognize the list. It was a fear tactic in the 70s and 80s. Not much teeth in today's economy. Tell Santulli he can't use these scabs for sell offs in the future. right.

 

[h25b]

Yes they will be considered scabs and placed on the scablist. No problem if the end of the line for you is flying at a 135 charter operation.

Those in glass houses...

I sure wouldn't want to count on making a career out of NetJets at this point (talk about a bad "end of the line"). By the way, our pilots make about twice what your crews do on the same equipment. I will gladly volunteer to be banned from working at NetJets. Where can I sign up for this?

 

[El Chupacabra]

Yes the ALPA scablist. Arrangements have already been made. Two former UAL MEC members (who submitted the names of the 1985 UAL scabs) now fly with us. Those that cross will make the list. We are direct communications with Judus Iscariot ... maintainer of the master scablist.