Netjet Profit 143 million

[FamilyGuy]

Huh?

Wolfpack,

you couldnt be more INcorrect. Yes 1108 did get us more money and a better schedule ect. But they have also been the spearhead in alot of cost savings, from ideas on crewfood to proper scheduling of pilots to not pay overtime.

So now the union was spearheading the efforts on crew food?

If that's the case, then why all the bitching about crew food on these boards?

Stop drinking the kool-aid. Crew meals are what keep the airplanes moving and keep the cash rolling in all day. The crew meals suck period! Quality and quantity are way down. Looking forward to a side salad with your meal? you will get some lettuce stuffed into a water cooler sized dixie cup. Some of the stuff isn't safe for human consumption. Lots of cases where there have been moldy food or spoiled food because it sits at the caterers for weeks on end. But hey, that's what you get when you only pay a caterer $10 for breakfast, $15 for lunch, and $20 for dinner. Did I mention that delivery is included? What kind of quality do you think we are getting when the caterers are taking a hit just for doing business with Netjets? Stevies on the West coast is losing big bucks on us. It's not only our food, but the customers food as well that is looking bad.

If you want a good meal you have to order two or three selections at a time, and it is not just for a decent selection, it is to keep from going hungry. If one meal sucks you have a nalternate to get you through to the next leg to order yet another two or three meals.

Yeah great, another bean counter figured out a way to save a few pennies. This business is all about customer care, that was thrown out the window with the new contract. Funny thing is that a bean counter can't figure out that the company really does need to take care of the pilots in order to keep the planes moving. When we start to park them and go get a decent meal then maybe they will figure it out.

We can thank Dick for the food fiasco. Those in the know know whom I am talking about.

 

[learflyer]

The most highly trained pilots in the industry that NetJets created back in 1964. People pay a premium here to get premium service and flexability in a 14+ type, 400+ A/C fleet. Add to the fact that people like to go with a winner doesn't hurt the cause either. It is what it is and it is only going to get better.imp:

Are u saying that Netjets pilots are the most highly trained pilots?

 

[FamilyGuy]

A better way to describe IBT 1108s effect on profits is better done by the statement, "A union has allowed the company to waste less money on inefficiencies in spite of it's (NJAs) own incompetence."

What??

I'll let you split hairs on the retro/signing bonus description, but the above statement goes beyond the pale.

An organization who just 18 months ago was encouraging its members to write planes up, break equipment, DNIF, and anything else you can think of to inflict financial pain on the company so that you can pressure them to cave into your demands can not make an audacious claim like that.

A better description of the union's effect on profits would be "we resumed performing our duties and allowed the business model to generate the profits it was designed to do from the beginning, instead of throwing wrenches in the gears to show our frustration"

It isn't a question of how much money was made. The same amount will be made by revenue opportunities. Waste... waste (expenses) is the key here.

This is very true.

Future profits will be tied to our ability to wring more waste out of the system.

 

[fischman]

An organization who just 18 months ago was encouraging its members to write planes up, break equipment, DNIF, and anything else you can think of to inflict financial pain on the company so that you can pressure them to cave into your demands can not make an audacious claim like that.

A better description of the union's effect on profits would be "we resumed performing our duties and allowed the business model to generate the profits it was designed to do from the beginning, instead of throwing wrenches in the gears to show our frustration"

First off, IBT 1108 never encouraged pilots to intentionally break NJA aircraft. That would be both unprofessional and immoral. We did what we were told to do in the FOM by writing up broken items on the aircraft when we found them. Just like we still do. It is our job to keep aircraft looking and flying great.


Secondly, IBT 1108 never encouraged pilots to abuse the DNIF system.

We "resumed" our duties? Help me out here... Did anybody stop performing our duties? I didn't. I did what I was told. To the letter...

 

[RNObased]

What??

An organization who just 18 months ago was encouraging its members to write planes up, break equipment, DNIF, and anything else you can think of to inflict financial pain on the company so that you can pressure them to cave into your demands can not make an audacious claim like that.

A better description of the union's effect on profits would be "we resumed performing our duties and allowed the business model to generate the profits it was designed to do from the beginning, instead of throwing wrenches in the gears to show our frustration"

Family Guy,
Paint it anyway you want to, I'm sure YOU would have issues if YOU talked to someone for FOUR years and they didn't listen. Maybe you would even resort to trying to get their attention???

The business model would work even better if someone would get their hands around some of the willy-nilly ferrying and other crap that goes on. Maybe you can pass this little information along to someone in CMH, JET FUEL COSTS MONEY. The way they do stuff I don't believe they know that.

 

[netjetwife]

FG, not only do I agree with FL22, but I can point to an excellent example--the overhaul of the training dept which has been led by the Union Training Committee. The company expects to save millions when all of the new programs (primarily designed by the UTC) are implemented. The UTC Chairman is immensely respected by members of upper management because of his ability to help them solve problems and improve the training program, which they recognize was clearly inefficient. That's not an "audacious claim" it's a fact. Here's another--NJA could have saved even more training dollars had they began work on the overhaul much earlier, but they were too busy fighting the pilots instead of working with them. The 2005 CBA established joint Union-Management committees to work on improving efficiency and productivity and the plan to redesign training to save millions was formulated in that cooperative spirit.

Additionally, I hardly think my husband is the only pilot who points out to the schedulers a more efficient operation when he sees that their plan isn't the best one based on the facts of the situation as he knows them to be from being there firsthand.

Furthermore, there was definitely a big difference, dollar-wise, between true Retro pay and the signing bonus. For some pilots it was a substantial loss so to define the difference as "splitting hairs"...is just...well...beyond the pale. Yes, I do think that the pilots who lost so much they considered the signing bonus a "slap in the face" (a quote I heard repeatedly) would find your downplaying of their contribution to the company coffers offensive. Please give credit where credit is due. NJW

 

[gunfyter]

Ahhh..

Wouldn't we all be better off without dredging up the past and concentrate on the Future $250M profit we will achieve in 2007?

 

[netjetwife]

Yes sir.... Don't I get partial credit for talking about joint efforts to save money... That is thinking optimistically, isn't it? The money not wasted on inefficiency will add to the profit margin, will it not?

I dare say, Gunfyter, we'll all be pleased should your financial prediction prove true.

 

[learflyer]

Like someone mentioned before, this is the same company that was bad-mouthed just a couple short years ago. I'm glad you have your contract, and wish you the best in the future, but please stop with the azz kissing! Sheesh! I'm waiting for someone to say "management mended me a sweater with thier nosehair" or something like that! <<<now that is some funny stuff!

 

[gunfyter]

Pumba,

Sometimes you gotta leave your past behind you.

Fact is... excluding F/A-18's out of Beaufort, SC or Miramar, CA... This is now the best job in Aviation.

 

[RNObased]

FG, not only do I agree with FL22, but I can point to an excellent example--the overhaul of the training dept which has been led by the Union Training Committee. The company expects to save millions when all of the new programs (primarily designed by the UTC) are implemented. The UTC Chairman is immensely respected by members of upper management because of his ability to help them solve problems and improve the training program, which they recognize was clearly inefficient. That's not an "audacious claim" it's a fact. Here's another--NJA could have saved even more training dollars had they began work on the overhaul much earlier, but they were too busy fighting the pilots instead of working with them. The 2005 CBA established joint Union-Management committees to work on improving efficiency and productivity and the plan to redesign training to save millions was formulated in that cooperative spirit.

NJW,
Not to get into a agrument with you, but I won't be talking about the "great" job of the UTC with regards to the training program. It is hardly a roaring success, and I can site examples all day long, but I'm not going to air NJA dirty laudry on this board.

What you hear and the reality are two different things.

 

[FamilyGuy]

Family Guy,
Paint it anyway you want to, I'm sure YOU would have issues if YOU talked to someone for FOUR years and they didn't listen. Maybe you would even resort to trying to get their attention???

The business model would work even better if someone would get their hands around some of the willy-nilly ferrying and other crap that goes on. Maybe you can pass this little information along to someone in CMH, JET FUEL COSTS MONEY. The way they do stuff I don't believe they know that.

RNO - I understand your frustration with not being heard or being able to fix the obvious problems that surround us all. I'm frankly amazed sometimes that we make money in spite of ourselves. I just don't agree with the philosophy of wasting more money to get their attention.

You are exactly right that there continues to be huge amounts of waste in the system. I've seen the double ferrys as well and I don't understand them either. I just try to do my job to the best of my ability and hope that everyone else is doing the same.

I do point out those problems when I see them and try to either get the problem fixed or understand what causes them. Sometimes I've learned that its our same business model that creates these problems (100% on demand flying with planes breaking and crew members getting sick or running out of duty time causes a lot of scrambling to meet the schedule demands) and sometimes they flat out admit they made a mistake and missed an opportunity for a more efficient solution.

I will tell you that everyone in the flight center is doing the best job they can with the tools they have. Are mistakes made? Yes. But we try to learn from them and make the system more efficient every day.

 

[FamilyGuy]

FG, not only do I agree with FL22, but I can point to an excellent example--the overhaul of the training dept which has been led by the Union Training Committee. The company expects to save millions when all of the new programs (primarily designed by the UTC) are implemented. The UTC Chairman is immensely respected by members of upper management because of his ability to help them solve problems and improve the training program, which they recognize was clearly inefficient. That's not an "audacious claim" it's a fact. Here's another--NJA could have saved even more training dollars had they began work on the overhaul much earlier, but they were too busy fighting the pilots instead of working with them. The 2005 CBA established joint Union-Management committees to work on improving efficiency and productivity and the plan to redesign training to save millions was formulated in that cooperative spirit.

Additionally, I hardly think my husband is the only pilot who points out to the schedulers a more efficient operation when he sees that their plan isn't the best one based on the facts of the situation as he knows them to be from being there firsthand.

Furthermore, there was definitely a big difference, dollar-wise, between true Retro pay and the signing bonus. For some pilots it was a substantial loss so to define the difference as "splitting hairs"...is just...well...beyond the pale. Yes, I do think that the pilots who lost so much they considered the signing bonus a "slap in the face" (a quote I heard repeatedly) would find your downplaying of their contribution to the company coffers offensive. Please give credit where credit is due. NJW

NJW - UTC, crew food, scheduling improvements, and whatever other cost savings initiatives are out there are all positive improvements, but they are not the main drivers behind the company swinging from an $80 million dollar loss to a $143 million dollar profit. The profit in 2006 is the result of everyone getting back to work and letting the business model perform as designed. When everyone worked and didn't break planes, we needed much less subcontract - even Buffett stated that in the annual report - this is the main reason for the profit and why I said FL22's claim was audacious.

Don't get me wrong. All of the cost saving initiatives and cooperation between the employees and the company will be critical if we are to move from $143 million in profit to the $250 million that GF is predicting. Controlling waste is key as FL22 noted.

As for the retro/signing bonus comment, my remarks were not intended to speak to the financial differences between true retro and signing bonus. The context was that with the large sums of money the pilots were getting (call it what you will) they could buy some BRK.B shares if they thought they were a good investment.

 

[Diesel]

First why is everyone so wraped up in the idea of making money. As long as we are not losing money and giving brk their kickup you will never see this company break the 200 to 250million dollar profit. Because at that point the owners realize hey we might be getting screwed on these prices. Look at this company making record profits and the paint on my plane still peeling away.

Second. Common njw your husband is the only guy calling in scheduling snafu's? Really? I did get a chuckle out of the utc chairman line. How do you know this again?

Fg
I do think you are right to a certain extent. The reason we have the swing is because the pilots are motivated to help the company. Crew food, training, the people upstairs are really just a drop in the bucket in the big picture. A well motivated work force can do wonders for the company. The key is respect them and what they do and it will pay back in spades. I don't think the company has learned this lesson yet though.

 

[ozpilot]

When everyone worked and didn't break planes,

You make some good arguments, and in large part I agree with you, but I really find your comment that pilots "broke" planes leading up to the contract offensive.

First we're more professional than that, and second it was not even necessary.

What the pilot group did was comply fully with the requirements of the FARS, the FOM and the contract. That's all thats required if you want to upset the challenging operation that is Netjets.

 

[Ultra Grump]

First why is everyone so wraped up in the idea of making money. As long as we are not losing money and giving brk their kickup you will never see this company break the 200 to 250million dollar profit. Because at that point the owners realize hey we might be getting screwed on these prices. Look at this company making record profits and the paint on my plane still peeling away.

This is so true.

Second. Common njw...

---Grammar police hat on---

"Common" is not the same as "come on", or "c'mon." It is "common"ly used incorrectly on this board.

Sorry, this has bugged me for quite a while now.

---Grammar police hat off---

 

[learflyer]

Havent' you ever been to Jersey? I imagine you have flying the fracs 'n' all. "come on" in Jersey is "oh common". Another grammar mistake made on this board is the word "lose" . Most people say "loose" . As in Loose stool. I'm drinkin' leave me alone.

 

[Diesel]

I'm typing on my bb. Its hard enough to check spelling on the thing.

But common is just like hey mon want some ganja?

 

[netjetwife]

Diesel--please reread my post. I said " I hardly think my husband is the only pilot who points out to the schedulers... That means that I certainly can't believe my husband is "the only guy calling in scheduling snafu's." Now come on Diesel, if you're going to pick on my post at least do it fairly and correctly. To answer your question--I follow along closely and have excellent sources. Notice that is multiple. My comments reflect the opinions of myself and others that are very involved.

UG, the "common njw" puzzled me until I realized that my marriage status wasn't being questioned... But far be it for me--an ordinary wife --to complain. I'll gladly leave you pilots to police yourselves--good luck on the grammar and spelling...

FG, I rather thought that those who followed the NJ saga would see the obvious--profits were realized after management decided to motivate the pilots by giving them (most, at least) a fair deal. I mentioned the other efforts because I thought it only right to give both parties credit for their efforts at working together. As to buying BH shares, most NJ families were/are making up for the basic components they fell behind on. New homes, vehicles, college funds, and bringing up the 401K hold a higher priority right now. Considering that many pilots also had a lot of debt to pay off, as well, the signing bonus didn't stretch as far as you seem to think it did. The other points were well stated by Ozpilot.

LF, one should not mistake optimism for less attractive behavior... Clearly, both sides stand to gain more by working together. The point I was making is that some progress in that regard is now being made--finally. It's a beginning and the possibility of a relationship built on mutual respect has never been better, even though there is a long road ahead.

RNO, I don't consider differing opinions to constitute an argument... It's not what I "hear" (though that is a lot) as much as the hard work that I see produced by the UTC. The fact that the company has been slow to implement the programs designed by the UTC is not that committee's fault. Not everyone in management was open to improving the product and that has caused difficulty. There's also bound to be a good deal of mistrust and hard feelings after such a protracted contract battle. Attitudes like that hinder progress, but I can assure you that it hasn't been for lack of trying by the UTC who has done a great job and should be fully supported by the pilots. When you look at the status of the training program remind yourself that you can lead a horse to water....but you can't make it drink...

That said, I don't think it's as hopeless as that. This past week saw a big step in the right direction and the UTC is gearing up for more hard work. If you have questions about the committee's efforts and their progress to date why not give the Chairman a call or email him? I agree that specific details aren't appropriate for this forum. As for what I hear...you'd be surprised... I have an excellent grasp on the reality of the situation and quite thoroughly understand the frustration involved on all sides.

Wishing you all good flights and happy days at home,
Netjetwife

 

[Ultra Grump]

I'm typing on my bb. Its hard enough to check spelling on the thing.

It has nothing to do with checking spelling; it's using the wrong word, and you use "common" instead of "come on" or "c'mon" every time.

Sorry bud, just a pet peeve. You talk about being professionals in the tipping thread, yet to me being able to spell and use proper grammar to get a point across, particularly in the written word, is much more the mark of a professional. It really makes me wonder sometimes about the piloting profession when reading the message boards.

But common is just like hey mon want some ganja?

Seems like you may have taken Mr Marley up on his offer?