NBAA SMS Class

[Adios]

I Just wanted to give a heads up for anyone who wishes to spend $1500 on any upcomimg NBAA SMS class. I attended the class in HOU last week along with many other well known corporate operators and we were all very disappointed with the 3 day class. It was Not worth the money so make sure you do your homework and are well briefed before attending.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

I Just wanted to give a heads up for anyone who wishes to spend $1500 on any upcomimg NBAA SMS class. I attended the class in HOU last week along with many other well known corporate operators and we were all very disappointed with the 3 day class. It was Not worth the money so make sure you do your homework and are well briefed before attending.

Thanks for that!

The entire SMS idea is a joke....the only ones who think otherwise are all the newly minted "consulatants" that will come in and tell you how much it will benefit your department.

Instead of hiring smart people, paying them well, and insisting they operate by industry accepted guidelines you now need a "SMS"

 

[TransMach]

Thanks for that!

The entire SMS idea is a joke....the only ones who think otherwise are all the newly minted "consulatants" that will come in and tell you how much it will benefit your department.

Instead of hiring smart people, paying them well, and insisting they operate by industry accepted guidelines you now need a "SMS"

Yup, what he said X2 ...

TransMach

 

[Brett Hull]

I heard the SMS described as a solution that was created in search of a problem.

 

[Adios]

Gulf I couldn't agree more with you, but when your "Dumb Boss" buys a $7K prism SMS manual and then asks you to be the SMS Manager what ya do? I look at it this way....if I can get this thing up and going then just maybe I can get out of the flying business and get a real J.O.B.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

Gulf I couldn't agree more with you, but when your "Dumb Boss" buys a $7K prism SMS manual and then asks you to be the SMS Manager what ya do? I look at it this way....if I can get this thing up and going then just maybe I can get out of the flying business and get a real J.O.B.

Problem with real jobs is they are Monday-Friday. I'm just not ready for that just yet...

Oh I know SMS/ISBAO/EUETS etc is coming, I just think its a huge joke. We will buy whatever SMS etc we need to comply and throw it on the shelf. Its just another budget item.

As far as NBAAs role, just ask about the need for an SMS on their pathetic Airmail system and watch how many people respond with how important SMS is...in fact, they are mostly experts who will happily come in and "manage" and "consult" you on an SMS! - just send them an email!...ever ask what is required to be an ISBAO/SMS "certified" auditor? a 12hr class?

No thanks...we will continue to run a very safe and efficient operation by hiring good people. Imagine that.

I have witnessed big department SMS and all the laughable (painful?) time it consumes. It's also comical to hear the kool aid drinkers try and explain why its the future and we need to embrace it...Does some one (Chief Pilot/DO?) have to deal with what is required and check the boxes? sure...but lets not kid ourselves into thinking this is a huge Revelation.

Of course you do whatever your boss wants to check this box, but the question still remains.....WHY?

 

[PC12Cowboy]

SMS???? ok I give

 

[G4G5]

SMS is Safety Management System

Here's what the issue is:
"The International Civil Aviation Organization Standards found in Annex 6, Part 2 specify that a SMS requirement be incorporated into national safety regulations for operators of non-commercial aircraft over 12,500 pounds maximum takeoff weight or turbojet powered aircraft. The compliance date for these standards is November 2010. Annex 6 Part 1 of the ICAO Standards required compliance beginning on January 1, 2009 for commercial operators."

I went to the SMS class at TEB last month and here's what I got out of it.
The Europeans are all over the place. Easa is not going to take over until 2012, so until then each country's regulations apply. Effective 11/18/2010, the French could make it mandatory and do a ramp/SAFA check and hold you on the ground until you get one. The UK may not, it's up until the individual country until EASA takes over. Bottom line is it's coming so why wait to get one?

The US has said that it will wait until 2013 until we decide what to do, no surprise here. IMHO, we will wait until EASA has told us what to do. The FAA has no money and the Europeans are driving the bus and they are all about job creation whether it be ISBAO and SMS audits or EUETS fee's.

The Canadians came out last week and said that they won't require an SMS for foreign registered aircraft. The Bermudians already require it for aircraft registered in Bermuda so as of 11/2010, IMHO they will want one for foreign operators too.

We are in a gray area. If you never leave the USA then don't worry about until 2013. If you travel internationally then, it depends upon the country the you are visiting but as of November any ICAO registered country has the right to enforce an SMS.

If you try to do it on your own then who do you get to approve it?
Problem is that the FAA has NO real guidance on what to do (they don't care because they have told the world we will get to it in 2013). So your local FSDO can not approve it.

My suggestion is to purchase the ISBAO SMS manual and fill in the blanks. It's ICAO approved and should be accepted by all ICAO countries. Then either throw it up on the shelve or start playing the big flt dept game.

 

[PC12Cowboy]

thankssss G4G5

 

[gear_guy]

That's only half. The EU will soon track your carbon output and then promptly mail them a check for the damages. You will have to register with an EU country. Apparently you can now fix "climate change" with $$$$$.

I give!