Message From UAL MEC Chariman

[Yuppyguppy]

Yesterday the executive VP of flight ops told a group of returning CAL furloughee's that the "most vulnerable aircraft in the merged company were UAL 75's and 74's".......those are the aircraft being targeted for reductions should reductions be necessary......Those 74's aren't gonna be here in 24 months. CAL has NEVER been a 74 company. The CAL management team is running this show and they have no use for those frames. They don't think its a viable frame going forward.

The UAL MEC knows this, they must or they haven't been paying attention. This is a seniority grab pure and simple. If we have to go the way of USAir, so be it. We're not going to capitulate here, it's not going to happen.

The 744 frames have no use? Are you kidding? Totally not true. You don't realize the magnitude nor the payload those things carry. The triple can't do the job.

 

[rumrunner300]

Well, it is time we get all that back and more. Most UAL pilots think that to have the 747/777 pay banded - it would be a concession, period.

It would be shot down in an instant........

I would not be so sure. I know of plenty of brothers and sisters that are sick and tired of having their interests play second fiddle to the 400's. This would include me. The maximization of good for the GREATEST number of pilots at OUR company should be the goal.

Also, anyone who takes what has been presented by either MEC officer at face value as the whole truth is beyond naive, the truth usually lies perhaps not in the middle, but certainly contains shadings of both.

Nobody said this wouldn't sting a little, but we should not be distracted by a bee in the car to the point of driving full speed into a cement bridge support.

Cheers, and here's looking forward to the day when I will be able to waste my law degree on this nonsense again.

rr

 

[EWR_FO]

The 744 frames have no use? Are you kidding? Totally not true. You don't realize the magnitude nor the payload those things carry. The triple can't do the job.

Two less engines, much more fuel efficient, longer range, no center gear (space filled with containers), lighter gross weight (cheaper landing fees).

Show me what job the 777 can't do. When freight forwarding companies routinely buy blocks of coach seats, just so they go out vacant, in order to create more space for their freight- you don't get more efficient than that. A 744 simply could not do this on HKG-EWR.

 

[ChrisJT6]

The DOT of transportation cited Delta's bid to the coveted Haneda Airport using the 744 vice UAL / CAL bids w a 777 as the reason why they choose Delta to get 2 slots and CAL or UAL none. They wanted max compacity on the new routes and the 400 gives it to them. Apparently regulators disagree with you...so do the cargo haulers who have brought in a lot of rev in good and bad times.

 

[ChrisJT6]

Yesterday the executive VP of flight ops told a group of returning CAL furloughee's that the "most vulnerable aircraft in the merged company were UAL 75's and 74's".......those are the aircraft being targeted for reductions should reductions be necessary......Those 74's aren't gonna be here in 24 months. CAL has NEVER been a 74 company. The CAL management team is running this show and they have no use for those frames. They don't think its a viable frame going forward.

The UAL MEC knows this, they must or they haven't been paying attention. This is a seniority grab pure and simple. If we have to go the way of USAir, so be it. We're not going to capitulate here, it's not going to happen.

Once this CAL VP of flight OPS realizes the 744 is a big part of UAL hauling more USPS cargo across the Pacific than any pax carrier in the world and how much revenue is attached to that use...he will think twice about early 744 reductions.

 

[bizicmo]

Once this CAL VP of flight OPS realizes the 744 is a big part of UAL hauling more USPS cargo across the Pacific than any pax carrier in the world and how much revenue is attached to that use...he will think twice about early 744 reductions.

Wasn't it the CAL flight ops guy that said there was no money in cargo?

 

[Captain X]

Keep on beating your chest until you let the Transition Agreement die. We can compare what our seperate contracts will look like afterwards. It will be a disaster in the meantime - your

Should we compare before or after the 90% block hour ratio protection (brought up from 0%) that CAL pilots fought for UAL to have goes away? When the Transition Agreement "dies."

 

[Yuppyguppy]

Either this will end in a handshake and we will move on which I at this point assume will happen in the next few weeks or this will be the worst nightmare we will ever have in aviation minus 911. Worse than c11 because it will last much longer. STOP THE INFIGHTING.

 

[jonjuan]

Either this will end in a handshake and we will move on which I at this point assume will happen in the next few weeks or this will be the worst nightmare we will ever have in aviation minus 911. Worse than c11 because it will last much longer. STOP THE INFIGHTING.

but what about the teenagers???

 

[waveflyer]

Set a payrate- blend the rates- have one payscale- at least then this 744 debate won't be muddied by "benefits for a few" that recent UAL history is littered with

 

[aewanabe]

Two less engines, much more fuel efficient, longer range, no center gear (space filled with containers), lighter gross weight (cheaper landing fees).

Show me what job the 777 can't do. When freight forwarding companies routinely buy blocks of coach seats, just so they go out vacant, in order to create more space for their freight- you don't get more efficient than that. A 744 simply could not do this on HKG-EWR.

A buddy that has flown both at UA points out that on the 744, the freight forwarder would just buy the freight space and then let you fill the seats. This seriously should not be a johnson-measuring contest, but saying the 777>744 is flawed.

 

[flyguppy]

I also don't believe CAL is UAL's savior, but in a way, it is.

You guys keep that attitude and we'll just see how well this whole thing goes.

Not well, in my opinion.

 

[Yuppyguppy]

but what about the teenagers???

Like I said it will be a nightmare. It's like giving the keys of my 2008 audi to a 16 year old. They won't know how to "take care of it" and they will joyride the piss out of it.

 

[atpcliff]

DAL was not too keen, either on the 744 before the merger. Now they are trying to buy more and want to retrofit all their existing ones, as the 744s are doing great.

cliff
LGG

 

[UALRATT]

CAL guys...I'm with you on this. I don't understand why UAL MEC is protecting 24 747s from the banding. Frankly we have bigger fish to fry...SCOPE and SCOPE. Get the contract, THE SCOPE, workrules and pay (figure the stupid rates out just look what DAL did) and then get the SLI done. I'm sick and tired of the bantering. The sooner we get a contract the sooner we get the teens back in the turboprops.

Dude you must be 4 foot 0h. UAL is negotiating toward contract 2000 and beyond. CAL (at least the objectionist on here) are just simply happy to get their loan back as long as their 26 aging 767s stay banded. You're not the only one dying to get back on the property but by any means necessary? A solid contract (Section 1 thru Section 2X) that is separate and independent of SLI is what UALMEC is determine to achieve. Seem like they'll have to carry Jay along the way but in the end he won't regret it. Jayson Baron does want the 747 unbanded but in the followup contract to JCBA. What does that tell you?

Section III: Unband and significantly raise the rates for each aircraft in the inventory, PERIOD. That simple!!