Mesaba reaches TA - Details pending...

[PCL_128]

Lets see, Will Not Accept A TA Untill ALL Members of the Coalition Have TA's.

What happened to that?

The MSA MEC has not accepted a TA at this point. The TA has to be voted on by the MEC before it is "accepted" by ALPA. The NC doesn't decide whether a TA goes to the pilots for a vote. Only the MEC can make that decision. Hold off for some facts before condemning these guys.

As for the TA itself, why are so many of you attacking it and blaming ALPA already? You haven't even seen the TA!!! I know several members of the MSA MEC, and all are top-notch reps. They aren't there to "sell-out" anyone. They won't lead you astray. Read the TA, listen to what Captain Wychor and the rest of your reps have to say, and then make a decision. Don't jump to conclusions without having the facts.

 

[XJohXJ]

Lets see, Will Not Accept A TA Untill ALL Members of the Coalition Have TA's.

What happened to that?

No one has accepted anything.

Let me repeat: WE HAVE NOT ACCEPTED A TA YET.

Jeez, the "T" stands for "tentative".

 

[Detroitpilot22]

To all mesaba pilots:

This is easy for me to say since i am a pinnacle pilot and I am not in your shoes, but let me just say this - you now have the power to accept or deny whatever this ta is all about. If it is good, then good for you guys, if it is bad, then i pray you vote it down. It is pretty obvious you guys are getting CRJ 900's and maybe some of our planes either way, but now for the first time it is no ones decision but yours, not even alpa's. You guys are a good pilot group and I have had many friends who have lost jobs there as a result of this fiasco. I wish you luck, hopefully this TA is a good one for you, but if it is not, think about this: it has been 1 year since this all started and if your union hands you a piece of $hit TA to vote on, then they have wasted a year of your life. Lets all hope that they dont, and that they hand you a fair and resonable proposal.

 

[xjlifer]

Gotta love the the people who condemn with no knowledge. The XJ NC people will have to fly under this TA as well and have given up enormous amounts of personal time working on ALL XJ pilots behalf. To hurl insults and condemn without ANY knowledge of this TA is ridicules.

 

[IamGumbyDammit]

Gotta love the the people who condemn with no knowledge. The XJ NC people will have to fly under this TA as well and have given up enormous amounts of personal time working on ALL XJ pilots behalf. To hurl insults and condemn without ANY knowledge of this TA is ridicules.

It's also gutless too.

 

[SteelerMan]

Well, I don't work at XJ anymore, but I do know how dissappointed many of us were with how the NC/MEC handled the last contract. They flat ass lied to us all about "what the minimum" was to accept a TA, because we didn't get 80% of what they told us the "minimum acceptable" was in that contract. So when people bash this TA, its not just because of the current situation. It's from years of experience, mostly bad experience at XJ, and taking cuts from a contract that is lacking in so many areas anyway would be extremely difficult to do, I understand the frustration. So I wouldn't call it gutless or ridiculous, you know it's a pay cut and that in itself may be enough to be upset. You know how NWA works, this cycle will never stop. Good luck to you all.

 

[8HourPilot]

Great Name! Buck Boley.....that's funny.

Best of luck to you all, you certainly deserve it.

Good post avrorj-85. Let's check the runway first before we
take off.

 

[marycon]

Ok, why are there Mesaba pilots who are even thinking about voting yes on any TA? I don't care what may be in this TA, unless it's our current contract or better, I'm going to vote no. And this isn't an attack on our union because they have done an excellent job this past year and I understand that they are bound by the law to negotiate. But for our pilot group to actually consider voting yes is just troubling. Why should we vote in a subpar contract for growth we were probably going to get anyway. It's not our fault that NWA and Mesaba are a greedy bunch or so incompetent as to put our company in bankruptcy. They are trying to take money from us because of their greed and/or general ineptitude. I am not going to be responsible for lowering the standards of this industry. I have too much dignity to allow the promise of shiny new jets to make me say "oh yes please, pay me less to fly those". Mesaba is backed against the wall... otherwise why else would they be negotiating so furiously the past few days? Call their bluff and see what happens. That way, if we do liquidate and we have to find other jobs, at least we can tell other people that we worked for Mesaba and not have to mutter it under our breath in shame...

 

[redflyer65]

I have to say that Steelerman and Marycon are exactly correct.

The previous pre-TA crap was sickening. I was there personally for one of the Wychor/NC roadshows in DTW. There was a lot of chest thumping and "we won't accept less than....", and then the TA came out and it was not anything special. As a matter of fact, a cut and paste of Pinnacle's RJ rates. I wanted to throw up then. So if history repeats itself, this will be just as bad (but of course worse because of the bankruptcy).

Marycon, The company never need concessions in the first place, so why would anyone vote on them. I agree with you 100%. You still don't need concessions in this fraud started by the SLT. You should make more money than the current contract, not less. Anyone who thinks otherwise is clueless.

 

[IamGumbyDammit]

Well, I don't work at XJ anymore, but I do know how dissappointed many of us were with how the NC/MEC handled the last contract. They flat ass lied to us all about "what the minimum" was to accept a TA, because we didn't get 80% of what they told us the "minimum acceptable" was in that contract. So when people bash this TA, its not just because of the current situation. It's from years of experience, mostly bad experience at XJ, and taking cuts from a contract that is lacking in so many areas anyway would be extremely difficult to do, I understand the frustration. So I wouldn't call it gutless or ridiculous, you know it's a pay cut and that in itself may be enough to be upset. You know how NWA works, this cycle will never stop. Good luck to you all.

They didn't flat out lie to anyone. I believe at the time, the NC/MEC said this is what we're are gonna try for, and what they got was what they thought was the best they could get, i.e. the company said on 5 different proposals " this is our final offer ". Would they have gone 6 times? Who knows? All I know is these guys work 24/7 and give their family life to work on this and some Cliff Claven know-it-all talks behind their backs and bashes them "WAH, I DIDN'T GET WHAT I WANT!" I hear the flight attendants bashing and backstabbing in the crewroom all the time. This is a MAN FORUM. If you want to be catty, tuck in your genitalia and post in the flight attendant forum.

 

[XJohXJ]

Please remember that the MEC and the NC bust their backs to come up with the best agreement they possibly can. They are working against a group of managers who are totally greedy, selfish, power hungry, and have 99% of the deck entirely and solidly rigged in favor of unethical corporate greed. Our team does the absolute best they can, and then it is the pilots who ultimately accept or reject. Please also remember that there are currently over 200 pilots on furlough, who do not get to vote at all.

Of course, no one cares about these points, 'cause we're on flightinfo.com, after all.

 

[Mysteryofflight]

I said it before and I'll say it again.. NOT ONE CENT!

 

[Simon Says]

Lets see, Will Not Accept A TA Untill ALL Members of the Coalition Have TA's.

What happened to that?

You are absolutely correct. We all come up with a TA together.

Plus everyone is correct. It is not a TA yet.....it is only a negotiated agreement that needs to be voted on the MEC to bring it to the pilot group to be voted on. That is when it becomes an actual TA...or tentative agreement.

 

[SteelerMan]

I don't know Gumby, I sat there and listened to them tell me what the open items were, what the "group" had decided the minimum was via wilson polling, etc., and then I saw the TA which was far less than what we were supposed to be willing to strike for. They didn't say this is what we might strike for, they said this is what we will strike for. That's not my opinion, that's a fact. It's not that I didn't get what I wanted, the pilot group didn't get what we were supposed to be willing to strike for as per the MEC. Maybe they didn't lie, they just changed their minds, either way it didn't play out as advertised, that is for sure. It's not meant to be a personal attack on anyone, it's not whining, it's just the way it is. I'm not sure what is Cliff Claven about that. I'm not going to argue with you about it, it's in the past. I didn't like it so I left. But I feel very badly for the pilots there and I thoroughly understand their frustrations, and I would think every pilot at XJ would understand that. Good luck to you all.

 

[YourPilotFriend]

I don't think if the pilots at Mesaba vote in this contract they are in anyway worse than mesa, Gojet, or skywest; This goes the same for NWA pilots who supposedly caved. The latter carriers voted in those substandard contracts in a time their companies were profitable and/or startup. The pilots at Mesaba have had their rights as works stripped of them and they are without options. They can vote no on this TA, and no matter what, they will be working under it. This is the exact same thing we were faced with at NWA mainline, although the Mesaba pilots have taken it longer because the company decided to explore its options. Pilots that have decide they do not want to be a part of the concessions have walked off the job from both Mesaba and NWA. How many pilots quit at Skywest when they said they were going to operate 90 seat at 50 seat pay?