Mesa pilots in PHX with plywood boards?

[urflyingme?!]

Profession? Union? You've got to be kidding me. Mesa, SCABS of the Industry. How many of you either flew for or jumpseated on Mesa in the past or present? And you wonder why these airline manager's treat you as they do?
"Well, I needed to build time to get out of there" or "I was desperate, I needed a way to work or home." Thanks for your support!

Labor Union.....ALPA? Grow some hair on your nuts and put a stop to the downward spiral of this once called "profession." Oh yea, I forgot, you don't really belong to an AFL-CIO Labor Organization........it's a Professional Airline Association.......White Collar Professionals.

I wonder what David Behncke or former real EAL Pilots would say to ALPA leadership or to those of you that "support" airlines like Mesa today?

Pathetic....

ALPA is AFL CIO. As for scabs, go f yourself pal.

As for this issue as a whole, i think that bringing plywood is a great way to spread the message.

 

[urflyingme?!]

How would calling in fatiqued work? If you're ON the trip, you've already ACCEPTED the trip... so I guess by this rationale, you could never accept the trip in the first place. Which only thousands of your peers already have without formal complaint.

Unless you know of any formal complaints, which I don't.

You can't call in fatigued until you're actually fatigued.
EX: I'd like to call in fatigued for my 345pm dep on sunday, thank you.

 

[Frozen Ronin]

Man, the wood jokes are still cracking me up! That's so BAD!

At least in Alaska we're paid well for being bent over!

 

[Lear70]

As for this issue as a whole, i think that bringing plywood is a great way to spread the message.

Actually, it's not bad.

If every single one of the crews brought them with you, it would send an amusing signal to management.

Just imagine a couple dozen pilots walking around with plywood boards in their hands, take a picture of a bunch of them walking around in the terminal plus a picture of the crew later asleep in the aircraft, put the schedule with them and send them to every major network talk show, news network, etc.

I betcha Conan O'Brian would probably feature it as a WTF piece.

Heck, it would also be fun to carry them with you when you picket during your next negotiations.

p.s. I can't believe someone hasn't mentioned anything about laying wood to the flight attendant on the aircraft between flights...

 

[pgcfii2002]

The pilots with plywood boards woke up at their layover with morning wood.

 

[ERJFO]

X9746 ONLY ON THU BSE REPT: 1718L OPERATES- OCT. 05 ONLY Mo Tu We Th Fr Sa Su
Base/Equipment: PHX/CR9 CA01FO01 -

TH 2815 PHX-OKC 1803 2208 205 206 3CR9
TH 2799 OKC-LAS 2238 2324 246 242 CR9 451 0 448 0 621 LA2234 -
7462 D-END: 2339L (NR 900) REPT: 2213L ST. TROPEZ (702) 369-5400 000 -- -- -- -- -- --
FR 2886 LASIAH 22580406 308 253 1154
SA 2783 IAH-PHX 0600 0640 240 256 55 CR9
SA 2819 PHX-TUS 0735 0825 50 46 45 CR9
SA 2972 TUS-LAS 0910 1028 118 116 CR9 756 0 751 0 1230 LAS 1228
7463 D-END: 1043L (NR 900) REPT: 2311L ST. TROPEZ (702) 369-5400 000
SA 2835 LAS-TUS 2356 0116 120 116 CR9 120 0 116 0 220 TUS 1219
7464 D-END: 0131L (NR 900) REPT: 1350L LaQuinta Inn (520) 573-3333 SHUTTLE 000
SU 2944 TUS-PHX 1435 1524 49 49 104 CR9
SU 2910 PHX-DEN 1628 1916 148 147 37 CR9
SU 2911 DEN-PHX 1953 2046 153 152 CR9 430 0 428 1 711
D-END: 2101L --------------------------------------
TOTALS BLOCK 1837 DHD 0 CREDIT 1823 18.38 T.A.F.B. 7543
---------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------------
Hear is an example of a Mesa camping trip. Sorry that is didn't transfer well. If you notice, the crew gets into IAH at 4:06 and leaves at 6 am. Let me ask this question. Does your contract prevent your company from building a trip like this? Woud you get a hotel for the 1:54 minute turn? -Bean

To answer your question, the contract I work for prevents the company from building a trip like this:

"duty periods that begin between 2101 LT and 0429 LT will not be scheduled to exceed 11 hours."

From the same section:​

"A trip that operates between 0100 LT and 0400 LT will be constructed with no more than 2 segments."​

 

[ERJFO]

I admit, I got a full-ride scholarship for hispanic flight students, and a B737 type from a government grant for minorities, to help get me land my Boeing job. I love this country. I am thinking of helping out some RJ FOs by paying them to do some landscaping work at my new house in Miami, if anybody is interested send me a PM. It will pay more than your flying job.

Classy

 

[dingo222]

A must have for every mesa pilot this holiday season:

http://www.rvstuffusa.com/nachotablebytravelchair.html

You can pack it in your flightbag, slide it between the seats and presto!
sleep like a baby! It also doubles as a drink holder, or a table outside of baggage claim for some 3 card monty

 

[n32jk]

How many hours between flights is YOUR airline required, by contract, to provide a hotel to you?

Mesa
Comair
Eagle
ExpressJet
Mesaba
Chautauqua
SkyWest
ASA
Pinacle
TSA
Air Wisconsin
Colgan
Piedmont

Just curious...

At Pinnacle you are granted a hotel room if a scheduled break is more than 5 hours on a full day. ANY CDO is gets a hotel room. We have restrictions about what can be done if the CDO is short. limited to 4 CDO's.

We have way too many 4 hour and 59 minute "productivity breaks" during the day on trips. I have considered taking a sleeping bag into the main hall in a terminal like PHL or someplace equally busy, along with a sign saying hotel expenses diverted to management bonuses. Probably a career ender, but it would get media.

IS IT REALLY TRUE THAT MESA PILOTS SLEEP ON THE PLANE ON CDO'S ?????

Maybe this could be spun into a security issue?? Does the airport know they are there free to roam around other areas while there is no security?? There has to be a way to really embarrass Mesa management. Really stiff security fines might get their attention.

 

[Soverytired]

IS IT REALLY TRUE THAT MESA PILOTS SLEEP ON THE PLANE ON CDO'S ?????

.

YES.

For any CDO less than 4 hours, the crew is allotted ONE hotel room for all 4 crew members to share. This is actually a recent "improvement" . . . prior to about 3 months ago, there was NO HOTEL PROVIDED.

Since it's just too wierd to check into a hotel room with 1 bed for 2.5 hours with 3 other (mixed-gender) crewmembers, the VAST majority of most crews just bring sleeping bags, cots, pillows, earplugs, jammies, and sleep masks and just sack out in the plane.

Most CDO's on the west coast have 4 legs, starting at 1900, flying until 0900 (14 hrs). By day 3, you're a zombie, and by day 4, you're toast. So you either sleep on the plane, or you call fatigue and take your chances.

I've done both.
--------------------------------------------------------

Only contract protection is CDO's can't be scheduled >14 hrs. So the company came up with 13:56 hr schedules. Clever, eh?

A sample: (Out, off, block time, turn around time)

BSE REPT: 1925L

2752 PHX-SBP 2010-2049 139 25
2794 SBP-LAS 2114-2224 115 127
2866 LAS-MFR 2351-0157 206 353 (3:53 turn, so lights out and 3 hrs of sleep'n on a jet plane)
2704 MFR-PHX 0550-0906 214

D-END: 0921L

Total duty: 13:56




Figure 90 min to get home, 90 min to get back, 90 min to sleep/eat/exercise/clean up/kiss wife/pay bills, and you have at BEST 5.5 hrs of sleep during the middle of the day. By day 4, you will be WIPED OUT. (I'm dead by day 3)

-------------------------------------------------------

Company response: These are legal, they are allowed per the contract, and somebody must have bid the line. All true.

My response: Avoid these lines at all costs. I know my limits . . . because I've flown past them on these shifts and scared the bee-jezus out of myself, and seen some unbelieveable stuff from the guy on the other side of the box as well.

Fatigue is a funny thing, and will creep up on you when you least expect it. I can say with certainity that I've ALWAYS taken off feeling fine, then been drop dead tired 20 minutes into the flight. Kinda late to deal with at that point.

 

[ballsdeep123]

YES.

For any CDO less than 4 hours, the crew is allotted ONE hotel room for all 4 crew members to share. This is actually a recent "improvement" . . . prior to about 3 months ago, there was NO HOTEL PROVIDED.

Since it's just too wierd to check into a hotel room with 1 bed for 2.5 hours with 3 other (mixed-gender) crewmembers, the VAST majority of most crews just bring sleeping bags, cots, pillows, earplugs, jammies, and sleep masks and just sack out in the plane.

Most CDO's on the west coast have 4 legs, starting at 1900, flying until 0900 (14 hrs). By day 3, you're a zombie, and by day 4, you're toast. So you either sleep on the plane, or you call fatigue and take your chances.

I've done both.
--------------------------------------------------------

Only contract protection is CDO's can't be scheduled >14 hrs. So the company came up with 13:56 hr schedules. Clever, eh?

A sample: (Out, off, block time, turn around time)

BSE REPT: 1925L

2752 PHX-SBP 2010-2049 139 25
2794 SBP-LAS 2114-2224 115 127
2866 LAS-MFR 2351-0157 206 353 (3:53 turn, so lights out and 3 hrs of sleep'n on a jet plane)
2704 MFR-PHX 0550-0906 214

D-END: 0921L

Total duty: 13:56


Figure 90 min to get home, 90 min to get back, 90 min to sleep/eat/exercise/clean up/kiss wife/pay bills, and you have at BEST 5.5 hrs of sleep during the middle of the day. By day 4, you will be WIPED OUT. (I'm dead by day 3)

Company response: These are legal, they are allowed per the contract, and somebody must have bid the line. All true.

My response: Avoid these lines at all costs. I know my limits . . . because I've flown past them on these shifts and scared the bee-jezus out of myself, and seen some unbelieveable stuff from the guy on the other side of the box as well.

Fatigue is a funny thing, and will creep up on you when you least expect it. I can say with certainity that I've taken off feeling fine, then been drop dead tired 20 minutes into the flight. Kinda late to deal with at that point.

Why do you people work there?? I would rather work at McDonald's than deal with that kind of treatment. At least you get to fly a big shinny jet for less than you could make at McDonald's. But hey, at least you upgrade in two years or not really. It seems Mesa has seen it's best days. Now that airlines are making more money they might not go with the cheapest any more realizing that Mesa's product is about as bad as it gets. I guess you really do get what you pay for.

This is by no means a jab towards you Soverytired. Thanks for showing people what it's like there.

 

[ttuite]

Why do you people work there?? I would rather work at McDonald's than deal with that kind of treatment. At least you get to fly a big shinny jet for less than you could make at McDonald's. But hey, at least you upgrade in two years or not really. It seems Mesa has seen it's best days. Now that airlines are making more money they might not go with the cheapest any more realizing that Mesa's product is about as bad as it gets. I guess you really do get what you pay for.

This is by no means a jab towards you Soverytired. Thanks for showing people what it's like there.

Let me preface these remarks by saying that they are intended for only folks who think like this guy. I am always amazed when I read someone who writes the above. You just don't have a clue. Do you honestly believe that people have choices of all of the airlines and then sign up at Mesa? Could it be that Mesa is the airline who gave them a job? Maybe you would rather work at Macs but I sure wouldn't. I worked ther once and they treated me even worse than Mesa and certainly did not pay as well. As far as you and others comments to quit, well if you give me a job as an FO at another airline and pay me in excess of 80K to start then I would consider starting over. In the 6 1/2 years I have worked at Mesa I have NEVER flown with an FO or Captain that I didn't like. Can you say that about your airline? Let me paint a picture for you: the quality of life and treatment by management sucks, yet the people are great. I wouldn't trade ONE Mesa pilot for 10 whining United, Delta, ASA, Comair, or any other Major or regional. There are good people in all of those groups but the majority of them are big whining babies who have never had a real job in their life. As far as the future for Mesa is concerned, if management doesn't clean up its act they will be out of business in 10 years. I don't believe that there are very many Mesa people who care that much. The Majors will all be hiring, and all of the Mesa pilots will be moving on because guess what, while putting up with all of the bull crap at Mesa they picked up thousands of hours of PIC Turbine, and that folks is what makes you marketable. As far as the race to the bottom, any sympathy I might have had for you or others disappeared when the Mesa bashing started. I and other will be flying "real airliners, for real pay and working conditions" while you and others will be flying your little "puddle jumper" for your "airline" that you are not sure will even be in business in 5 years. the bottom line is that we are all management whores, You are just a higher class whore.

 

[siucavflight]

how does this equate to 80K a year?
http://airlinepilotcentral.com/airlines/major-national-lcc/mesa.html
Seven year CA pay on the CRJ is 66 an hour.
You get 75 hours a month.
That equals 4950 a month which equals 59400 a year before taxes. How are you making over 80K a year?

 

[pdub20s]

aaaahhh, good ol' flight info!! the only aviation forum bored that allows you to throw racial slurs and offensive comments and everyone sits around and laughs at it.

 

[ttuite]

how does this equate to 80K a year?
http://airlinepilotcentral.com/airlines/major-national-lcc/mesa.html
Seven year CA pay on the CRJ is 66 an hour.
You get 75 hours a month.
That equals 4950 a month which equals 59400 a year before taxes. How are you making over 80K a year?

First of all what you are reading is the base pay. There is not a line holder at Mesa who is only working base except the CDO's. (god bless anyone who has to work those) As for the rest, it's called JA. JA and open time is paid at double time at Mesa. Also, don't forget per diem. Per diem is great when you are TDY. It is then 24/7. This is due to our short staffing. My last pay stub had me at 76K for the year. I will now make 80K by the end of the year. For 7-8 year Captains that I know who hustle, 90K+ is not that unusual. I know an 9 year Captain who will make 100K this year but he has been rode hard and put away wet this year. Most of our 20+ year Captains will make over 100K just due to the $109.00/hr rate on the 900. When I talk with pilots from other carriers I find that the W2s aren't all that different. It is the QOL issues that are very different. If I was at Skywest I could make the same money and probably have 3 to 4 days off a month or more, work far less than 14-16 hours a day, and get paid for things that I don't do. At a union carrier like Comair, ASA, or AWAC, I would even do better. I average 10 days off a bid period, don't get paid for cancellations, and constantly have the interpertation of my contract changed. Things are not rosy at Mesa by any strech of the imagination, but there is money to be made. I didn't sign on with a commuter in 2000 for the quality of life. I signed on to get the experience to go to a major. I, like many others just got stuck after 9/11. Every day I am thankful that I got stuck at Mesa. I have been a Captain for all but 6 months of my career, work has been steady, and as I stated earlier I work with some of the best "whores" in the industry. I guess my biggest problem must be that that I have low expectations. But, I am very happy. Good news is that the looming pilot shortage is here and this broken down, bottom feeding, scumbag Mesa whore will more than likely be moving on within the next year or so. Life is all about what you make it. Believe it or not people in Somalia smile too.