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MEI Questions
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Amish RakeFight
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It's called the PTS, if you haven't forgotten.
Bascially, it's a MEL ride with a drag demo. Load up the plane with drag (gear flaps, etc.) and demonstrate the effects.
brokeflyer
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brokeflyer
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It's in the instrument PTS.....unless you don't instrument privledges with your multi.
section IV. subpart B.
1.) Don't sit on Bob's golf cart unless he gives you permission.
2.) Drink lots of coffee so you can stay awake flying with Glenn.
3.) If you get The Hammer as your DE fly a perfect pattern and remember the paint on the center line is for the nosewheel only. Also he is a Harley freak any discussion of Harley's at anytime vastly improves everything.
Short of uncontrolled flight into terrain you should pass. They have a decent program down there in my opinion.
Why worry about it if it's such as "easy ride?"
If you're going somewhere else...well...you'd do well not to approach any of your flight training as though it's an "easy ride." Take it seriously. Study.
This from an individual who doesn't have a multi engine instructor rating, and who isn't a flight instructor? Really? Just "trim it out" when training a student to fly a multi engine airplane? That's your advice and counsel for giving multi-engine flight instruction?? This, after you just said...
Upgrading to a commercial from a private pilot certificate with instrument privileges, and you wonder why you might have to demonstrate instrument proficiency at the commercial level, genius? And you're in the process of obtaining your CFII, are you? What a prize a potential student has in you.
It's okay...just make it wasy on yourself, trim it out, right?
What would you say if you actually had multi engine instructor privileges? Or any instructor privileges for that matter?
As for the original question, remember that you're undertaking a rating which permits you to pass on some critical skills, like any instructor rating. Bear in mind that you have a short time with any student to pass along information that must enable him or her to operate safely in your absence.
One of the key issues in teaching multi engine operation in a light twin is convincingly demonstrating control, to include an intuitive response to a low speed loss of control situation. As an instructor in a single engine airplane, you've taught use of the aerodynamic controls to rectify a control issue. The student is taught to save the airplane with rudder and elevator and ailerons.
In a multi engine airplane, the full aerodynamic limits are reached, and the aircraft still may depart controlled flight because of assymetrical thrust. Convincing the student to retard the power on the good engine at the appropriate time is a response that may save the student's life. Doing so in a way that preserves your own while teaching these principles is the key to providing proper multi engine instruction.
Blocking the rudder to prevent the student being able to use full rudder during Vmc demostrations is a wise technique that enables you to have some rudder reserve as a safety device; the student gets some rudder, but you get the rest, by preventing the student from using full rudder; the airplane begins to depart at a higher speed, which means you have aerodynamic control in reserve for the ham-fisted or slower student. Safety in your pocket.
Too often multi engine instruction is approaches as though assymetrical control is the only part of the process, and it's not. Often the airplane in use will be the heaviest and most complex that the student has yet seen. This is the time to remember primacy of learning, and that the lessons you teach here will be long remembered. Teaching systems knowledge is very important at this point, and often neglected. Teaching the student to use the increased performance under power, and to understand the reduced performance without power, is also very important.
Teaching the student to maintain centerline, for example, is important...it was important as a single engine instructor, but now with propellers closer to taxiway lights and a wider wingspan, it's more important. Before you were able to teach a power off glide, but now the glide ratio is drastically reduced, and thus energy management is more imporant than ever. Advance planning on climbs and descents is important to teach.
Too often multi engine training is restricted to control with one engine inoperative...which leads people to think it should be an "easy ride." It shouldn't be an easy ride. It should be thorough.
Fuel mismanagement continues to be problematic, and fuel management in many light twins only complicates matters. Multiple tanks, crossfeeding, crossflowing, etc, can't just be brushed over; these must be convincingly taught so that the student understands it isn't an "easy ride." Teach the student to take it seriously.
Don't approach your training, your rating, or the duties that come with it as an easy ride. It shouldn't be.
Amish RakeFight
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When I did the multi work, rudder trim was NOT allowed. Yeah it hurts, but you've got to practice worst case in a sense. Both my MEI and examiner wouldn't permit the use of trim. It's tough, but you need to be able to accomplish SE flight and approach without using trim. If you can't endure holding the rudder, then you shouldn't be qualified to get the rating. Not all planes will have rudder trim or rudder trim which works. When you actually do have an engine failure, your comfort, force/pressure-familiarity and ability to hold rudder forces as long as necessary become imperative. Learn and practice without the use of trim. Recall that as you reduce power on the operating engine, the required rudder forces are much less and trim is not as necessary.
Years ago, one reason the airlines were hesitant to hire female pilots had to do with concerns as to whether they could handle the strong leg forces required during asymetrical flight.
Years ago, one reason the airlines were hesitant to hire female pilots had to do with concerns as to whether they could handle the strong leg forces required during asymetrical flight.
ALIMBO
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Buddy I was upgrading from a Comm ASEL with the multi add on. Look in the PTS. Nobody said it was to hard to fly the plane with no trim. If it's there and you realize how to fly the plane w/o it and with. Then go ahead and use the trim unless the examiner or mei doesn't want you to. In that case it's not the end of the world. It seems to me avbug your assuming things again you need to stop that.
Alimbo, this is a thread about learning to TEACH in a multi engine airplane...something you don't understand. Considering some of your earlier training failures, this isn't surprising.
No...you look in the practical test standards. You are, after all, attempting to become a flight instructor (God help the student who draws the short straw and gets you).
You can't obtain your flight instructor certificate without a commercial pilot certificate, and an instrument rating. You've recently become a commercially certificated pilot. Upgrading your privileges to commercial requires that you demonstrate them to the commercial level. If you want to upgrade a private certificate with airplane, single engine privileges and an instrument rating, you need to be able to demonstrate basic instrument skills in the multi engine airplane. Further, if you're only trying to upgrade to the commercial and are doing it in a single engine airplane, you should expect to be asked to be able to demonstrate recoveries from unusual attitudes in the single engine airplane, too. You hold, after all, an instrument rating, do you not?
Think about it, brightspark. You're holding yourself out as a potential flight instructor now. Try to act like it, stop thinking as though you're a poor excuse for a private pilot, and do attempt to grow something in that space between your ears. At some point you're going to have to stop being 14 years old...and you're going to have to act like it, too.
No...you look in the practical test standards. You are, after all, attempting to become a flight instructor (God help the student who draws the short straw and gets you).
You can't obtain your flight instructor certificate without a commercial pilot certificate, and an instrument rating. You've recently become a commercially certificated pilot. Upgrading your privileges to commercial requires that you demonstrate them to the commercial level. If you want to upgrade a private certificate with airplane, single engine privileges and an instrument rating, you need to be able to demonstrate basic instrument skills in the multi engine airplane. Further, if you're only trying to upgrade to the commercial and are doing it in a single engine airplane, you should expect to be asked to be able to demonstrate recoveries from unusual attitudes in the single engine airplane, too. You hold, after all, an instrument rating, do you not?
Think about it, brightspark. You're holding yourself out as a potential flight instructor now. Try to act like it, stop thinking as though you're a poor excuse for a private pilot, and do attempt to grow something in that space between your ears. At some point you're going to have to stop being 14 years old...and you're going to have to act like it, too.
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ALIMBO
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Avbug I don't know what 1940's PTS version your using, but if you look in the Commercial PTS and you are a Commercial Pilot holding an Instrument Rating and go to add on a Commercial Multi you do not I repeat do not need to demonstrate Unusual Attitudes if you get asked to do it by the DE then do it. But, it is not in the PTS. Avbug before trying to use your years of flying to try and spread your knowledge pick up a book an look at the regs. Furthermore you do not even have to demonstrate them for even a commercial asel rating.
ALIMBO
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Nobody said anything about what you may be asked to do. Hell you maybe asked to do the approach single engine and go and do the hold under a simulated failed engine too. Does it happen maybe all the time of course not. Avbug you know I don't know what your deal is but something is not right about you. I've recieved a few messages about you from people that apparantly know you well. You don't even want to know what they say. Maybe you should realize your place on this website as just another person that posts on here thats it. You hold no status your no mod your nothing. Don't try an act like your king sh!t around here. Especially when you just got proved wrong by "14 yr old with nothing between his ears."
ALIMBO
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To the OP this guy is a tool and thinks he knows everything but he doesn't. The Comm Multi add on is in fact easy that is if your not a complete retard. I mean come on if Avbug can do it you can. Just study up and you will be fine. I apologize if this is a sh!t fest because of him and me. See he assumed I was upgrading from private to comm multi. Which wasn't true but he assumes. If I had my MEI and was training a Multi student I would teach them how to fly it without trim and then go ahead and just teach them with the rudder trim. There is enough going on in the plane so make it easy for yourself use the trim. But realize you may not always have rudder trim.
Amish RakeFight
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Just the fact that the OP is trying to get his MEI not a Multi Commercial Add On along with several other things.
Where to begin?
1. You want to write lesson plans but demonstrate little grasp of English or grammar.
2. You toss the PTS into a discussion with out reference. I wonder if you have really ever read just one complete PTS.
3. You have just begun Instructor training yet discount people who have taught for decades.
4. You state that because you never heard of a specific certification requirement, that it must not be important. As an Instructor, all requirements are important.
Aviation will kill you if you do not take it serious. If you want to just play around, take up dodge ball.
Folks, Alimbo is just playing around at your expense and is enjoying yanking your chain. He may learn enough to become an Instructor, but IMHO not anytime soon. It is your time to use, but I think you could spend it better elsewhere.
Never argue with a fool - people might not know the difference.
- anonymous
If you go back over this site you may see that every 6 months or so a new group of pilots begins a new rating and asks the same questions. The fact that they ask questions is IMHO a good sign. If a student is defined as someone who seeks knowledge, then they are students. I keep getting the feeling that many are just looking for the easy way out. I had a student who asked me "what is the least amount of work I need to do to pass?" I told him I was impressed that he had a goal but wondered if to just pass in a subject that lack of knowledge or skill could kill you was a good idea. He thought about it for a second and sad "no I just wanna pass". I told him I would warn my friends to not go flying with him.
The short answer is that every exam should be easy if you are prepared for it. If you know the material and practiced the maneuvers the exam should be quick and a demonstration that you should hold the rating.
Sa-weeet! I leave for a day to fly to families for Christmas and bashing starts in the forums. C'mon people we are all at different levels, and all learning, and no one will ever "arrive."
Thank you to everyone's responses, keep them coming.
As stated in my first post, Im just looking for advice from other pilots from all backgrounds and experience levels. I do and will continue to study, Im not looking for a rote memorization gouge to BS a DE w/canned answers.
We all joined this site for what...... to communicate and learn from/with other people in the same profession, so stop bashing each other and just respond with something constructive that others can learn from.
So, how else has some MEI info to share, lets hear it....
Thank you to everyone's responses, keep them coming.
As stated in my first post, Im just looking for advice from other pilots from all backgrounds and experience levels. I do and will continue to study, Im not looking for a rote memorization gouge to BS a DE w/canned answers.
We all joined this site for what...... to communicate and learn from/with other people in the same profession, so stop bashing each other and just respond with something constructive that others can learn from.
So, how else has some MEI info to share, lets hear it....
i think the signatures are funny between alimbo and avbug. i doubt this would happen in face to face communications.
the mei is a serious rating. not to be taken lightly, especially if you havent a lot of multi hours to begin with.
for those pursing it, make sure you know me procedures and aerodynmics, inside and out. like the old saying goes... "the turning engine will take you to the accident quicker. " students can do some very unpredictable things. even the good ones. never left your guard down. know the proceedureas cold. ive heard some scary stories here and there.
alimbo seems to be a very angry guy who wants to prove how great a pilot he is. alimbo, this will come in time. you should be a more humble pilot and student until you can be confident with what you state. it seems you have a strong desire to fly professionally, which is good. this will get you far. but you need to be a good solid instructor for now, until the outfits start hiring again. i think by late next yr, we'll see things pick up, but mostly for guys with more time.
the mei is a serious rating. not to be taken lightly, especially if you havent a lot of multi hours to begin with.
for those pursing it, make sure you know me procedures and aerodynmics, inside and out. like the old saying goes... "the turning engine will take you to the accident quicker. " students can do some very unpredictable things. even the good ones. never left your guard down. know the proceedureas cold. ive heard some scary stories here and there.
alimbo seems to be a very angry guy who wants to prove how great a pilot he is. alimbo, this will come in time. you should be a more humble pilot and student until you can be confident with what you state. it seems you have a strong desire to fly professionally, which is good. this will get you far. but you need to be a good solid instructor for now, until the outfits start hiring again. i think by late next yr, we'll see things pick up, but mostly for guys with more time.
brokeflyer
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I had to do unusual attitudes in the sim for a plane im already typed in......
The commercial PTS is used and so is the Instrument PTS. The multi is "rating" that is added on to your cert (commercial). No different if you we're just getting a type "rating" for a plane. If you want to fly as a commercial pilot, with instrument privledges in a multi-engine airplane you need to demonstrate the PTS for commercial multi AND instrument. That is why you need to do 2 ils approaches and 2 non-precsion approaches and a hold.
I already provided the reference in the PTS for this.
It's was in my DE handbook as well, and I used to have them do it. It aint that hard to do.
Good luck with your ride, if you practice and just think things through instead of freaking out (a lotta people do) you'll do fine.
It's a tough ride but you'll feel real good about yourself, just don't go out and be stupid and have accident.
The commercial PTS is used and so is the Instrument PTS. The multi is "rating" that is added on to your cert (commercial). No different if you we're just getting a type "rating" for a plane. If you want to fly as a commercial pilot, with instrument privledges in a multi-engine airplane you need to demonstrate the PTS for commercial multi AND instrument. That is why you need to do 2 ils approaches and 2 non-precsion approaches and a hold.
I already provided the reference in the PTS for this.
It's was in my DE handbook as well, and I used to have them do it. It aint that hard to do.
Good luck with your ride, if you practice and just think things through instead of freaking out (a lotta people do) you'll do fine.
It's a tough ride but you'll feel real good about yourself, just don't go out and be stupid and have accident.
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brokeflyer
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1. not really
2. know what EVERYTHING is on the plane....like all the little drain masts, radio antenna, etc.
3. Regualtions about instruction, SE stuff, airplane systems
4. No curve balls, but then I've flown with and sent this examiner many students so we had a good relationship.
ALIMBO
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I dont care wat I type on a forum this is not my lesson plan.
I tried to reference the PTS but could not copy it. Look under ratings held and what you need to do you will find your answer.
Im discounting avbug who is a huge tool. Never will I listen to him ther is plenty of other ppl to reference than him.
I've never heard of it and if its important I will be taught it. If not then I guess afer 6 or so instructors its not important. Those instructors ages vary from 21-65+ So hey I dont think its to important.
Yes I am yanking ppl's chain at times but not right now.
ALIMBO
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Im not angry at all Im a pretty happy guy, and I would say im very humble at least thats wat most of my instructors tell me. I do have a strong desire to fly. I wil try my best to be a solid instructor hence why I asked questions on here to be a humble student. As for your MEI seeing your tt time op I think you will be just fine.
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