Man Laws...Pilot Laws

[CX880]

You're probly that dooshbag who thinks 200KIAS, clean, is dangerous!

Yep, then on the other hand you get the guys that like to go clean all the way to the FAF.

 

[Axel]

What the FO considers to be dictatorial and stupid may just be the CA's greater experience which the FO does not have the experience to recognize.

Or it may actually be dictatorial and stupid. He's the captain; suck it up, junior.

 

[Club ORD FO]

If I am starting to get uncomfortable about an FO's flap schedule, I will place my hand on the flap lever as a hint. If they still don't get the message I will say 'How about flaps --'. Don't take it the wrong way. It is just a nonverbal way of saying 'I think you need some flaps'. If you have a problem with that then you can handle it how you want when you are the captain.

Why does the FO "need" flaps? Are you about to stall? If I am 1 knot fast to you put your hand on the thrust levers as a non-verbal cue? Put your hand on the flaps all you want, I'll just stare out the window and pretend not to notice. If you say "how about some flaps" I'll just say "no thanks."

 

[Goose Egg]

Seriously, out of everything in the whole world that could potentially bother someone, you guys pick the hand on the flap handle thing and calling the CRJ9, "the 9?"

If I am PNF, I'll sometimes put my hand on the flap handle if I know that the PF will be calling for it soon, and that's especially if we're trying to slow down quick. It's not an affront to the PF, it's just trying to help out. Some of you people out there have awfully thin skin.

Pick your battles.

-Goose

 

[Club ORD FO]

well there's a difference between two pilots being in sync and knowing when the other guy is about to call for something, and captains who are back seat drivers

 

[UnstableAviator]

I'd put my hand on the flap handle too if the FO didn't realize he had a tailwind, is fast & high, has his TCAS looking up on the 40 mile ring, and has no clue he's running over the MD-80 in front of him that's gonna roll out long.

Of course, that's never actually happened before....

 

[WMUSIGPI]

You're probly that dooshbag who thinks 200KIAS, clean, is dangerous!

Just like when I call for flaps 1, 3 times before getting the fo to realize that actually is a flaps setting.... yes, flaps one at +180 to 210 kts is an appropriate setting in most situations.

 

[embpic1]

You're probly that dooshbag who thinks 200KIAS, clean, is dangerous!

Ummm... Well lets see.

In the EMB120, nope 200KIAS is fine.

In the 747 at typical landing weights, yup that's a problem.

 

[Hamburger]

Why does the FO "need" flaps? Are you about to stall? If I am 1 knot fast to you put your hand on the thrust levers as a non-verbal cue? Put your hand on the flaps all you want, I'll just stare out the window and pretend not to notice. If you say "how about some flaps" I'll just say "no thanks."

Just make sure that you don't hesitate long enough for him to say "my plane" when he calls for a go around 1ft below the company dictated stabilized approach altitude if you are 1 kt above the accepted criteria.

 

[embpic1]

If you say "how about some flaps" I'll just say "no thanks."

Ok smart guy. If I ask you 'how bout some flaps' there is a reason. If I am concerned about stalling then I have let you go too far. Believe me, I will suggest flaps well before that point. If you say 'no thanks' after I suggest flaps then I will tell you to put flaps out. You don't like it? Fine. Call the chief pilot on the ground and tell him/her your story. I am sure they would love to hear it.

The point is this. The Captain is the final authority. If he/she wants flaps, then that's what they get.

Not every pilot is an ace like you. When you make captain someday and an FO is making you uncomfortable on an approach I am sure you will just sit there and let him go. A passive commander. Just what a cockpit needs.

 

[Amish RakeFight]

Emb's right. The captain has every right to override your decision. Some of us actually respect experience and don't feel insecure defering.

 

[CX880]

What the FO considers to be dictatorial and stupid may just be the CA's greater experience which the FO does not have the experience to recognize.

Or it may actually be dictatorial and stupid. He's the captain; suck it up, junior.

Oh please. We're not going to crash or go around because I don't feel like having flaps out 20 miles out. God forbit something should happen to the CA, how in the world would I be able to fly the airplane without his guidance???? I would, I would declare an emergency and would ask for guidance from some CA on the ground a-la Hollywood movies because I have no idea when to put the flaps out so we don't crash. Give me a break, I'll go along with it because life is too short but some people just like to be backseat drivers, you could be spot on with your approach, they're always going to say something, you know who you are.

 

[asayankee]

Oh please. We're not going to crash or go around because I don't feel like having flaps out 20 miles out. God forbit something should happen to the CA, how in the world would I be able to fly the airplane without his guidance???? I would, I would declare an emergency and would ask for guidance from some CA on the ground a-la Hollywood movies because I have no idea when to put the flaps out so we don't crash. Give me a break, I'll go along with it because life is too short but some people just like to be backseat drivers, you could be spot on with your approach, they're always going to say something, you know who you are.

Lets just make this nice and simple for everyone. Configure the airplane like you're supposed to according to the FAA approved and company published profiles. When a captain puts his hand on the lever it's generally because you're not following procedure. Therefore...he/she no longer has any idea what you are doing. I couldn't care less if your feelings get hurt. It's better than sitting in the left seat trying to guess what the heck the other guy/gal is doing with your ticket on the line.

 

[CX880]

Lets just make this nice and simple for everyone. Configure the airplane like you're supposed to according to the FAA approved and company published profiles. When a captain puts his hand on the lever it's generally because you're not following procedure. Therefore...he/she no longer has any idea what you are doing. I couldn't care less if your feelings get hurt. It's better than sitting in the left seat trying to guess what the heck the other guy/gal is doing with your ticket on the line.

Fair enough.

 

[Axel]

Oh please. We're not going to crash or go around because I don't feel like having flaps out 20 miles out. God forbit something should happen to the CA, how in the world would I be able to fly the airplane without his guidance???? I would, I would declare an emergency and would ask for guidance from some CA on the ground a-la Hollywood movies because I have no idea when to put the flaps out so we don't crash. Give me a break, I'll go along with it because life is too short but some people just like to be backseat drivers, you could be spot on with your approach, they're always going to say something, you know who you are.

greater experience which the FO does not have the experience to recognize.

Case.

In.

Point.

You'll understand someday, Junior.