Lobby for Age 70!

[Mamma]

How bout an f-in weight limit?

I agree that being a fat pilot is not cool but the only limits on weight should be with the FAs. They should be discriminated against for age and size. I say size 6 and age 26. Then buh-bye! Just a thought.

 

[waveflyer]

How bout an f-in weight limit?

Seriously... Right?

For flt attendants too....

No age limit is fine- but I had to wait til 23 to get an ATP even though my seniority would have held the left seat- so I think there should be an upper limit for captains as well- let them decay in the right seat where they'll have an experienced captain who can watch them

 

[waveflyer]

I agree that being a fat pilot is not cool but the only limits on weight should be with the FAs. They should be discriminated against for age and size. I say size 6 and age 26. Then buh-bye! Just a thought.

Nice! Good timing Mamma!

- except some of the sexiest flt attendants I've had have been in the +/-40 range- I wouldn't trade them for any 20 something who hasn't learned a proper blowjob yet.... Or who doesn't have the guts to ask for what she wants...Just sayin- I'm not as into teaching as much as I once was

 

[pipejockey]

Hi!

The FAA has compared the accident rate, per 100,000 hours of flying, for age 60-65 pilots, and compared it to age <=60 pilots. Age 61-65 have the lowest accident rate.

Now that we have -121 pilots over age 60, we can now compare the -121 61-65, with the -121 <=60. I am almost 100% sure that the -121 study(ies) will corroborate the earlier studies, and the 61-65 pilots will be safest.

Pipejockey was making up a bunch of generalizations and stereotyping the over 60 guys. Not very nice!

cliff
LFW

I wasn't stereotyping or generalizing anything! I have flown with these old buzzards who have among other things, walked out of the cockpit with an engine running after having indicated that it was off during the appropriate checklist leaving me to cover their sorry a**(I guess they must leave the car running when they get home as well), forgetting to have the 2nd engine started when within moments from being cleared for takeoff leaving me to cover their a** again because they forgot to finish completing the taxi ck. list, lining up on the wrong runway on approach, etc etc etc. If they want to stay flying past 60, boot them over to the right seat! They have no business being in charge at such an advanced age.

 

[pipejockey]

How bout an f-in weight limit?

Exactly!! Some of these guys are so out of shape they could never egress out the cockpit window in the event of an emergency. Not to mention looking totally unprofessional.

 

[C-150ETOPS]

pipejockey,

I'm in total agreement. I've posted on this board in the past about flying Part 135 jet charter with 5 seperate 60+ guys and how basically 3 out of 5 sucked and showed signs of aging. Did it sway the old goats here? Not a bit. They're like drunks who think they are good enough to drive.
I've also posted about my experiences flying with many nearing age 60 at my airline. The deterioration was uneven of course. The minority were sharp as any 20 year old with the judgement of experience along with being in excellent shape. The rest had started the slide.
I've also started seeing the slide in a few FO's nearing age 60. Everything seems to happen slower with them. A simple transition in in reading a checklist down low to moving a switch in the overhead panel seems to take forever although it's OK for a checkride.

The guys throwing the responsibility here are abject fools or not really commercial pilots. We all know that AME's run mills that cannot test the cognitive skills even if they were threatened with jail. Even the Mayo clinic would have a tough time catching a geezer who games the tests.

The other issue is checkrides. Old guys get their sim checks at 10 am on a canned profile that is well know in advanced and practiced for the previous days after getting a good nights rest along with a nice cup of coffee in the brief. I am well versed on the effects of a 15 hour day with some codger trying to fly a NDB approach in a Lear 25 at 2:30 am into a snowy county airport.

Everybody starts the mental and physical slide. It sucks. I've seen it in fellow pilots and family members. Arbitrary numbers are a fact of life in every facet of society.

 

[mozzer]

Until an extremely extensive cognitive and reflex test is done in order to pass a medical for these 60+ year old ancients, it would be foolhardy to increase this age yet again. Or even worse, have no limit at all. These old guys move like they are in slow motion, and their minds often times get like mush. They just can't respond appropriately in an at times, extremely fast paced and stressful environment.

Well they shouldn't be down at the hotel bar anyway!

 

[cldsfr79]

I don't think there should be any mandatory retiremnt age. I think the AME should be held acountable for issueing a medical.

I'm sensing sarcasm but we do have this issue over in the 135 industry. There are some 70+ers. Just as long as they keep seeing "Dr. Hand Shake" they keep flying. Never mind that some can't hear that well, can't really see as well even with their glasses and some appear to fall asleep in cruise.

 

[relief tube]

don't know about you all, but I like being home....and apparently Im one of the few airline pilots that has hobbies. If I'm 55 and I have enough to retire, I can't wait to open up a spot for someone else.

I'll spend 5 mins a week while Im waiting for the tee time to read boards about current pilots bitching about everything.

 

[jtf]

I've flown with lots of guys over 60 and haven't seen any problems with any of them. The bad pilots I've flown with come from 20s to 50s. I'm sure there are plenty of crappy 60+ year old pilots, but there are plenty of crappy pilots at every age category. I have another 30 or so years of flying left and I don't mind the old dudes- they have the experience edge that can usually make up for the lost quickness that is almost never needed in this job unless you are a fighter pilot or something. Almost every emergency situation we all train for requires the pilot to calmly fly the airplane and fix the problem. Modern aircraft are almost made for monkeys to fly. The ugliest V1 cuts I've ever seen are routinely younger pilots. I much prefer the old guys experience to keep my butt out of trouble. There are almost always 2 of us in the cockpit and I defy ANY of you to say you haven't made a mistake that the other guy didn't point out at one time or another. It is your job to keep an eye on the other pilot no matter how old he or she is. Pretty much every mistake quoted in this thread that an old guy supposedly made I have watched young guys make. I would support a more stringent medical for those over 60, but for myself I want the decision to retire to be MY choice and nobody else's. Pensions are almost gone already and most of us better pray they let us fly until we die unless somehow we are able to collectively get the pay back to levels that allow a good life before and during retirement. Good luck with that the way things are looking. I'm sorry if this harms younger pilots on furlough and younger pilots who can't upgrade (including me), but that's part of the game.

 

[mamba20]

old guys go away. You knew you had to retire at age 60 and were given a gift by our idiot ex president. you don't get anymore. you've screwed enough lives up with your greed. Go away, time to pass the torch to a younger generation.

 

[Truckdriver]

One level of medical for all. If you want to up the standards, fine. But don't start whining when YOU lose YOUR medical at 45 because you don't measure up.

We don't have one level of medical right now so I don't think we should under a new system either. You know as well as anyone else that as you age your phycical and mental capabilities deteriorate. Some much sooner and at a much faster rate than others. That decline does not appear in most people until after age 50, some don't see any decline until into their 70's. I think that cognitive skills tests should be administered to anyone over age 50. It is no different than the current EKG policy which doesn't require guys under 35 to do them because they are worthless if your under that age just like cognitive skills tests are no good for guys under 50.

The problem we have now is the FAA medical is really only a test for blood pressure, hearing, EKG (which in most cases shows nothing important as far as predicting incapacitation), and vision. And even with that, you can still be a blind, deaf, walking heart attack time bomb and still get a 1st class medical. Now you can be a blind, deaf, walking heart attack time bomb that has very slow decision making abilities and needs a nap every 2 hours.

 

[pilotyip]

Until an extremely extensive cognitive and reflex test is done in order to pass a medical for these 60+ year old ancients, it would be foolhardy to increase this age yet again. Or even worse, have no limit at all. These old guys move like they are in slow motion, and their minds often times get like mush. They just can't respond appropriately in an at times, extremely fast paced and stressful environment.

Did we never have an-in-flight incapacitation prior to the age 65 rule? Was anything done then to reduce the age of a pilot? How about a rule we lower the retirement age to the age of the last pilot whom had the in-flight incapacitation. If he was 58 years old then that will be the new retirement. If the next guy is 48 that becomes the new retirement. That would really be the safest way to do it. Wouldn’t it? Age 60 was forced on the pilots back in 1958. ALPA was still fighting to get it repealed up until about 1970. This rule had nothing to do with safety; it was a deal between two W.W.II USAF Generals, AAL's C.R. Smith and Pete Quesada (sp.?) the first head of the FAA. It was to get rid of high paid pilots at the top of AAL the seniority list. It was done in the name of safety, because who can be against safety. It is like motherhood and patriotism.

If you cats think the Age 65 Rule is a burden, you should look at the ICAO signatories ... 13 of them have removed any age limitations.

I've been in the Middle Area and South America quite a bit these past three months and was astounded to learn and more and more ICAO signatory states are dropping age as a limit in total.

In 10 years, I bet, there will be no age limit in the U.S. Simply past the medical and (I believe) a cognative test.

So that's ok. At least for me. I'll square off with the best of em ... I'll work until I can't. It's not greed ... it's what I do.

TransMach

 

[chqflyer]

I wanna fly until they have to pry the yoke from my cold, dead fingers.



Not really. Entertaining thread though. Carry on!

 

[Gottafly74]

I wanna fly until they have to pry the yoke from my cold, dead fingers.



Not really. Entertaining thread though. Carry on!

Heard that one myself from a jumpseater IAH to EWR when I was a captain... Unfortunately he got his wish.. Not the way I wanna go!!