Latest USAPAwatch.......

[Sandhawk]

McDudu - what does your boyfriend have to say about this??

From USAPAwatch:

Freedom of choice

“Steve has the background to execute with perfection. He has no hidden agenda. He is here for the line pilot, not to feed his own ego, or obstruct the progress of the union…I have watched with great pleasure, Steve’s work on the board. His background and depth of knowledge of union workings is top shelf.”

Capt. Rich Peters – Former USAPA Boston Chairman

Most of us would normally hit the delete key upon the receipt of a campaign endorsement from First Officer Crimi’s hand picked successor. After all, a Crimi win returns Mr. Peters to a seat at the BPR table with the substantial clout of the Charlotte base instead of his infinitesimal former domicile. TheEye, however, couldn’t ignore the irony in his words of praise.

We need to take the trip back to 2002 when Mesa Airlines CEO Jonathan Ornstein formed Freedom Airlines. Using volunteers from within and off the street pilots, Ornstein sought to bring 64 seat and larger jets to the blossoming fee-for-departure model outside the constraints of collective bargaining units. At the time, the MESA pilots (represented by ALPA) were negotiating for new wages and work rules for these new jets. Instead of bargaining in good faith to place these jets in service, Mr. Ornstein formed a new non-union airline to skirt his obligations. ALPA and its MEC’s took a hard line against this union busting tactic.

The following is from the December 18, 2002 US Airways MEC code-a-phone:

“The MEC directed the MEC officers and Negotiating Committee to inform US Airways management that the MEC ... objects to any potential or contemplated code sharing arrangement with Freedom Air unless its pilots are represented by ALPA. The US Airways MEC supports the actions of ALPA International’s Executive Council and Executive Board in opposing the formation of Freedom Air as a non-union entity, and directed that all furloughed US Airways pilots be notified of the Executive Board, Executive Council and MEC’s opposition to Freedom Air.

Any pilot on the US Airways seniority list that accepts employment with Freedom Air will lose all US Airways MEC-sponsored ALPA privileges, including but not limited to jumpseat, health insurance, web access, furlough administrator access, and ALPA-provided job search programs. If applicable, the US Airways MEC will file Article VIII charges against any US Airways seniority list pilot accepting or remaining in employment with Freedom Air after February 1, 2003, for engaging in action detrimental to the Association.”

If you are wondering why how this is related to Mr. Crimi, so are we. Hopefully we will be receiving an explanation in the very near future.

 

[grog_sit_reserv]

He is on my Freedom A list. But I'm sure he'll make a fine east rep.

 

[Lampshade]

Freedom+USAPA=Perfect fit

 

[C Festerpuss]

This is no good, what ever side of the Mississippi your are from.

• Is this Freedom Airlines Scab list published anywhere?

• Unbiasedfacts.com has asked the question, "Is someone whose name appears on a Scab list a qualified candidate?"

• Would the USAPA Constitution and Bylaws even allow this person to serve?

• Would this person even be qualified to be a current sitting Rep.?

• If you have knowledge of the fact that a candidate is on a Scab list is should be brought out ASAP.

The guy who is accused should at least have the opportunity to clear his name.

 

[charlie2]

Yep...that's ALPA..threatening pilots as they are being furloughed...I'm so glad I don't pay a dime anymore to the Prater pension fund.

 

[MCDU]

Steve got trained and then got fired for refusing to Fly the line at Freedom while being at the time furloughed from Usair. All the while Alpa pilots were replacing his job with fellow alpa pilots that did the work for alot less pay.

M

 

[captainjack]

Steve got trained and then got fired for refusing to Fly the line at Freedom while being at the time furloughed from Usair. All the while Alpa pilots were replacing his job with fellow alpa pilots that did the work for alot less pay.

M

Steve went to Freedom knowing full well that he was taking all the leverage away from Mesa's Section 6 negotiations.

The AAA code-a-phone's and furlough updates were very clear about not going to Freedom.

Telling us that he refused a trip is like arguing about the meaning of is or claiming he got a girl only half-way pregnant.

Only someone like you MCDU could make an excuse for your Freedom buddy.

 

[grog_sit_reserv]

Its amazing! All those guys have a reason why they went and only like 5 of them ever actually flew there.

Sorry. He's on the list. He enabled JO to whipsaw the group. Our entire contract ended up being focused on getting Freedom on our list. Only jet CA saw an increase in pay because of it.

AAA told everyone NOT TO GO TO FREEDOM, it was all over the boards, the phone lines, in emails and yet... he went anyway!

When Freedom was taking deliveries Mesa returned 50 seaters to Bombardier (I flew one of them back), your boy, and everyone else on that list enabled that to happen.

He shouldn't be a candidate, seriously, people need to be held accountable for their actions. Apologize all you want for him, but his name wouldn't be on the list if he had heeded AAA's advice and Mesa's MEC's advice and stayed away.

 

[becket]

Steve got trained and then got fired for refusing to Fly the line at Freedom while being at the time furloughed from Usair. All the while Alpa pilots were replacing his job with fellow alpa pilots that did the work for alot less pay.

M

Steve Crimi is a dishonorable Scab. No wonder he's so in love with USAPA. They're a perfect fit. Just when I thought my opinion of USAPA couldn't get any lower here comes Steve SCABrimi to reset the all time low.

Is there ever going to be a point when East pilots decide to practice ANY form of personal integrity? Also, I don't give a ******************** what SCABrimi claims the reason for his termination is, it's probably a complete LIE. He accepted the job with the full knowledge that his behavior was totally undermining a real union. The fact that pilots like SCABrimi are involved at the executive level of USAPA is no shock, their official "spokesman" is a Continental SCAB too.

 

[xrated]

Guilt by association. Crimi is a SCAB, MCDU supports Crimi = MCDU is a SCAB!!!

There is justice. MCDU bags on West guys for some of their ties to Mesa. Then it turns out an East guy (Crimi) running for a union position is a Mesa SCAB! Oooops!!!

 

[C Festerpuss]

You need only two tools: WD-40 and Duct Tape. If it don’t move and it should, use WD-40. If it moves and it aint supposed to, use the duct tape.


I don think that WD-40 or Duct Tape will fix this mess. Lookie at what has turned up now.

Fellow USAPA Pilots​

The following information requires your attention.​

Pilots asked to take sides in Freedom Airlines fight
By: Gregory Polek
November 1, 2002
Air Transport and Cargo

Mesa Air Group’s designs for a new non-union subsidiary to fly its planned fleet of 64- and 84-seat jets continues to face stiff resistance from the powers that be within the Air Line Pilots Association, starting with none other than ALPA president Duane Woerth. The union’s top official traveled to Farmington, N.M., in late September to “educate” pilots training at Mesa’s ab-initio flight academy about the perceived evils of Freedom Airlines, scheduled to start service from Phoenix to Los Angeles International Airport and Long Beach, Calif., late last month. Although Woerth denied that ALPA would “blackball” pilots who choose to fly for Freedom Airlines, the ALPA president left little doubt about the union’s attitude toward those who do.

“As a pilot you can either lower the standard or raise it,” said Woerth, according to a report in the Farmington Daily Times. “You don’t reward bad behavior. Are we going to blacklist? No. But this is a small community.” Student attitudes ranged from staunchly pro-union to what many within the established pilot fraternity consider purely mercenary. But with little opportunity to find work within the traditional union track, the guarantee of 300 flying hours at Freedom Airlines has drawn interest from hungry pilots who, during better times, wouldn’t dare risk the consequences of wearing the “scab” label.


From the Dec 18, 2002 US Airways mainline code-a-phone:

The MEC directed the MEC officers and Negotiating Committee to inform US Airways management that the MEC ... objects to any potential or contemplated code sharing arrangement with Freedom Air unless its pilots are represented by ALPA. The US Airways MEC supports the actions of ALPA International Executive Council and Executive Board in opposing the formation of Freedom Air as a non-union entity, and directed that all furloughed US Airways pilots be notified of the Executive Board, Executive Council and MEC’s opposition to Freedom Air. Any pilot on the US Airways seniority list that accepts employment with Freedom Air will lose all US Airways MEC-sponsored ALPA privileges, including but not limited to jumpseat, health insurance, web access, furlough administrator access, and ALPA-provided job search programs. If applicable, the US Airways MEC will fileArticle VIII charges against any US Airways seniority list pilot accepting or remaining inemployment with Freedom Air after February 1, 2003, for engaging in action detrimental tothe Association.

 

[Dan Roman]

Yep...that's ALPA..threatening pilots as they are being furloughed...I'm so glad I don't pay a dime anymore to the Prater pension fund.

Not sure how you can blame a union for advising against union busting by anyone, furloughed or not. I would think a lot less of ALPA if they just ignored Freedom and let them undermine the profession without any response.
Any pilot who crosses a picket or flies for an obviously union busting company should be threatened.

 

[Lear70]

Moderator reviewed:

#1, naming a person from a PRESS RELEASE is not a violation of the TOS. Only revealing someone's identity from THIS BOARD is a violation of the TOS. Any questions, send via PM.

#2, knock it off with the Scab correlation. If someone is on one of the "lists", then they are on one of the "lists". This site is NOT for discussing said "list", nor for correlating someone else to being a Scab because they support someone you believe to be a Scab, nor is it for further instigating negativity towards anyone on said "list".

Any further discussion will lead to a F.I. vacation for the offending poster.

Moderator hat off:

For those of you who know what extensive union work I've done and the price I've paid for it, understand that the above is simply me enforcing the FI rules, not a personal view one way or the other. Lots of lawsuits have cropped up when people are allowed to discuss the "lists" in an open forum, and we cannot have that here.

Them's the rules, I don't make them, I just enforce them.

 

[get2flyin]

OK. "First Officer Crimi" is on the list. Wow....this is too rich. Fun fact #2:

DOH - 8/16/89
DOB - 10/19/64

Got hired by a major at 24. Wow, and the East has the audacity to call the West inexperienced. How old was "Save Dave"? Answer: 34. Classic.

MCDU rationalizes in 3...2...1....

 

[Lear70]

OK, what part of "don't discuss the list" did you not understand?

That's it. The above comment by "get2flyin" is the LAST comment about "the list" or "scabs". Next person goes to the penalty box.

 

[Raoul Duke]

You need only two tools: WD-40 and Duct Tape. If it don’t move and it should, use WD-40. If it moves and it aint supposed to, use the duct tape.


I don think that WD-40 or Duct Tape will fix this mess. Lookie at what has turned up now.

Fellow USAPA Pilots​

The following information requires your attention.​

Pilots asked to take sides in Freedom Airlines fight
By: Gregory Polek
November 1, 2002
Air Transport and Cargo

Mesa Air Group’s designs for a new non-union subsidiary to fly its planned fleet of 64- and 84-seat jets continues to face stiff resistance from the powers that be within the Air Line Pilots Association, starting with none other than ALPA president Duane Woerth. The union’s top official traveled to Farmington, N.M., in late September to “educate” pilots training at Mesa’s ab-initio flight academy about the perceived evils of Freedom Airlines, scheduled to start service from Phoenix to Los Angeles International Airport and Long Beach, Calif., late last month. Although Woerth denied that ALPA would “blackball” pilots who choose to fly for Freedom Airlines, the ALPA president left little doubt about the union’s attitude toward those who do.

“As a pilot you can either lower the standard or raise it,” said Woerth, according to a report in the Farmington Daily Times. “You don’t reward bad behavior. Are we going to blacklist? No. But this is a small community.” Student attitudes ranged from staunchly pro-union to what many within the established pilot fraternity consider purely mercenary. But with little opportunity to find work within the traditional union track, the guarantee of 300 flying hours at Freedom Airlines has drawn interest from hungry pilots who, during better times, wouldn’t dare risk the consequences of wearing the “scab” label.


From the Dec 18, 2002 US Airways mainline code-a-phone:

The MEC directed the MEC officers and Negotiating Committee to inform US Airways management that the MEC ... objects to any potential or contemplated code sharing arrangement with Freedom Air unless its pilots are represented by ALPA. The US Airways MEC supports the actions of ALPA International Executive Council and Executive Board in opposing the formation of Freedom Air as a non-union entity, and directed that all furloughed US Airways pilots be notified of the Executive Board, Executive Council and MEC’s opposition to Freedom Air. Any pilot on the US Airways seniority list that accepts employment with Freedom Air will lose all US Airways MEC-sponsored ALPA privileges, including but not limited to jumpseat, health insurance, web access, furlough administrator access, and ALPA-provided job search programs. If applicable, the US Airways MEC will fileArticle VIII charges against any US Airways seniority list pilot accepting or remaining inemployment with Freedom Air after February 1, 2003, for engaging in action detrimental tothe Association.

“As a pilot you can either lower the standard or raise it,” said Woerth

Simply an astounding statement from the individual who did more to lower the standard than any pilot in the history of aviation. I am trying to figure out how to wipe up the coffee that just shot out of my nose and onto my computer.

 

[Lear70]

OK, there's one to the penalty box. Do I have any more takers?

NO MORE TALK OF SCABS. The end. Period.

First guy got 3 days. The next person who does gets 7. Next one after that gets a month. Next one after that gets PERMANENTLY banned.

Have I made my point yet? Good. Move on.

 

[MCDU]

Guilt by association. Crimi is a SCAB, MCDU supports Crimi = MCDU is a SCAB!!!

There is justice. MCDU bags on West guys for some of their ties to Mesa. Then it turns out an East guy (Crimi) running for a union position is a Mesa SCAB! Oooops!!!

Whats up with that?

M

 

[Lear70]

That's why everyone has been put on notice. This thread has gotten way out of control and I'm about to delete the whole dang thing...

 

[BeCareful!]

I know Steve and I know he went to Freedom only to bag the type rating. He never intended to fly there.....but....

Even though I love the thought of Johnny O forking out $30,000 or whatever to train Steve and then never make a dime off his services, I don't agree with that sort of career move. PFT, union busting airlines.....none of that in my resume and there won't be.

Having said that, these boards bring about the most reprehensible, hateful behavior, don't they?

 

[Ocity]

I know Steve and I know he went to Freedom only to bag the type rating. He never intended to fly there.....but....

Even though I love the thought of Johnny O forking out $30,000 or whatever to train Steve and then never make a dime off his services, I don't agree with that sort of career move. PFT, union busting airlines.....none of that in my resume and there won't be.

Having said that, these boards bring about the most reprehensible, hateful behavior, don't they?

I keep hearing he didn't quit after getting a type rating. He was fired. He claims it was because he refused to fly...word in PHX is he failed IOE to the point of termination. I believe the latter. He admits he was fired. Why would anybody want a termination in their record when he could have picked up a type rating and simply RESIGNED? His story doesn't make any sense.

 

[Raoul Duke]

Yup exactly. As for complaining about the thread, this is exactly what message boards are for, get the word out in all of its ugly truth. We need less censorship not more.

 

[Lear70]

Yup exactly. As for complaining about the thread, this is exactly what message boards are for, get the word out in all of its ugly truth. We need less censorship not more.

You can do that without violating the Terms of Service.

They're not my rules, but when I was approached to be a Mod, I agreed to uphold them, and that's what I'm going to do. If people don't like those rules, they're free to find another board to talk in and see if they get away with it or start their own and see how long it takes to get sued. The rules exist for a reason.

As far as I know, this board is the MOST lax of any of them out there, and this has gone as far as it's going to.

 

[ultrarunner]

Yup exactly. As for complaining about the thread, this is exactly what message boards are for, get the word out in all of its ugly truth. We need less censorship not more.

Yes, but what we have her Raoul is Lear70 essentially supporting us in that these lower forms of life need to be continuously ratted out because they either:

1. Crossed a picket line and took your job

or

2. Took your job by going to the non-union alter ego outfit.

Either way, Lear70 recognizes these persons as a lower life form and wouldn't have a thing to do with them. It's just that his bosses don't like phone calls from these lower life forms threatening legal action for supporting the thrashing of their names on the public board.

Thats all.

 

[grog_sit_reserv]

I do agree with Lear70, however, Crimi by running for EVP is now a public figure. Like a politician, he is holding himself up as someone to be voted for in an election that is important to many pilots, just like Prater and Woerth, he is holding himself up for scrutiny based on his record.

Perhaps the type of condemnation has gotten out of hand, but his record and his actions speak the truth.

The truth is, he did work for Freedom Airlines while Mesa Pilots were in Section 6 negotiations. He did it contrary to the wishes of the AAA MEC and the Mesa MEC. Now he wants to represent USAirways pilots; I think he's a bad choice.

 

[BeCareful!]

I do agree with Lear70, however, Crimi by running for EVP is now a public figure. Like a politician, he is holding himself up as someone to be voted for in an election that is important to many pilots, just like Prater and Woerth, he is holding himself up for scrutiny based on his record.

Perhaps the type of condemnation has gotten out of hand, but his record and his actions speak the truth.

The truth is, he did work for Freedom Airlines while Mesa Pilots were in Section 6 negotiations. He did it contrary to the wishes of the AAA MEC and the Mesa MEC. Now he wants to represent USAirways pilots; I think he's a bad choice.

Agree with much of what you say here, but....

The misapplication of the term SCAB waters down the real meaning of the word. There are pilots who have scabbed at a lot of airlines (some which might hit close to home for ya), but Crimi isn't one of them.

As for whether Crimi is a bad choice, I disagree, but I will say that he's made some bad choices. Doesn't mean he can't do this particular job well though (and even, perhaps, better than your favorite candidate, even in protecting your interests....believe it or not, which I'm sure you won't.)

I know you guys don't care about this union, but it could be so much better than ALPA if we could find a way to get along. (FENCE)

 

[regionaltard]

I know you guys don't care about this union, but it could be so much better than ALPA if we could find a way to get along. (FENCE)

Maybe you can go back to the future and make that argument to Nicolau.

 

[ultrarunner]

The issue BeCareful is the underlying value system of an elected official. In the case of Crimi, that value system, AS IT RELATES TO BEST PROTECTING THE INTERESTS OF A UNION MEMBER, are in serious doubt. And is based on his past behavior, which is NOT in dispute.

Crimi was more than willing to whore out to a alter-ego outfit, while the current contracting carrier was in opening negotiations with the company. THAT is a big no-no!

He knew it, and he should pay the price!

And he likely will pay the price, if he hasn't already, and will keep paying it, as a dedicated union member will never forget!

 

[Deadalus]

Guilt by association. Crimi is a SCAB, MCDU supports Crimi = MCDU is a SCAB!!!

There is justice. MCDU bags on West guys for some of their ties to Mesa. Then it turns out an East guy (Crimi) running for a union position is a Mesa SCAB! Oooops!!!

MCDufuss is probably a freedom faggot himself.

 

[Sandhawk]

Agree with much of what you say here, but....

The misapplication of the term SCAB waters down the real meaning of the word. There are pilots who have scabbed at a lot of airlines (some which might hit close to home for ya), but Crimi isn't one of them.

Well, senor - we all know what you are referring to - but, I believe (correct me if I am wrong) that technically the Ansett guys all walked off of the job en masse - there wasn't a strike - so are the guys that took over technically Scabs?

Make no mistake - I am NOT condoning the actions of either group - but if we are talking using the straight definition of "scab"......

Don't forget about another usapa guy that supposedly "just interviewed for practice" at CAL in 83 or 85, but turns out he actually went to work during the strike.


THE TRUTH IS STRANGER THAN FICTION !!


:laugh: