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How do you know your 110% understaffed? Unless you've taken delivery of a large number of airframes your still overstaffed. In terms of being preeminent luxury brand....Just about every NJA crew I see on the road looks more like a cargo dog run into the ground. From my point of view it just doesn't look like the same company. If I see that, surely your owners do too.

And even if you are somehow understaffed you guys just call TMC or EJM and secretly sell off the trip. No harm no foul........

Recalls didn't happen in November, December, and they aren't happening in April......
 
Just a hunch based on years of experience and keenly observing the organization as a frontline employee. The business model will not work particularly well if the primary reason for selloffs is as a stop gap to understaffing. I think you understand this but it's worth emphasizing. As far as the worlds preeminent brand I would tend to agree that NJA has struggled significantly in this endeavor and I'm not even 100% certain it wants to wear the label anymore ...at least not this EMT. To your point about QOL on the road you are correct. It has deteriorated significantly. But I believe in this pilot group and it's ability to collectively improve upon that area. But recalls will happen and I'm not alone in believing rather soon.
 
Xcorporate said:
How do you know your 110% understaffed? Unless you've taken delivery of a large number of airframes your still overstaffed. In terms of being preeminent luxury brand....Just about every NJA crew I see on the road looks more like a cargo dog run into the ground. From my point of view it just doesn't look like the same company. If I see that, surely your owners do too.

And even if you are somehow understaffed you guys just call TMC or EJM and secretly sell off the trip. No harm no foul........

Recalls didn't happen in November, December, and they aren't happening in April......
Click to expand...

Staffing modeling is based on demand not on airframes. Demand is really high right now and sales are strong so demand should continue to be strong. When whole shares are parsed down to 32 shares on a card it changes the response to demand methods significantly. NJ should have recalled pilots months ago so that it could be ready for the busy season. Money, good will, lost opportunity and brand all left on the table by poor decisions by the EMT.
 
JustPlaneTruth said:
Staffing modeling is based on demand not on airframes. Demand is really high right now and sales are strong so demand should continue to be strong. When whole shares are parsed down to 32 shares on a card it changes the response to demand methods significantly. NJ should have recalled pilots months ago so that it could be ready for the busy season. Money, good will, lost opportunity and brand all left on the table by poor decisions by the EMT.
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Not according to your union assuming your nja. Mcincrow and ward multiple times on the furloughed side have said its airframes alone that will drive recalls and nothing else.
 
"Your"
"You're"

You guys are killing me.
 
Dc. They are full of crap!

They don't know nor does anyone else.

End of first qr this year unless they want a sh!t show next fall
 
DC-4 said:
Not according to your union assuming your nja. Mcincrow and ward multiple times on the furloughed side have said its airframes alone that will drive recalls and nothing else.
Click to expand...

Well the contract is airframes alone.

But management (in the past) has said flight demand determines what they think they need.
 
:laugh: He said management and think
 
JustPlaneTruth said:
Staffing modeling is based on demand not on airframes. Demand is really high right now and sales are strong so demand should continue to be strong. When whole shares are parsed down to 32 shares on a card it changes the response to demand methods significantly. NJ should have recalled pilots months ago so that it could be ready for the busy season. Money, good will, lost opportunity and brand all left on the table by poor decisions by the EMT.
Click to expand...


Exactly the opposite everyone has been told over the last 4+ years.....

Somehow I'm not surprised.... Nothing that has been told to a furloughee has been 100% truthful...
 
BentOver said:
Exactly the opposite everyone has been told over the last 4+ years.....

Somehow I'm not surprised.... Nothing that has been told to a furloughee has been 100% truthful...
Click to expand...

Management has been saying "demand" for some time. Since they control manning, why would they say "demand" when they secretly they were using "airframes". The reality is probably that demand drives airframe need which drives manning levels so the point is moot for anything but discussion.

Keep in mind that some former "leaders" and keyboard cowboys in the union have been screaming "overstaffed" and "furloughs around the corner" for nearly 3 years now. Didn't come to fruition and their argument is based on bogus data. The CBA speaks to a minimum required staffing level that really has no basis in reality to what is needed to run operations. How convenient to crank out bogus numbers and keep the troops on edge. Only problem - real people have made real life decisions based on opinions not based on reality.
 
Last edited:
Total airframes or available airframes? On any given day, you've got several that are in MX for multi-day inspections don't need crews.
 
JustPlaneTruth said:
Management has been saying "demand" for some time. Since they control manning, why would they say "demand" when they secretly they were using "airframes". The reality is probably that demand drives airframe need which drives manning levels so the point is moot for anything but discussion.

Keep in mind that some former "leaders" and keyboard cowboys in the union have been screaming "overstaffed" and "furloughs around the corner" for nearly 3 years now. Didn't come to fruition and their argument is based on bogus data. Yeah no sh.it... I'd could give you the names of the 3 likely culprits on our side of the msg board with ease. Every time we mentioned anything about 18 day/extended days etc etc, it was constantly jammed down our throats that we were wrong and the company was "most likey going to furlough next quarter".. It took one of the recall initiators to personally email me and inform me how wrong the other 3 were... That in fact the numbers did not support a furlough and things actually were looking brighter.. (Without Luthi and Co. at the helm.) The CBA speaks to a minimum required staffing level that really has no basis in reality to what is needed to run operations. How convenient to crank out bogus numbers and keep the troops on edge. Only problem - real people have made real life decisions based on opinions not based on reality.
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The former NJASAP leadership had such an agenda that they didn't care what lie they told as long as it made their agenda stronger.

Now when's the next referendum vote, Bylaws vote, or any other vote? It's been atleast 2 months, there must be a vote occurring that takes up more resources.. :beer:
 
t-bone said:
Total airframes or available airframes? On any given day, you've got several that are in MX for multi-day inspections don't need crews.
Click to expand...

5 per total airframes.

A couple of years ago when it was slower ...more furlough rumours were floated by I don't know who... So people calculated how many could possibly be furloughed and still remain at 5 per airframe. Problem is at that time the number of airframes was going lower every month... and some of the airframes we were told the company wanted to get rid of.

So if they had airframes on the books that are not needed ... I guess its just a paperwork drill to remove those from the certificate.

How many pilots are needed to meet demand? I think this is the real number because the company can just rid itself of unneeded airplanes. But as the CBA is written ... airframes determines minimum number of crews
 
DC-4 said:
Ok I give. What happened this week. I hope nothing bad in your personal life and your speaking of work.
Click to expand...

Nothing too dramatic. Except our delusional, out-of-touch, and possibly turncoat union EBoard blew up the best unity and leverage building effort it ever had and tried to replace it with a retread, lilly-livered, and to many, downright offensive "branding" campaign.

It's just the latest example of how dysfunctional and impotent NJASAP is.

It would be funny if it wasn't so sad....
 

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