Job Situation

[airgator]

It's an entirely different kind of flying.....altogether.

 

[1900laker]

The group answers out loud...

"It's an entirely different kind of flying."



Sorry, couldn't resist that famous part from the movie: Airplane

 

[Medivacer]

I come from a country where you either taught, or you flew into a 2500' the middle of no where (bush). Here people do not respect CFI's like they do down there. Theres a saying about haveing a 1000 hours of the same 1 hour.

Nothing can compare to doing an NDB approach into a place that is only accessable by air, picking up a moron who played cops and robbers and somehow got shot in the process. Taking him down to a major city, and you get to have a donut at Tim Hortons becuase you don't even have a donut shop this far north.

How many of you actually have to perform short and soft feild take off and landings in all your legs?

So when the Cheif Pilot at a Teir 3 regional ask me why I never got a CFI and buddy beside me did I'll tell him why.

How many of you flew in Alaska? Thats the only place that compares to bush flying here in the north. How many of you have flown ski's before?

You can't tell me that a guy who has 1500 hour's of instructing and a guy with 1500 hours of bush flying have the same amount of expirience.

That is why I'm staying here for now. Later on when I have the proper expirience I'll come down there and apply at a regional.

Cheers.

 

[Simon Says]

Ok buddy let me tell you something. You have got a lot of positive feedback from your post of wanting a job with only 300 hours. You are coming off like you are deserved a job because you fly in northern Canada. 300 hours is nothing in this industry, and now that you do have a commercial/instrument (I think) you are one dangerous pilot. You think you have seen it all. You think you can do it all. You havent seen it all and you cant do it all. The attitude that you are conveying is going to damage some equipment or even worse injur somebody.

I would say 95% of the FO I fly with are a good stick. They can fly the airplane without being babysitted. Their hours range from 1000 to 3000. What makes a good FO vs a not so good FO is his attitude/maturity/decision making. I would rather have a person with these qualities sitting next to me than to have a good stick sitting next to me.

Take care and get your CFI/CFII/MEI then we can talk about what you know.

 

[sydeseet]

One word: Darwin

 

[1900laker]

Since you compared your flying to Alaska, I thought I would share what a couple of pilots who flew over 2000 hours in various aircraft in Alaska had to share with us when they came to our airline.

They pretty much said that there is kind of a 1000 hour mark up there in that kind of flying that is kind of a survival point. Meaning that if you make it past a 1000 hours up there, you have a much greater chance of surviving the rest of your flying up there. They counted off a dozen or more instances of people they flew with who killed themselves in airplane accidents in Alaska, mostly because they did not have the experience to handle the situation. All I am saying is be careful. Your next 700 hours of flying should be done with extra caution and a voice constantly in the back of your head asking are you doing everything right at the moment. Never get complacent.

Additionally, I applaud your experience thus far. What you are doing is the most challenging flying there is, asside from maybe landing an F-14 on a pitching carrier deck at night or flying one in combat.

Now people, please don't flame me on this and look for the point before firing back... Kit Darby and his AirInc seminars/manuals/jobfairs are given reviews good and bad. But one of the things that I heard that I have since witnessed to be true is that you do NOT want to standout away from the norm. Airlines are conservative in their view and will be more likely to choose a pilot who on paper and in interview looks very similar to the hundreds or thousands of pilots currently working there that are perfoming their mission succesfully. As a consequence, you will have a BETTER chance of having MORE offers from various airlines to which you apply IF you match a model close to what they are looking for. It is such a fickle process that sometimes it boiles down to who's resume format they like better. Consider that since your Airline career will likely be DOWN HERE, you will probably want to look like most extra applicants on paper that apply from down here, and use your bush flying as that extra bonus. That way a potential employer looks at both people who are CFIs (and it is likely that the interviewer may have gone that route too) and says one of the former CFIs is an experienced bush pilot. Bingo!

I have personnaly known several pilots who were hired with airlines with considerably less time, with the stipulation that they start in the training department because of a shortage of instructors. But guess what... they were former CFIs.

Don't take all this the wrong way. I am by no means putting down the type of flying you are doing. I just wanted you to know what I have seen from inside the industry thus far. One of the former Alaska pilots I mentioned didn't have a CFI and he got hired just fine. The whole game is a giant crap shoot. I am just telling you how to load the dice a little in your favor.

 

[FL000]

How many of you flew in Alaska? Thats the only place that compares to bush flying here in the north. How many of you have flown ski's before?

You can't tell me that a guy who has 1500 hour's of instructing and a guy with 1500 hours of bush flying have the same amount of expirience.

That is why I'm staying here for now. Later on when I have the proper expirience I'll come down there and apply at a regional.

If you're going to bring that attitude with you, don't bother. You'll just be wasting your time, cowboy.

 

[hiflt]

Ok, my .02..
I too flew bush in northern Canada - floats, wheels, skis., and am currently furloughed from a US regional. The bush experience will sharpen your piloting skills, no question, but if you desire an airline job, you need quality ifr and multi time. I was not able to get my CFI when I was younger - no cash - and am busy getting it now that I'm furloughed, for most of the reasons stated here:
1. It will sharpen your knowlege
2. It will definitely hone your flying skills further
3. You will get an opportunity to build multi-engine time
4. You will get an opportunity to network, network, network
This is important. I found that in remote locations, the contacts invariably lead to the same kind of flying, but with better companies - i.e. no multi/ifr experience. You can get stuck in a rut.
5. When you are qualified to work for your first regional, having a CFI rating may open other doors, such as management positions; training department positions; etc.
6. It shows that you are a committed, professional pilot.
7. You will have developed your explanatory skills and will be able to benefit your future first officers, etc.
While you are up north, why not order the Gleim or similar CFI books and get the written exams out of the way now?
Anyway, good luck with your career.

 

[hiflt]

I just wanted to echo the cautions 1900Laker expressed above. Be careful and keep your goal in sight. No company is worth your license or your life or an accident. If pushed to fly in bad weather; with bad maintenance; and/or overloaded, sometimes the best response is to walk away and get another job, hard as it may be. I did it myself on one occasion with a questionable company, and never regretted it. Remember, it's an exercise in judgement.
My advice would be to fly the bush and get your C.F.I. at the same time, if possible in a remote location. If not, pick a month in a slow time [having completed the exams ahead of time] and go to flight school and push hard to get done ASAP.
If you have both bush experience AND a CFI you will poised to take advantage of more opportunities than if you only have the one qualification.
Good luck.

 

[Medivacer]

I think some of you have jumped to a conclusion about me.
No where did I say that I know all. I have many things to learn.

I have my own limits that I have set.


You want to talk about atitude?
I got the hint from this board that , if you don't get a CFI you'll never fly for an airline. "The only reason I got hired with my airline is becuase I'm a CFI". A 1000 of the same hour principle applies don't you think?

When I flew with my instructor all he would ever do is look and count cars. How is that learning from your student? The only stories that he could tell was the ones about students messing up. How can that compare to landing in a lake that no one else can get to. The last person to be there was probably an Aboriginal 400 years ago.


Some one stated that Instucting is a different kind of flying all together. It is.

How can you compare the satisfaction of teaching someone to fly to saving someones life?

I fly a twin, so I will be getting lots of Multi IFR. I will be flying a Beaver on floats once the ice melts, so I'll be getting PIC.