Jetblue: Lateral Move For Regional Captains

[oldxfr8dog]

...I can't resist. There are issues alright. They are giving you a message that they are saving their blue darts for someone better than you hehehehe.

Maybe, maybe not. I have a "Blue Dart" that I can't give away.

 

[Scrapdog]

...I can't resist. There are issues alright. They are giving you a message that they are saving their blue darts for someone better than you hehehehe.

LOL - possibly so...however, I think both of them said more or less "dude, you don't want to come here now" (w/o quoting them directly). Pretty sad when your senior cadre of pilots have that outlook.

BL - JB 5-6 years ago was great - the allure of the quick upgrade was the gravy. Today - not even close.

 

[Spectre]

Spetre:
I'm guessing that the folks hiring on now will easily see 6th yr cpt. at DAL. 6th yr captain pay on the M88 is $131/hr. We aren't hiring for attirition, but for growth. New a/c coming for the forseeable future. Also, was told by the CP's office they are upping the hiring to 75/month.
It will most likely be like it was back 10 yrs ago where 2 yr captains at DAL were part of the norm.
JB is slowing its growth plan.
How long for a current new hire (hired today) to be upgraded to 320 Capt?
I'm just curious..........

737

Glad to hear things are picking up at DAL. However, lets look at some other legacies.

6 year Captain pay:

USAir A320 $117/HR
NWA DC9 $118/HR
UAL A320 $125/HR

My pay at JetBlue is $127/hr and $190/hr after 70 hours. At NWA, it's probably going to take over 10 years to upgrade to DC-9 Captain. That's 200+ retirements a year and negative growth as they are not replacing the DC-9s being parked. Plus, it takes over 80 hours to get premium pay.

To add, here's a number most don't know. For a 6 year pilot, JetBlue pays another 10 hours/month in PTO (personal time off). This pay can either be used as days off, sick time that pays premium or cashed out at any pay period. You are allowed up to 200 hours in this bank. It's use or lose, so at some point people here are getting it as additional pay or more time off.

Sure, junior guys always want what senior guys have. That's the same at any airline. However, just this year alone, E190 guys and FO's on the A320 have had a larger percentage pay increase than Captains on the A320.

To add, this year our 401K matching was increased from 3% to 5% and we also have 5% profit sharing whether the company makes money or not. We also have a new long term disability for pilots which I feel is industry leading. You get an average of your last 12 months pay until retirement age.

Finally, some of us have over 20,000 shares of JetBlue stock options while junior guys have around 6,000 shares. Sorry new guys who have zero. One bright spot though, if our stock goes over $20/share, you new guys may be moving up a couple 100 line numbers...

JetBlue isn't perfect, but over the last 7 years, every pilot has had some sort of pay increase even after 9/11, no pay cuts, and no union dues.

 

[Spectre]

LOL - possibly so...however, I think both of them said more or less "dude, you don't want to come here now" (w/o quoting them directly). Pretty sad when your senior cadre of pilots have that outlook.

BL - JB 5-6 years ago was great - the allure of the quick upgrade was the gravy. Today - not even close.

You probably talked to them on 15 February...

Upgrades all come with seniority, so the sooner you get on the property (anywhere) you are better off. It's hard to predict where upgrades will occur faster. Even Southwest is reducing their B737 orders next year so their upgrades are going to take longer.

Our new JFK terminal will be done in October 2008. What JetBlue decides on doing with old terminal 6 is unknown. Who knows, there are even rumors we may make terminal 6 an international terminal and we'd be flying A330s or A350s. We are the largest domestic carrier at JFK with our own strong feed network--it's very possible.

I'll go against the grain and say come on over to JetBlue, it's still a great place to work and play.

 

[Spectre]

Maybe, maybe not. I have a "Blue Dart" that I can't give away.

I'm saving mine for my son...

 

[RogerMOSA]

A couple of folks already hit on this but I think a pilot's success at JB was 100% based on timing. Today is a whole different story. The #1 selling point at JB was the upgrade time - that is non-existent today.

Scrap - You, my friend, are 100% correct!! They "honeymoon" at JB is over and has been for some time.

Spectre - Answer us one question, please. If you were just coming off AD, where would JB be on your list of airlines to work for?

RM

 

[Truckdriver]

To add, this year our 401K matching was increased from 3% to 5% and we also have 5% profit sharing whether the company makes money or not. We also have a new long term disability for pilots which I feel is industry leading. You get an average of your last 12 months pay until retirement age.

Basically you have a 5% match into a 401K for your retirement. Profit sharing in a bonus plan and was never meant to be included in retirment planning. If you include profit sharing into all the other airline retirment equations, JetBlue is still far behind in retirement.

 

[Hair-on-Fire]

Basically you have a 5% match into a 401K for your retirement. Profit sharing in a bonus plan and was never meant to be included in retirment planning. If you include profit sharing into all the other airline retirment equations, JetBlue is still far behind in retirement.

Regardless of what you "think" should be included, we're still getting a minimum 10% company contribution to the 401K if we contribute 5%. Plus the chance to get more if profit is more.

Maybe you don't understand the 5% profit sharing contribution is guaranteed? Regardless of company profit.

 

[737 Pylt]

At least A320 Capts at JetBlue on reserve only have to fly out of JFK. DAL pilots on reserve have to cover EWR, LGA, and JFK. How many B-737s and MD-88s is DAL buying the next few years?

Right now, firm orders for:
10 737-700's
9 777 LR's
13 757's between now and early 2008(former TWA aircraft)

Working on additional:
30 MD 90's from China in exchange for 50 seat rj's
2 additional 777's from an Indian airline by the end of this year
787 order?! Mostly replacement of the 767 ER aircraft, but some will be additional aircraft.

All the wide body aircraft are for ultra long haul, which generates lots of vacancies.

How many aircraft does JB have on order?

737

 

[Truckdriver]

Regardless of what you "think" should be included, we're still getting a minimum 10% company contribution to the 401K if we contribute 5%. Plus the chance to get more if profit is more.

Maybe you don't understand the 5% profit sharing contribution is guaranteed? Regardless of company profit.

I completely understand what it is and what it isn't. It isn't a DC plan and it is money that you probably would have gotten anyway. So if you had a DC plan you would get the 10% even if the company made no money. If they did make money you would get the 10% PLUS what you would have gotten from profit sharing. It's profit sharing that they are calling retirement. Profit sharing in a bonus program for helping the company make a profit it isn't retirement. It's no different than them telling you to count 2% of your premium pay as retirement and telling you that you have a 12% retirement plan.