Jet Blue~thanks For The Open House Today (12dec06)!!!!!!!!

[Splert]

I believe the only guys who would go back if recalled are FOs here at JB.

My buds' crash pad mate is a 190 CA and has a JAN class date at UAL.

 

[Blue Dude]

Any line holding Captain here on the A320 is pulling in at least $150K a year.

Dammit man, step away from the blue juice. Just do the math on that. You're saying that "any" line holding captain gets 90 hrs of hard time every month and gets paid $125 an hour? And never takes vacation or PTO? That's what you'd have to do to get to $150k. I'm in the top 10% and don't make nearly that because I don't live in a crash pad and whore myself on day turns at the expense of my real life. The average A320 line holding captain does well to earn $135k. That's $120/hr and 85 hrs of hard time a month.

Jeez, Spectre, enthusiasm is one thing, blindness to reality is something entirely different.

 

[Spectre]

Dammit man, step away from the blue juice. Just do the math on that. You're saying that "any" line holding captain gets 90 hrs of hard time every month and gets paid $125 an hour? And never takes vacation or PTO? That's what you'd have to do to get to $150k. I'm in the top 10% and don't make nearly that because I don't live in a crash pad and whore myself on day turns at the expense of my real life. The average A320 line holding captain does well to earn $135k. That's $120/hr and 85 hrs of hard time a month.

Jeez, Spectre, enthusiasm is one thing, blindness to reality is something entirely different.

Blindness to reality? You should see my paycheck. I don't have a crashpad either and bid only commutable trips. If all you are making is $135K a year with your seniority, you need to have a quick lesson on how to make money at JetBlue.

We all receive 9 hours/month of PTO. That's 108 additional pay hours a year. As a 5 year A320 Captain, that's $12,960 of straight pay or $19,440 of premium pay or PTS. Heck, that's like a month of pay without even checking in for work! If you selectively PTS two or three 25 hour credit trips a year, you can easily earn over $150K a year and still accrue additional PTO in your bank.

It's not financially wise to PTO or take vacation in big blocks here at JetBlue. That's just the system we have in place. Integrety? Well, just check there is plenty of reserve before you PTS and make sure it's not on a holiday or weekend. You won't feel too bad then. You certainly do not have to fly 90 hours a month to earn 90 hours pay here at JetBlue.

P.S. If you are in the top 10% seniority at JB, you could always cash out your stock options for $250K and not work for 1.5 years hehe.

 

[JBPA]

I'm in the top 20% and don't make anywhere near $150K. Oh, I bid commutable trips and use PTS when it suits me too. Why bid vacation, if you can call it that since we lose money, or use PTO?

I think we all tend to exaggerate our pay when talking to others. I know I do. It makes us feel better about our particular situation (bidding strategies, RSA whore, overall whore, not to mention our crappy pay and benes).

I have a a bud around my seniority that made north of $150K. He's always working and will be in the high 900's for BLOCK hours. Can you say 10 days off/month?

I'll stick with <700 block and $120K with 16-18 days off/month.

Finally, to the Blue Crew who'll likely tell me I should leave....I am looking elsewhere, especially given the circumstances of late.

 

[puddlejumper101]

sounds like SWA...except things are not going quite as well. JetBlue sounds like a SWA wannabe...

 

[Blue Dude]

Spectre, all I'm saying is that your math doesn't work. Even if you were to PTS a few trips here and there, to make $150k you would have to bid 93 hrs of credit every month (at $120/hr). The PTS would just replace what you've already bid so that is irrelevant. And to bid 93 hrs of credit every month, you'd have to come up with 10 hrs of soft time every month or you'd time out. There's not enough slack in the pairings (underblocking, rigs, 13:30's, training, PTS, etc.) for everyone to come up with that much every month.

You want to talk totals on your W-2, that's a different issue. That can include anything, from PTO buyback to stock options to CSPP profits. You can't count on any of that, so let's stick with flight pay. And "any" A320 line holder captain isn't going to be pulling down $150k in flight pay. Some may, but not "any" captain in the sense that you meant it, meaning that it's a typical figure. Any individual captain could choose to work that hard and game the system for all it's worth, but it would be very difficult to sustain it, and in the meantime he'd have no life. It couldn't be done by the pilot group as a whole.

 

[jbucpt]

blue dude,

im a six year captain, i averaged 83-86 hours a month, a couple of 90+ (due to the wife spending and golf equipment) 16 days off average, 3 weeks off in july. no stock cssp or options and will have grossed 141,000 +change for 2006.

thats my reality.

 

[Lake Alice]

In good times, the company will do the right thing. People here early on remember our 30% pay raise in October of 2001 and 17% profit sharing. It's when times are bad that we need more communication from management and that's not happening from upper management down to our chief pilots. Why such the secret from the pay group? Why not tell us what you proposed to management?

This is what kills me about senior people at Jetblue. The company started by paying extremely sub standard wages. When you got your whopping 30% raise you were still underpaid. And before you bring up any profit sharing comments when was the last time you received one of those. 75% of us have never seen one. Senior people or anyone at Jetblue who keeps on repeating D&D will "do the right thing" are IDIOTS! I am so sick and tired of hearing this. You agreed to poor wages when you started. You got a raise of 30% that still made you underpaid. We are all underpaid now in comparison to legacy carriers in bankruptcy.

Dave and Dave know this and it will not change. Take your "do the right thing" statement and shove it up your arse. This is a business and they will pay the very least to keep people quiet. Sans a union we will not be getting a raise. E-190 fo's maybe but that is just to stem the tide of people leaving that particular seat.

All this being said Jetblue is a nice place to work. You are treated fairly well, the people you work with are great and the schedules are not that bad. If you look at it as just a job you will be fine. As a career this is not it.

 

[Captzaahlie]

blue dude,

im a six year captain, i averaged 83-86 hours a month, a couple of 90+ (due to the wife spending and golf equipment) 16 days off average, 3 weeks off in july. no stock cssp or options and will have grossed 141,000 +change for 2006.

thats my reality.

I could get by on that (above pay), besides I don't have time for golf, so that might balance out my other halfs spending......... where can I get her re programed so that she helps me save for retirement instead of living for the moment?

 

[elag777]

This is what kills me about senior people at Jetblue. The company started by paying extremely sub standard wages. When you got your whopping 30% raise you were still underpaid. And before you bring up any profit sharing comments when was the last time you received one of those. 75% of us have never seen one. Senior people or anyone at Jetblue who keeps on repeating D&D will "do the right thing" are IDIOTS! I am so sick and tired of hearing this. You agreed to poor wages when you started. You got a raise of 30% that still made you underpaid. We are all underpaid now in comparison to legacy carriers in bankruptcy.

Dave and Dave know this and it will not change. Take your "do the right thing" statement and shove it up your arse. This is a business and they will pay the very least to keep people quiet. Sans a union we will not be getting a raise. E-190 fo's maybe but that is just to stem the tide of people leaving that particular seat.

All this being said Jetblue is a nice place to work. You are treated fairly well, the people you work with are great and the schedules are not that bad. If you look at it as just a job you will be fine. As a career this is not it.

I guess "one" could be happy with $11.00 less an hour at LCC year 10 on comparable equipment, and for WIW I think 1st year 190 pay will do some $5 dollars better than said LCC at $41 an hour, but I know the grass is always greener. $160hr 10yr wide body capt at LCC must be ecstatic eh?

 

[clickclickboom]

Spectre, JBPA, bluejuice 787 and others.. Please guys log onto bluepilots and spill yourBS..


Anyone that rationalizes our PTO accrual as a pay raise or additional pay is an idiot. Our PTO is an absolute min and it pays at base rate sick day? Family emergency? PTO bye bye

I know things are tough making $135, 141, 150 or even 160K for the guys that truly hate their wife and kids..

I am rt seat on the bus and my last pay check shows my ytd amount as $51,325 how's that for some reality?

I highly suggest you guys that are fed up to move on to something better. I would be very happy to move up the list and plan my future making 300% more than I make now.

 

[Captzaahlie]

Spectre, JBPA, bluejuice 787 and others.. Please guys log onto bluepilots and spill yourBS..


Anyone that rationalizes our PTO accrual as a pay raise or additional pay is an idiot. Our PTO is an absolute min and it pays at base rate sick day? Family emergency? PTO bye bye

I know things are tough making $135, 141, 150 or even 160K for the guys that truly hate their wife and kids..

I am rt seat on the bus and my last pay check shows my ytd amount as $51,325 how's that for some reality?

I highly suggest you guys that are fed up to move on to something better. I would be very happy to move up the list and plan my future making 300% more than I make now.

Spectre, JBPA, bluejuice 787 and others..

Please don't post what you consider to be the negatives some where else as it's helpful for us wannabes to see both sides of the fence......
( as my therapist says it's OK to get it all out.... uke:

Any other projections on how many guys may bale from JB and resume recall rights from furloughs?
Thx,
Z

 

[IB6 UB9]

Finally, to the Blue Crew who'll likely tell me I should leave....I am looking elsewhere, especially given the circumstances of late.

Good. (you're senior to me! )

 

[bladeusa]

I could get by on that (above pay), besides I don't have time for golf, so that might balance out my other halfs spending......... where can I get her re programed so that she helps me save for retirement instead of living for the moment?

but you have to understand.. that is them.. at their senority in the company. what does your future look like ? taking into consideration growth, aircraft orders etc. FO pay on the E190 is alot different than status quo for a "senior" bus capt. i dont have a dog in this fight. i fly for a different carrier. just make sure you sit down and take a conservative realitic look at your future -both short and long term. you may be an fo for longer than you think. this is true for any airline. dont believe the hype, have realisitic expecations. good luck in your flying career where ever it is. and while i do say be your self.. still wouldnt hurt to keep the inner geek in check. CYA!

 

[thruthemurk]

Blade,

<<just make sure you sit down and take a conservative realitic look at your future -both short and long term. you may be an fo for longer than you think. >>


You have nailed it. There is only one seat out of 4 at jetblue that even remotely approaches a career-particularly when considering all of the non base pay issues. The other three seats pay less than anyone with reasonable time at a regional. The cuts in growth will draw more attention to the fact that most of the pilots here make sh!t wages. They gained a lot of mileage at JB by promising a quick upgrade on the bus along with pie in the sky option and stock purchase projections.


The reality of the Dave and David show is settling in and the unrest will grow unless they curb it. Next week will tell us a lot.