Jet Blue~thanks For The Open House Today (12dec06)!!!!!!!!

[400ADude]

Who won the ....... during the raffle at the end?

 

[TheBaron]

YOU GUYS PUT ON A NICE SHOW TODAY (12DEC06) AND HAVE A BEAUTIFUL FACILITY AT "JETBLUE U".
TO YOU BLUE WANNABES I STRONGLY SUGGEST YOU TRY TO GET TO ONE OF THE FUTURE OPEN HOUSE SHOWS IF YOU CAN.
LOT'S OF GOOD INFO TO HEAR AND FRIENDLY PEOPLE TO MEET!
NOT TO MENTION A GREAT TOUR OF THE TRAINING CENTER AND A 'FUN' POWER POINT SPEECH BY CAPT. CRAIG.......
ONCE AGAIN THANKS FOR HAVING US.........
AND A BIG
THANK YOU TO MS. V. KAY AND CAPT. PEHRSON FOR YOUR TIME.

Maybe I missed the checklist. Don't see any "share info with the others that could not make it" kind of gouge.

Capt Z.

Your appreciation did not go unnoticed...and don't pay attention to those that did not make the effort to attend...and enhance their chance to become part of 'good thing'...

Ski

See...your brown-nosing worked. That's the important thing; not what I think or smellycat thinks. Embrace the fact that you are a kiss @ss. If it gets you your dream job, good for you.

 

[Little Bubba]

HSC,

Just curious, what did you find that was too scary about JB?

C425Driver

Cleaning out the seat pockets (needles, diapers, etc.)

 

[Captzaahlie]

Maybe I missed the checklist. Don't see any "share info with the others that could not make it" kind of gouge.


I was extremely busy yesterday so I couldn't pass along much...........

One thing that I was not aware of was the fact that if you don't up date your resume every month the human resource people just don't think you are that interested in working there.....

Airbus deliveries will continue on schedule....

Aprox first year pay on the bus is: 50k

Aprox first year pay on the 190 is: 40k
time and a half over 70 hrs , avg line 80 some hours
A choice of picking your equipment type at least for a little while longer...

The blue terra chips would taste better with some melted cheese and salsa on them.

Most of this info is already out there if you do a search for it on this board.

Interviews will be given Feb 1st & 2nd aprox 350 new hires in 2007 (I need to check my notes on that(?)

Babies crying, and 4 year old is too quiet, so I need to run and see whats up but I'll look through my notes and see if there was anything else I learned and post latter.

I think the big thing was just getting some face time and letting Jetblue attach a face with the paper work. I you get a chance to attend one of these things it's time well spent.

Take care,
Z

 

[Splert]

Airbus deliveries will continue on schedule....

With possibly up to 5 additional A320s sold at the beginning of the 4th quarter of 2007.

Interviews will be given Feb 1st & 2nd aprox 350 new hires in 2007 (I need to check my notes on that(?)

Add to the 350 number an additional 150-250 due to attrition, IMO. I moved up 8 numbers again in December and that doesn't include those JR to me. I think it was close to 15 that ‘voluntarily separated’ during December.

imp:

 

[Spectre]

With possibly up to 5 additional A320s sold at the beginning of the 4th quarter of 2007.


Add to the 350 number an additional 150-250 due to attrition, IMO. I moved up 8 numbers again in December and that doesn't include those JR to me. I think it was close to 15 that ‘voluntarily separated’ during December.

imp:

So you are saying there will be at least a 10-15% attrition of pilots leaving JB. Sounds kind of high. Believe me, there is a far greater number of JB pilots turning down/deferring recall from their former legacy carriers (me included). Furthermore, how many JB pilots are retiring compared to legacies? If anyone is leaving, it's the E190 FO on lousy pay. Hopefully the pay issue will be addressed soon and those guys that left may be kicking themselves. So, you're probably not going to be moving up seniority that quick due to "attrition."

 

[samballs]

Smelly Cat I think your name says it all......

Happy Holidays to you just the same,

Capt. Z

PS: I was expecting a few flames, if I could'nt take it, I would'nt have posted a public thank you to the Jetblue University Team.... some of you guys just havent heard of "follow up" thank you letters have you?

PS#2: Just for the record because I know there will be a post concerning the subject soon to follow...............

I already do help my FA's straighten up the cabin on the really quick turns, one because I'm a nice guy and two because I married a "sky goddess" and she makes me do it . The training instructor that gave us a tour of the sims said I can skip that lesson when I'm accepted and go home early from class one week.............

Do they brain wash people from the moment they meet people "public thank you to the Jetblue University Team" its HR Not a university, University's don't slave their employees..

 

[flydoc]

So you are saying there will be at least a 10-15% attrition of pilots leaving JB. Sounds kind of high. Believe me, there is a far greater number of JB pilots turning down/deferring recall from their former legacy carriers (me included). Furthermore, how many JB pilots are retiring compared to legacies? If anyone is leaving, it's the E190 FO on lousy pay. Hopefully the pay issue will be addressed soon and those guys that left may be kicking themselves. So, you're probably not going to be moving up seniority that quick due to "attrition."

True, there are people deferring... However I have had 5 of last 6 furloughees I have flown with all say they are going back on the second go-around... (the sixth was former AA/TWA). These were not junior guys or 190 pilots. These were all 320 line-holding captains... Maybe my sampling is not a true representation of the pilot group, but it is what it is....

Just to be clear: all of these guys would rather stay should the company "do the right thing". There are a lot of positives to our company, but the constant lip service from the company when it comes to updating our compensation package, is wearing our patience thin. Most folks are all out of the "blue juice" and it now comes down to a pure business/QOL decision. Time will tell...

 

[bluejuice787]

True, there are people deferring... However I have had 5 of last 6 furloughees I have flown with all say they are going back on the second go-around... (the sixth was former AA/TWA). These were not junior guys or 190 pilots. These were all 320 line-holding captains... Maybe my sampling is not a true representation of the pilot group, but it is what it is....

Just to be clear: all of these guys would rather stay should the company "do the right thing". There are a lot of positives to our company, but the constant lip service from the company when it comes to updating our compensation package, is wearing our patience thin. Most folks are all out of the "blue juice" and it now comes down to a pure business/QOL decision. Time will tell...

Just look at my avatar...I am an example of a guy who came on board with a good attitude, the company,however, has drained the Blue from my juice. It is time for a new handle.

Seriously though, as a rather senior 320 guy I would easily recall if given the opportunity. The original poster says that the ratio of guys leaving to hiring is small...I have to call BS on that. We have an alarming number of guys/gals leaving for their former carrier or simply quitting the industry.

What was once great admiration for what appeared to be a crack leadership team now only is distain and disgust. Values my a$$.

Juice

 

[Splert]

So you are saying there will be at least a 10-15% attrition of pilots leaving JB. Sounds kind of high. Believe me, there is a far greater number of JB pilots turning down/deferring recall from their former legacy carriers (me included).

Spectre,

You maybe correct, time will tell. Have you resigned your number at your former carrier? When will you have to make the decision to resign or accept a recall. Deferring a recall with a opportunity later to accept is a good thing to have in your hip pocket but it really isn't a sign that people will not leave in greater numbers when they are only two option left; Stay or accept your final recall.

Someone posted the following from the UAL MEC:

Including the 4 December 2006, 8 January, 22 January and 5 February 2007 recall classes:
Total Offered Recall 2029
Total Furlough Status 139 (have not been offered recall)
Total Responses to date 1945
Recalled - Active or Accepted 654 33.6%
Recalled - LOA or LOA upon return 466 23.9%
Bypassed or Verbal Bypass 803 41.2%
Resigned 22 1.1%

Notice that after 2029 pilot were offered recall only 22 resigned. I doubt they work for jetBlue now, except Ms. B.S.

If anyone is leaving,

So, you don't believe people are leaving? WOW.

it's the E190 FO on lousy pay. Hopefully the pay issue will be addressed soon and those guys that left may be kicking themselves.

A320's FO and E190 CA have left in the past year.

For those that have not resigned their number, IMO, the decision to leave and accept a recall will be a difficult decision. The majority, IMO, will accept it rather than resign and stay a jetBlue.

So, you're probably not going to be moving up seniority that quick due to "attrition."

It's not about my senority. JetBlue is a great place to work. 2007 will tell us if many think jetblue is or isn't great place to spend a career.

 

[FlyAuburn]

Just look at my avatar...I am an example of a guy who came on board with a good attitude, the company,however, has drained the Blue from my juice. It is time for a new handle.

Seriously though, as a rather senior 320 guy I would easily recall if given the opportunity. The original poster says that the ratio of guys leaving to hiring is small...I have to call BS on that. We have an alarming number of guys/gals leaving for their former carrier or simply quitting the industry.

What was once great admiration for what appeared to be a crack leadership team now only is distain and disgust. Values my a$$.

Juice

Dude, I'm just curious. How bad has it been for you? What may be so bad for you, may be normal for others. Spill the beans on your horrible experiences.

 

[Spectre]

True, there are people deferring... However I have had 5 of last 6 furloughees I have flown with all say they are going back on the second go-around... (the sixth was former AA/TWA). These were not junior guys or 190 pilots. These were all 320 line-holding captains... Maybe my sampling is not a true representation of the pilot group, but it is what it is....

Just to be clear: all of these guys would rather stay should the company "do the right thing". There are a lot of positives to our company, but the constant lip service from the company when it comes to updating our compensation package, is wearing our patience thin. Most folks are all out of the "blue juice" and it now comes down to a pure business/QOL decision. Time will tell...

The only guys I'd see going back to a legacy are guys fed up with commutes and who would be able to live at their domiciles like Atlanta, Chicago, Denver, or Minneapolis upon recall. Any line holding Captain here on the A320 is pulling in at least $150K a year. Why else would you return to a legacy to be an FO making half the pay with no hopes of upgrades for 10-12 years and no pension? Only CAL and AMR would be attractive for recalls. It's really not as popular to go back to legacies as you think. NWA will be through call backs by the fall of 2007 and will probably be hiring off the street then as no one is going back.

I agree with you as patience is thin among some JetBlue pilots over compensation. Then again, it's pretty hard to justify pay raises when you are not making money. This is what got many legacy carriers in trouble. I'm just happy we haven't had any furloughs or pay cuts that other legacies experienced. We're really not that bad off.

In good times, the company will do the right thing. People here early on remember our 30% pay raise in October of 2001 and 17% profit sharing. It's when times are bad that we need more communication from management and that's not happening from upper management down to our chief pilots. Why such the secret from the pay group? Why not tell us what you proposed to management?

 

[elag777]

So you are saying there will be at least a 10-15% attrition of pilots leaving JB. Sounds kind of high. Believe me, there is a far greater number of JB pilots turning down/deferring recall from their former legacy carriers (me included). Furthermore, how many JB pilots are retiring compared to legacies? If anyone is leaving, it's the E190 FO on lousy pay. Hopefully the pay issue will be addressed soon and those guys that left may be kicking themselves. So, you're probably not going to be moving up seniority that quick due to "attrition."

190 pay will be fixed Jan 1, I think LCC will be mad with their starting rates on the 190 then

 

[Spectre]

Spectre,

You maybe correct, time will tell. Have you resigned your number at your former carrier? When will you have to make the decision to resign or accept a recall. Deferring a recall with a opportunity later to accept is a good thing to have in your hip pocket but it really isn't a sign that people will not leave in greater numbers when they are only two option left; Stay or accept your final recall.

Someone posted the following from the UAL MEC:

Notice that after 2029 pilot were offered recall only 22 resigned. I doubt they work for jetBlue now, except Ms. B.S.

So, you don't believe people are leaving? WOW.



A320's FO and E190 CA have left in the past year.

For those that have not resigned their number, IMO, the decision to leave and accept a recall will be a difficult decision. The majority, IMO, will accept it rather than resign and stay a jetBlue.

It's not about my senority. JetBlue is a great place to work. 2007 will tell us if many think jetblue is or isn't great place to spend a career.

Great information. Notice only 33% have jumped at going back to UAL though. Others are on LOA or have deferred their recall. I believe the only guys who would go back if recalled are FOs here at JB. That is why JB management has to increase pay for these guys. Myself as a Captain on the bus working my arse off am pulling in $160-170K a year. There's no way I'd go back to NWA to fly as an FO on the DC-9 (I don't think I could fly steam gauges again). There is negative growth at NWA. Therefore, only movement up is due to retirements of about 200/year. That would make me a Captain on the DC-9 in about 10-12 years. Furthermore, the pension there is frozen. That's why the grass is not greener for me. You can say about the same for UAL, LCC, and DAL. If there is another industry downturn, these companies will not blink at furloughing you again. It's happened to several here already who have left JB and been furloughed again. Why trade my top 20% seniority to be bottom 5% seniority? Better schedules here and not on reserve.

I was recalled last month by NWA for a January training class. I've deferred the maximum allowed of 3 months. NWA only allows for 3 months of deferral time after the most junior pilot is on the property. To get the maximum time of 4 years, you have to prove you are in a contract that you can't get out of. Therefore, my resignation will probably happen around summer of 2007. Deferring recall is a free insurance policy and no pilot should resign their number until the deferral period is up. DAL is more generous with up to 7 years deferral from recall.

Again, our only true concern is 50% of the pilots here at JB and those are the FO's. Upgrade times here are still more attractive than at legacies. The climate could all change with upcoming mergers too. Who knows what will happen to seniority lists and furloughed status after a merger. It will be a tough choice for some, but not for me as whether or not to return. But, if you are going to go back, better to be on the property before the merger rather than after...

 

[thruthemurk]

Spectre,

I agree with many of the points in your post, particulary with regard to keeping options open as long as possible. If you are a top 20% A-320 Captain - it would obviously be hard to come anywhere close to your current pay and benefits by returning to your legacy. If on the other hand you are in any of the other three seats it is pretty easy to immediately make more money by going back - even to a narrow body right seat. Especially when looking at all compensation - not just hourly pay. The spectre of many years in the right seat obviously looms - but usually at enough money to feed your family and actually prepare for retirement even if you never upgrade.

This is definitely not the case at Jetblue. If you are not a line holding 320 CA the jobs pay significantly less than their counterparts anywhere - unless you count the regionals. In fact many regional captains driving 50 seat jets will make more than 100 seat jet captains at Jetblue. Unless the rumored raise is close to 20$/hr or more this will continue to be the case.

I know of at least 6 E190 Captains that have quit JetBLue over the last several months. While it may be expected for junior FO's to leave - this occurence places Jetblue in line with regional airlines who have CA's leave for "real jobs".

On a second note - what furloughees have left Jetblue and returned to their previous carrier to be furloughed again? I am not aware of any of the legacies furloughing again in the last couple of years.

Lastly, your comment regarding the future with regard to mergers is a very salient point. The past few years have shown that if you are with a legacy, chances are you will maintain a job in some fashion - even if the company spends three years in bankruptcy or is absorbed by another! I don't believe that same prognosis applies to JetBlue, and the biggest threat to remaining at JB is a hostile merger or managment missteps that drive the company out of business. In either case most if not all of the pilots could find themselves on the street with not much in the way of prospects.